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Flight Simulator - Training, Fit Testing and Dueling Simulation
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Arkoth 24
Doomheim
#1 - 2016-06-23 09:36:07 UTC
First off all: i don't own the idea. I just saw it in few random topics. I like it, i see it's potential and i want to put it to proper forum section. I don't remember now who was it's author, sorry.

The main suggestion is to add a holo-simulator to captain quarters. It should provide access to virtual fitting service with all existing modules and ammo, all hulls and customizable skill set, so even 1-day-old newbie capsuleer may try every ship and every module.


Goals:

- better new pilot experience and integration into the world of New Eden with no months of skill training and no fear to loose an expensive ship;

- testing service, so people may try new fit and see how it works in combat;

- virtual duels between capsuleers with no ISK loses (but with no profit either) for new pilots training, ship testing and entertainment purposes;

- user-driving competitions and tournaments.


Tech details:

Creating an "instance area" for one or more pilots where "virtual fight" may be made without fear of loses and security restrictions.

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Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#2 - 2016-06-23 09:37:41 UTC
Arkoth 24
Doomheim
#3 - 2016-06-23 09:44:32 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
/thread

I doubt you even read.

How many newbies you see on test servers? Do they have access to every ship, module and skill there, or have an infinite ammount of ISK to buy 'em?

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Lan Wang
African Atomic.
Dreadnought Diplomacy.
#4 - 2016-06-23 09:47:02 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
sisi /thread.


I think a more promoted stance from ccp on the actual test server would be a good idea, as said not a lot of people know about sisi when they start the game and its such a great tool

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MaxaOhbka
Falcorre's Lair
#5 - 2016-06-23 09:57:22 UTC
I just like that idea. Pirate
Black Pedro
Mine.
#6 - 2016-06-23 10:08:11 UTC
Arkoth 24 wrote:
Creating an "instance area" for one or more pilots where "virtual fight" may be made without fear of loses and security restrictions.
I'm pretty sure instanced areas and consequence-free fights are the anti-thesis of the fundamental design of the game. I don't see CCP adding such features any time soon.

That said I am all for "ghost fitting" and other in-game tools to bring some of what Pyfa and EFT do to newer players. It's not always easy to know which flavour of railgun has the most range, or what effect another heat sink will have on a fit for a new player. But if you want to test the fit in combat just go duel your friend. If you want to use it in a tournament, just go set up a tournament or enter one of the existing player-run tournaments.

I also think there might be a case for some "virtual fights" during the NPE so new players get a sense of combat in Eve and see some of the bigger ships in a fleet setting. But otherwise no. If you want to fly something, then fly it or go mess around on the test server. CCP just made it much more accessible to log in there with the new launcher. There is no need to undermine the gravitas of the entire game because you are too cheap or scared to undock in something.

-1

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Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#7 - 2016-06-23 10:25:14 UTC
Arkoth 24 wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
/thread

I doubt you even read.

How many newbies you see on test servers? Do they have access to every ship, module and skill there, or have an infinite ammount of ISK to buy 'em?

CCP give free sp for participation in the mass tests they regularly run.
Every ship and item on the test server barr faction/deadspace/officer are seeded in every station at a cost of 100isk.

Sisi is exactly what you are looking for , use it.

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Arkoth 24
Doomheim
#8 - 2016-06-23 10:42:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Arkoth 24
Black Pedro wrote:
There is no need to undermine the gravitas of the entire game because you are too cheap or scared to undock in something.

So, if someone wants to know which super-carrier is the best for him should he wait for few years and few billions of ISK to try 'em all and mess around with friends? Should he learn to fly something first time in real combat, 'cause there's no other options for him?

Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Sisi is exactly what you are looking for , use it.

I don't want to call test servers useless and i don't want to ask to change the basical principies of sand-box in EvE for sure - i'm still here because EvE is challenging and makes people work hard to get anything.

But there's a difference between hardcore and unnecessary dificulties. And personally i'll be glad to see this part of EvE to be more newbie-friendly and... fun?

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Chopper Rollins
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2016-06-23 10:53:19 UTC
Arkoth 24 wrote:
- better new pilot experience and integration into the world of New Eden with no months of skill training and no fear to loose an expensive ship;.


It's the months of training and simulated risk of loss that make it fun.
You want to turn my spaecships into Pong.
No.



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Arkoth 24
Doomheim
#10 - 2016-06-23 11:01:53 UTC
Chopper Rollins wrote:
You want to turn my spaecships into Pong.

I want to turn your years of training and moneymaking, and your feeling of how special you are into nothing.

Such a bastard i am.

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Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#11 - 2016-06-23 11:04:14 UTC
Arkoth 24 wrote:
Chopper Rollins wrote:
You want to turn my spaecships into Pong.

I want to turn your years of training and moneymaking, and your feeling of how special you are into nothing.

Such a bastard i am.

no you want to make eve , not eve .

don't be that guy.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

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Arkoth 24
Doomheim
#12 - 2016-06-23 11:13:24 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
no you want to make eve , not eve .

don't be that guy.

Nope. I like EvE as it is. I just want to make it a bit more comfortable.

