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[118.6] Recurring Opportunity removal

First post First post First post
Author
Titanium Seagull
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#321 - 2016-06-29 05:30:44 UTC
Neadayan Drakhon wrote:
[
Yes, skill trading exists, but it shouldn't.

Skill trading should be completely removed from the game, it should never have been introduced.


I would like to reiterate this. Skill trading turned this into a Pay-to-Win game even more than the initial attempt to get rid of gold farmers by introducing PLEX did. It was the last barrier between allowing cash-rich players from dominating the game versus people who invested time into it.

I know monetizing a game that's been around this long is hard, I really get it, but damn guys. I remember how pissed people were at the microtransaction introduction with walking in stations. I can't believe this happened. Every forum I'm reading talks about how you 'shouldn't mission farm' or manufacture or station trade or hunt rats, you should just 'buy PLEX and have fun instead.'

I don't even know where to start with how much of a problem I have with that attitude.
Jay DeHeega
Noobs for Ethical Treatment of Scrubs
Tactical Narcotics Team
#322 - 2016-06-29 06:30:43 UTC
JohnnyRingo wrote:
Please do not remove this feature, this is excellent for newer players to get a little jump in skills, which can mean a lot to newer players. The "instant" reward is a nice draw, should honestly be more of this to encourage activity, you should expand this with some events for newer players to be active and get rewards for being active, skill training is the biggest barrier for newer players and this does really help with that.


This ^^

A friend told me about this game, during this "test", and I loved this feature - it lead me to upgrading my trial account to 6 months. Now I regret upgrading tbh, catching up with friends is really hard in this game (imho).
Benjan Hakaari
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#323 - 2016-06-29 06:42:47 UTC
Howsa bout giving SP along with bounties, the more you kill, the more you get. The toon is getting experience, reward them with SP also. Certainly not 10K a pop, but a number like 1% of the bounty, value, whatever.
LUH-3417 Ormand
Gallente Distribution Manufacturing Mining
#324 - 2016-06-29 06:56:12 UTC  |  Edited by: LUH-3417 Ormand
This definitely got me to log in, and get out of station every day - where I normally wouldn't. I was sad when I noticed that it was gone today. It was literally the only reason I logged on tonight. VERY disappointed to see you give up on the feature without having something to replace it.

Meanwhile, after almost a year of skill grinding, I’m no closer to buying skill injectors than I am to building a citadel. So THAT’S a useless “feature” for new players who aren’t sure if they want to continue to pay for a game they barely understand after a year of playing.

Veteran players can buy skill injectors for MASSIVE skill boosts, and it sounds like newbros will get to keep the daily skill bonus in some fashion down the road. Just please don’t forget about us “tweener” players. There are some months where it’s hard to justify the expense of maintaining a game that I have no reason to open for days on end. The daily reward may not have been eloquent, but it was certainly effective.

Oh, and while I have your attention CCP, planetary interaction is seriously overdue for an overhaul. It’s clunky and ambiguous when compared to the precision found in the rest of the game. It has tremendous potential to open up new facets of gameplay, especially for people who are more into strategy and sim style gaming.
Kilo Kodiak
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#325 - 2016-06-29 07:11:27 UTC
o k ....

i would like the fact that you as in ccp is bending the knee to new player but having aids to help them in learning this game were as the old time players get shafted.

you may think it just a issue which was not very important. during the month of this it show as you the player logged in... you got rewarded.

the idea of a skill injector in which only grants 150,000 skill point which cost a plex is well WRONG...

the idea of logging in and undocking a station which you can lost your ship and to find a npc to kill for the reward of the 10,000 skill points was great. this event you are placing it all on is like walking in stations? 514? the others.. what do the staff have to offer the long time player to get on and play?

my answer was the skill bonus which you now killed.

I have a idea for a test? plexs are free? which is just like this maner...

see to see if the numbers would return or.. hand billions to new characters.

as I have stated what do you have which a old player would wish to log in every day and do. when the skills end up being in 14 plus days... the events are not going get me to jump at.

oh a new ship which cost billions ... wrong

ccp give me back the hunt..
HellmeT Creed
SundogZ Corperation
#326 - 2016-06-29 08:00:27 UTC
You know I only just bought into this game and I just worked out how much SP I've lost with you guys removing the hunt..

That would be 3080000 skill points gone I would have had over the year or 11 months I have left.

Really am wondering about a refund now :(
Nerath Naaris
Pink Winged Unicorns for Peace Love and Anarchy
#327 - 2016-06-29 08:04:04 UTC
Not really a great fan of this method from the start and definitely not sad to see it gone.

That said, I must admit I did collect those 10k SP.... usually by doing a 5 minute L2 mission between breakfast and shower.
I did log in more often, daily, obviously, but as I stayed in my +5 implant clone in my remote corner of the galaxy, I actually might have missed out some less routine "action" in my combat clone elsewhere. I other words, I farmed daily instead of playing occasionally. So yeah, bye! (don´t come back)

Je suis Paris // Köln // Brüssel // Orlando // Nice // Würzburg, München, Ansbach // Saint-Étienne-du-Rouvray

Je suis Berlin // Fort Lauderdale // London // St. Petersburg // Stockholm

Je suis [?]

Colorless Void
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#328 - 2016-06-29 08:52:40 UTC
NPE NPE NPE...

new players come and go.. some grow into older players..

The reason your login numbers are dwindling are because you fail at customer retention with ideas like "lets give people skillpoints for doing something" and then deciding "hey you know what.. we take that back".


The game has seen many people that have played for years.. and while it's exciting to see new features added...

CCP as a company has a tendency of COMPLETELY OVERHAULING THE ENTIRE GAME anytime they introduce one of these features, which results in situations where say hey - I spent 8 months training for something that was suited to the game.. then they changed the game and all that time spent training is now WORTHLESS to me.

Jump fatigue by itself was an interesting concept.. but you didn't just do that.. Amarr Carrier V used to mean I could launch a 10th fighter without drone control units.


Now it means I get 4% resists and stronger neut fighters. Gee wouldn't I like to apply the skill points I invested from amarr carrier IV to V somewhere else.

I had one character trained specficially for a sleipnir.. which didn't give much to warfare links before a change a couple years ago..i didn't feel bad about not having leadership skills. It was a beast of a ship that I hoped to pewpew in, trained Command Ship V for, then you completely change how command ships work, making all of them booster ships, making them worthless without them.. and I have not flown a sleipnir since. Heck I quit for 2 years after that.

Our time is spent paying for these skillpoints and you can't get 8 months back after you guys decide to make huge changes to the game.. and that over the years has been one reason that keeps me from staying subscribed to EvE, it feels like the time I invest into it is constantly being made to be useless. Especially considering the amount of time required to be well rounded enough to fly whatever ships become doctrine after you *insert nerf here*


NPE should not be as important as customer retention.. and I feel the vocal minority is having such an effect that the silent majority either just play or in what seems to be a lot of cases.. choose to no longer play.

I have two older characters with millions and millions of sp.. and I liked this feature.. I enjoyed watching seeing hours knocked off my queue, I enjoyed training a skill over a week that wasn't in my queue.

My characters were perfect for the Eve I used to know.. but now I have a character with Amarr Carrier V and I'm not too impressed with the benefits of the time it took to train that skill with the current carrier bonuses. I also have a charactor with command ships V that won't be flying a command ship ANY time soon because they are different than the Eve i used to know.

You keep changing your game to make the vocal minority happy.. and then wonder why you can't hold subscriptions and your dailly logins go down as a result.



Sulfurblade
Evil Pink Bunnies
#329 - 2016-06-29 11:20:33 UTC
Colorless Void wrote:
NPE NPE NPE...

new players come and go.. some grow into older players..

The reason your login numbers are dwindling are because you fail at customer retention with ideas like "lets give people skillpoints for doing something" and then deciding "hey you know what.. we take that back".


The game has seen many people that have played for years.. and while it's exciting to see new features added...

CCP as a company has a tendency of COMPLETELY OVERHAULING THE ENTIRE GAME anytime they introduce one of these features, which results in situations where say hey - I spent 8 months training for something that was suited to the game.. then they changed the game and all that time spent training is now WORTHLESS to me.

Jump fatigue by itself was an interesting concept.. but you didn't just do that.. Amarr Carrier V used to mean I could launch a 10th fighter without drone control units.


Now it means I get 4% resists and stronger neut fighters. Gee wouldn't I like to apply the skill points I invested from amarr carrier IV to V somewhere else.

I had one character trained specficially for a sleipnir.. which didn't give much to warfare links before a change a couple years ago..i didn't feel bad about not having leadership skills. It was a beast of a ship that I hoped to pewpew in, trained Command Ship V for, then you completely change how command ships work, making all of them booster ships, making them worthless without them.. and I have not flown a sleipnir since. Heck I quit for 2 years after that.