C'mon, pilots and racers got training simulators. No one kicks man into space without training on simulators. People got simulators of everything - and no simulators to fly spacecrafts in EvE?

It's just like "no f@#cken duct tape on Mars", you know.

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Black Pedro
Mine.
#13 - 2016-06-23 11:15:52 UTC
Arkoth 24 wrote:
Black Pedro wrote:
There is no need to undermine the gravitas of the entire game because you are too cheap or scared to undock in something.

So, if someone wants to know which super-carrier is the best for him should he wait for few years and few billions of ISK to try 'em all and mess around with friends? Should he learn to fly something first time in real combat, 'cause there's no other options for him?


Probably. It seems that it has more meaning that way.

I am not sure how you would know what super-carrier "is best" from sitting in it. You can already examine the model in detail and all the stats are available in the fitting tools. I am not sure what you think you would learn from flying it in some simulator.

Otherwise, if you are flying a super-carrier (or whatever) for the first time, just set up a time to do some sparring with your corp or alliance. It's always good to practice with ships and there is no reason you can't do so. Or if it is anything but a super-carrier or titan, just practice on the test server. With skill extractors, you can test anything these days.

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Arkoth 24
Doomheim
#14 - 2016-06-23 11:20:33 UTC
Black Pedro wrote:
With skill extractors...

Don't. Even. Start.

Please.

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Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#15 - 2016-06-23 11:26:33 UTC
Arkoth 24 wrote:
Black Pedro wrote:
With skill extractors...

Don't. Even. Start.

Please.

You realise thats exactly how we feel about this damn thread, and the last one, and the one before that.

Honestly, sisi . Use it.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

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Arkoth 24
Doomheim
#16 - 2016-06-23 12:00:37 UTC
After developing skill points for money... err... okay, for ISK, and daily missions, making instances looks like not a big deal for making "EvE to be not EvE", huh.

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Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#17 - 2016-06-23 12:06:04 UTC
They've also given free skill injectors on sisi. Or opened test servers where all chars have every skill to 5.

You dont need a new simulator, just a way to quick train on test servers more often.

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darkneko
Come And Get Your Love
#18 - 2016-06-23 13:53:11 UTC
The reason they do not promote the test server or even give you everything on the test server is because they want you to actually play the game. That's also why they don't keep much of your player progress on the test server.

if you could go on the test server and do whatever you want(have any skills or ships and fly with out danger) why would you want to play on the real server... and then of course the test server would get boring since you have nothing to work towards.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#19 - 2016-06-23 14:14:28 UTC
darkneko wrote:
The reason they do not promote the test server or even give you everything on the test server is because they want you to actually play the game. That's also why they don't keep much of your player progress on the test server.

if you could go on the test server and do whatever you want(have any skills or ships and fly with out danger) why would you want to play on the real server... and then of course the test server would get boring since you have nothing to work towards.


I can answer that because I did spend a lot of time there and there even developed a community on their own. We help the devs out, when they suddenly appear and ask for volunteers to try something.

I always liked helping CCP Karkur or CCP Habakuk or fighting CCP Denormalize's purple fit Barghests Big smile

And of course the alliance tournament!


Do you know how much time the tournament teams spend on the test server to try new or old compositions to get ahead?

You need months of training to have your setup work in a 10 minute fight. You need to time things and you need to be prepared for everything you might face.
Sometimes even new metas are created there - I know because I was one of them to create one.

Where do you thing I do my field testing when I have a theory I want to try out? I don't pull my fits out of my exhaust pipe. I try things, change things until I like it.

So does everyone else I know too. And having the benefit of trying out new toys before they hit on TQ.

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darkneko
Come And Get Your Love
#20 - 2016-06-23 14:30:31 UTC
elitatwo wrote:
darkneko wrote:
The reason they do not promote the test server or even give you everything on the test server is because they want you to actually play the game. That's also why they don't keep much of your player progress on the test server.

if you could go on the test server and do whatever you want(have any skills or ships and fly with out danger) why would you want to play on the real server... and then of course the test server would get boring since you have nothing to work towards.


I can answer that because I did spend a lot of time there and there even developed a community on their own. We help the devs out, when they suddenly appear and ask for volunteers to try something.

I always liked helping CCP Karkur or CCP Habakuk or fighting CCP Denormalize's purple fit Barghests Big smile

And of course the alliance tournament!


Do you know how much time the tournament teams spend on the test server to try new or old compositions to get ahead?

You need months of training to have your setup work in a 10 minute fight. You need to time things and you need to be prepared for everything you might face.
Sometimes even new metas are created there - I know because I was one of them to create one.

Where do you thing I do my field testing when I have a theory I want to try out? I don't pull my fits out of my exhaust pipe. I try things, change things until I like it.

So does everyone else I know too. And having the benefit of trying out new toys before they hit on TQ.


um... your whole argument was about you spending lots of time on the test server when that's what i said would happen if people had even more to work with.

i'm not saying being on the test server is wrong but i bet ccp doesn't want to give people even more of a reason to be on it i bet since they keep it down to conserve server power.
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