Our time is spent paying for these skillpoints and you can't get 8 months back after you guys decide to make huge changes to the game.. and that over the years has been one reason that keeps me from staying subscribed to EvE, it feels like the time I invest into it is constantly being made to be useless. Especially considering the amount of time required to be well rounded enough to fly whatever ships become doctrine after you *insert nerf here*


NPE should not be as important as customer retention.. and I feel the vocal minority is having such an effect that the silent majority either just play or in what seems to be a lot of cases.. choose to no longer play.

I have two older characters with millions and millions of sp.. and I liked this feature.. I enjoyed watching seeing hours knocked off my queue, I enjoyed training a skill over a week that wasn't in my queue.

My characters were perfect for the Eve I used to know.. but now I have a character with Amarr Carrier V and I'm not too impressed with the benefits of the time it took to train that skill with the current carrier bonuses. I also have a charactor with command ships V that won't be flying a command ship ANY time soon because they are different than the Eve i used to know.

You keep changing your game to make the vocal minority happy.. and then wonder why you can't hold subscriptions and your dailly logins go down as a result.





Very Well Said!!!! +1000
Martha Farcle
League of the Shieldy
SLYCE Pirates
#330 - 2016-06-29 13:29:49 UTC
CCP Rise,

As a "casual" player of Eve, I was very fond of the daily opportunities, and and used them on every account I had every day. I miss them greatly as I, and others view this as a way for a "new" player to develop their skills faster to get to a point where they can compete with the players who have played the game for longer periods, giving them much higher SP totals. PLEASE bring them back either in the form of the current kill mission, or a rotating set of missions that we can do daily.

Thanks for your time,

Martha
Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#331 - 2016-06-29 13:34:42 UTC
I gotta say, the only thing I like about this idea is all the tears I'm harvesting from this thread. Great work CCP!

Highsec is owned by players now. Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory. All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey The Code. Mining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com

Kilo Kodiak
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#332 - 2016-06-29 18:28:55 UTC
Sulfurblade wrote:
Colorless Void wrote:
NPE NPE NPE...

new players come and go.. some grow into older players..

The reason your login numbers are dwindling are because you fail at customer retention with ideas like "lets give people skillpoints for doing something" and then deciding "hey you know what.. we take that back".


The game has seen many people that have played for years.. and while it's exciting to see new features added...

CCP as a company has a tendency of COMPLETELY OVERHAULING THE ENTIRE GAME anytime they introduce one of these features, which results in situations where say hey - I spent 8 months training for something that was suited to the game.. then they changed the game and all that time spent training is now WORTHLESS to me.

Jump fatigue by itself was an interesting concept.. but you didn't just do that.. Amarr Carrier V used to mean I could launch a 10th fighter without drone control units.


Now it means I get 4% resists and stronger neut fighters. Gee wouldn't I like to apply the skill points I invested from amarr carrier IV to V somewhere else.

I had one character trained specficially for a sleipnir.. which didn't give much to warfare links before a change a couple years ago..i didn't feel bad about not having leadership skills. It was a beast of a ship that I hoped to pewpew in, trained Command Ship V for, then you completely change how command ships work, making all of them booster ships, making them worthless without them.. and I have not flown a sleipnir since. Heck I quit for 2 years after that.

Our time is spent paying for these skillpoints and you can't get 8 months back after you guys decide to make huge changes to the game.. and that over the years has been one reason that keeps me from staying subscribed to EvE, it feels like the time I invest into it is constantly being made to be useless. Especially considering the amount of time required to be well rounded enough to fly whatever ships become doctrine after you *insert nerf here*


NPE should not be as important as customer retention.. and I feel the vocal minority is having such an effect that the silent majority either just play or in what seems to be a lot of cases.. choose to no longer play.

I have two older characters with millions and millions of sp.. and I liked this feature.. I enjoyed watching seeing hours knocked off my queue, I enjoyed training a skill over a week that wasn't in my queue.

My characters were perfect for the Eve I used to know.. but now I have a character with Amarr Carrier V and I'm not too impressed with the benefits of the time it took to train that skill with the current carrier bonuses. I also have a charactor with command ships V that won't be flying a command ship ANY time soon because they are different than the Eve i used to know.

You keep changing your game to make the vocal minority happy.. and then wonder why you can't hold subscriptions and your dailly logins go down as a result.





Very Well Said!!!! +1000

very good and stated well
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#333 - 2016-06-29 20:17:58 UTC
Sulfurblade wrote:
Colorless Void wrote:
*snip*



Very Well Said!!!! +1000

Not well said at all, since Command Ships actually got their DPS increased in nearly every single case even with the links change. And in many cases carrier DPS has increased. And they launch 30 fighters at a time now. Not a mere 10.
Complaining over perception when a players perception is very different from reality does not a good case make. Back your case up with objective numbers and CCP may listen a bit more to it.

Anyway, back onto the pertinent topic, CCP should not be afraid to remove a bad feature, which recurring opportunities was.
It may have been shiny, but it was against EVE's ethos of passive skill gain without the need to grind, and utterly failed in it's stated objectives to increase concurrent log ins. So removing it was appropriate.
Fadlmaster DerFadelige
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#334 - 2016-06-29 20:18:56 UTC
Hi,

Actually, yes it motivated me to login.
Because with 25m skillpoints i still have the feeling that i lack so much of the needed abilities for shipmodules, that those free points really apply well for skills that are off from standart. Like the charisma skills and drones.

And for players less than 25m sp the motivation is for sure bigger, because the wanted ship or tech 2 weapon is now like a month closer.

Of course i understand the a person with 80m+ sp does not care about this.., i wouldn´t either.

Please bring them back for the "new" players, i mean you can bring this in many forms back to live and still find a way to creat some daylies which are interesting/rewarding for seasoned players,
And when i think about it there could be hard daylies, which you could only do with a certain "skilllevel", which would be even more encouraging to do the extra sp daylies for new players to get there.

But maybe you just dont care about new/semi new players.

BR
Fadl
Kalen Blackstar
Silver Sun Republic
Silent Infinity
#335 - 2016-06-29 20:38:45 UTC
This feature got me to log on more than I was. Some times it was just a blip, because that is all I had time for... but other times something interesting caught my eye and I stayed on, chatted with corp mates, and had a good time. Almost every day I saw someone in chat say the same.

While I think that the system could be improved to make it more appealing to a wider group, I am sad to see it go. As a few others have said, please stop dangling the carrot and then pulling it away.

The new Event system looks interesting, but that is vastly different than the immediate reward of this feature. Scan down and destroy 5 sites? That's not something that most people are going to do, and if they do, it's going to take some time. Kill 10 Guards? Is that any Serpentis Guards, or just the ones at the sites that I have to scan down? And those only give me 5% of the points needed for a bronze reward... which is what exactly? Don't get me wrong, I like this too, but while this may give me a goal for the days that I have hours to dedicate to eve, it surely doesn't encourage me to log on the way the recurring opportunities did.

LUH-3417 Ormand
Gallente Distribution Manufacturing Mining
#336 - 2016-06-29 21:05:28 UTC
It's safe to say that quite a few old players don't like any new players. Why don't we just put them in their own server, and let them be all alone like they want? Almost all of the changes that are being made (skill injectors, citidels, cap ships, etc) are all for old players. Why can't you people shut up about what CCP does to retain new players? More players means more revenue, which means more devs and hardware, which means more pew pew fun. Relax you old farts, the game won't die just because new players have more incentive to stay... TRUST.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
Brave Collective
#337 - 2016-06-29 21:52:58 UTC
LUH-3417 Ormand wrote:
It's safe to say that quite a few old players don't like any new players. Why don't we just put them in their own server, and let them be all alone like they want? Almost all of the changes that are being made (skill injectors, citidels, cap ships, etc) are all for old players. Why can't you people shut up about what CCP does to retain new players? More players means more revenue, which means more devs and hardware, which means more pew pew fun. Relax you old farts, the game won't die just because new players have more incentive to stay... TRUST.


Envy is one of the 7 sins. Do not envy what others have but make your own story.

And this is what you get for being a rude youngling.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

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Vailen Sere
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#338 - 2016-06-29 22:48:49 UTC
Neadayan Drakhon wrote:
Skipper Riddles wrote:
Let the new KID fix the problem. A positive solution to a real problem.

We all know that SP is the real Golden Egg the goose lays. Especially for players under 4 years. So we can assume that SP is going to be the real gravitational pull to bring people back into the game consistently. The real issue is how do we deploy this. In the Milky way Galaxy people are becoming lazy with an entitlement factor. We want something for nothing. But in reality to incorporate that into your real time business plan will always lead to certain failure. In New Eden pilots do not have the luxury we have adopted here on earth. If you don't work for it, you don't get it. So this plan not only fits your current game design, but also insists pilots do a little more for the rewards.

I have developed the KID & KIS system...

KID
knowledge Injection Device
KID100
KID150
KID200
KID300
KID500
offering SP respective to the number listed after KID so the KID300 injects 300SP directly to the pilots unallocated SP pool.

Can be found in certain containers in-

Combat sites
Occasionally found by extractors during PI
Looted during data site encounters.
Special reward doing missions - R&D offering an enhanced version.
Once found and looted the result is immediately added as unallocated SP the KID cannot be transported, sold or traded.
Once the KID is handled, the electronic stasis field becomes disabled and the countdown timer of 30 seconds begins if the KID can not make a connection to the KIS, (if a pilot has not purchased one, it will self-destruct after the 30-second timer runs out.)

To avoid exploitation of this device it cannot be dropped during any PVP activity.
(Deployment to the pilot must be contained to a decision making process within your network NPC logic algorithms.)


Works in tandem with-
KIS port - knowledge Injection Service Port.

tech I, tech II, and prototype each capable of wider band width respectively. Will be lost if the clone is killed and will need to be purchased again. Without this clone enhancement, KID will not function and be considered lost or wasted. tech I can allow connections with KID100 and KID150. tech II can make a connection with KID100, KID150, KID200. prototype has full band width and can handle all KID devices. The KIS can be found, built, sold, and traded. This service port should not be expensive, just a requirement for the KID to connect to through neural transceivers. figuring the price at 3 million, 6 million, and 12 million ISK and requires no special skills to be implanted in the clone.

A new twist...

Any pilot with a negative eight nine or ten standings cannot purchase the KIS interpreter anywhere in New Eden and must rely on finding the device on their own in a data site. KIS units can be found and sold on the market or to anyone with a -6 or higher standing. But the KID### can only be deployed through your NPC system.
Pilots with a -10 standing should be considered sanctioned and that port or pathway is shut down or closed until standings higher than -10. Any attempt to make such a connection on a closed or sanctioned port KIS will cause the KID device to self destruct.

The numbers I used need to be changed to fit your balancing routine and a CAP of some value will also need to be assessed & implemented. Hoping because of the additional playtime, the CAP will be higher than 10,000SP

This is a basic structure for your DEV teams. This may take some work, but as stated earlier; "In New Eden, if you don't work for it, you don't get it"

CCP if you want the full scoop, please contact me personally. Skipper

Interesting and well thought out idea, however, no, passive training is the only way SP should be gained in EVE.


John Terence Kelly wrote:
Add a small amount of SP (less than 50) per NPC kill scaled by the tier/eliteness of the NPC like bounties are. If you want to grind SP you can, but make the amount per kill roughly equate the 10k SP we used to get per day if you play something like 2-3 hours a day. Instead of a 3 second belt rat kill this at least would require sustained farming, ammo usage, risk, etc.

No

I agree.
Gains to passive SP per hour linked to activity would be more ideal in my oppinion, cap it at a certain amount so it rewards actual activity in game.
Titanium Seagull
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#339 - 2016-06-30 01:42:51 UTC
LUH-3417 Ormand wrote:
It's safe to say that quite a few old players don't like any new players. Why don't we just put them in their own server, and let them be all alone like they want? Almost all of the changes that are being made (skill injectors, citidels, cap ships, etc) are all for old players. Why can't you people shut up about what CCP does to retain new players? More players means more revenue, which means more devs and hardware, which means more pew pew fun. Relax you old farts, the game won't die just because new players have more incentive to stay... TRUST.


Eve is a playground for ultra powerful old characters and people willing to spend a lot of money to become just like those old characters. Citadels, cap ships, those are cool whatever I get that avoiding endgame is important in a game like Eve. Hell, even as much as I hate PLEX, it lets people who put a lot of effort into the game be able to reap real world benefit from it, which is cool.

Yet skill injectors are essentially only useful for people with a lot of disposable income or skillpoints. In other words, old characters or pay-to-win people. The dailies were basically useful for everyone except the already ultra-old characters. They created some awesome opportunity.

It's clear that CCP doesn't value NPE so much as the 'big fish' strategy that social gaming companies like.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
Brave Collective
#340 - 2016-06-30 01:46:47 UTC
Vailen Sere wrote:
I agree.
Gains to passive SP per hour linked to activity would be more ideal in my oppinion, cap it at a certain amount so it rewards actual activity in game.


The best solution is to give all new accounts all skillpoints and 300 purple fit titans and motherships, which they can go collect all over nullsec stations.

ezpz. The fittings are in the 4 outer ring system of New Eden.

The only thing is that they cannot use the market until they lost all of the titans and motherships and purple mods.

The End.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever