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To become a capsuleer (an alternate NPE proposal)

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Indahmawar Fazmarai
#1 - 2016-05-25 13:54:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Indahmawar Fazmarai
Probably you know or are aware on CCP's plans to improve the NPE (New Player Experience) in order to improve the retention rate of EVE.

The plan, which hasn't been exposed in depth, is to follow the guidelines explained by CCP Ghost: involve the new player with a narrative that explains the lore background of empires and makes him feel valuable for the Empire of his choice as he becomes valuable for other players by acquiring knowledge on EVE.

In my opinion, the whole idea ir briliantly wrong. Using a story to entice the players is briliant. But NPC empires are grossly irrelevant in EVE, and such narrative will lead players into finding that their tutorial experience is bullshit.

So here's my suggestion for a better narrative, a better story:

IMO CCP should fall down to the very basic and let the new players experience a story about becoming a capsuleer, taking as a player the role of a ordinary human who becomes a capsuleer. New players don't need to be in Tranquility to fly a ship, jump through a gate, shoot an asteroid or fit a module. All those could be learned "off-server", in a dedicated tutorial server with GM and ISD support (but no SP nor ISK earning in TQ, like Sisi). After finishing the tutorial, the player would "become a capsuleer" and join Tranquility with roughly the same ISK/SP as they do now.

Now imagine the emotional impact of the moment the novice pilot/player has finished his training (knows how to fly, how to navigate, to fit a module, et etera) and presses a button to kill himself and be transfered to his new capsuleer body... marking the transition from the "off-server" training environment to Tranquility.

Also, that would be the moment when he would be allowed to create his avatar, choose his race, gender, et cetera. The first thing a new player should be doing in EVE is to fly a ship, not bypass or rush through a identity-making decission that haves lasting consequences.

The player would start anonymous (with a temporary name like "Character 1 of /username/"), ignorant, and would acquire knowledge on how to "be a capsuleer". Then he would become said capsuleer, join us in TQ and make his choice on who he wants to be or how he wants to look like... or maybe don't.

Of course, on creating a new character there would be an option called "I just want an alt" to bypass the whole tutorial server thing and start in TQ. Also characters would be disabled from the tutorial server after a while (maybe 30 days?).


PS: the tutorial server could be called "Lux". Blink
Salah ad-Din al-Jawahiri
Dreamweb Industries
Novus Ordo.
#2 - 2016-05-25 14:08:12 UTC
Are you saying someone still cares about EVE's lore?

/me widens his eye.

Agent of the New Order

Live by the Code - die by the Code.

The Voice of Highsec
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#3 - 2016-05-25 14:15:14 UTC
30 days seems like a long time to be in a tutorial server.

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Pix Severus
Empty You
#4 - 2016-05-25 14:19:54 UTC
There is no benefit to teaching a new player that their empire choice has meaning, when it really doesn't.

It sounds to me like CCP want to try making the new player feel special, like other MMOs do, which will increase the emotional investment in the character and thus improve retention, but I think that this is a huge mistake. Imagine the "chosen one" heading to his super-secret mission that only HE can hope to complete, only to get caught on a gate in Niarja and exploded instantly by a day-old character, who then tells him he sucks in local.

On the upside, I guess the salt concentration of tears would rise dramatically.

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Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#5 - 2016-05-25 14:30:52 UTC
This won't work in the long term. One of the underlying false beliefs EVE players and DEVs have is that if you teach people the basic mechanics of EVE and then let them go they will go out into New Eden and thrive and have fun. It's just not true (and it doesn't even have anything to do with levels of safety or risk reward either), most human beings including most gamers want to be entertained, they don't want to make their own.

The reason is the same reason why NO NPE works here and why most of us who play are here because some real person helped us get into the game: People who get into a game like EVE via game based hand holding or directing quit just as soon as the hand holding stops. Themepark style games never stop directing/hand-holding so they don't face that issue. But EVE and other sandbox style games have nothing for the average gamer after the NPE experience is over, thus they quit. People who stick with EVE tend to have self starter personalities who need minimal 'story elements' or 'immersion elements' etc. ie They (we) are the types to feel some kind of itch to try or do something and they (we) go do it.

(I'm not making a "we are the elite of gaming" comment here, I'm saying that people who like sandbox gaming are different from the norm, not better or worse)

EVE's retnetion problem has always been standard human nature. Most people who play games want to be told a story, want to feel like they are an important/heroic part of the story, and want a definitive beginning and a clear ending (thus the MMO term "endgame content", not a true in to the game but a feeling of rising to the highest level). That's why people from other MMOs always ask "so how long will it take me to get to a Titan" while people who are more compatible with EVE barely give 'endgame content' a second thought.


What I'm really saying is that people who have ideas like this and CCP aren't considering one very real possibility: The possibility that NOTHING can be done to help EVE's overall retention rate, because the very concepts of EVE (starting with "make your own destiny") will and can only appeal to a very small subset of the people who choose gaming as entertainment. A poster on the Massivley OP MMO news site said it perfectly when talking about sandbox style games not EVE in particular (paraphrasing here) "playing a sandbox game is like writing your own novel or play or opera. Most human beings will never write a novel or play or opera or even want to, most would at best want to READ someone elses novel or enjoy someone else play/opera".

The only thing that can possibly be done imo is EVE/CCP gets better at finding people who like to write their own novels. "Hand holding training server" won't work.
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#6 - 2016-05-25 14:32:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenn aSide
Pix Severus wrote:
There is no benefit to teaching a new player that their empire choice has meaning, when it really doesn't.

It sounds to me like CCP want to try making the new player feel special, like other MMOs do, which will increase the emotional investment in the character and thus improve retention, but I think that this is a huge mistake. Imagine the "chosen one" heading to his super-secret mission that only HE can hope to complete, only to get caught on a gate in Niarja and exploded instantly by a day-old character, who then tells him he sucks in local.

On the upside, I guess the salt concentration of tears would rise dramatically.



The above is basically what I said, only shorter and better . Darn you to Heck Pix!.



EDIT, the more I re-read this spot the more I think it's spot on.

A real EVE NPE would inculde the following things:

-A reminder that even though the lore says otherwise, you are not special.

-Several pointed demonstrations that ships are not important they are mere tools for implementing your will and it's ok if they get killed as long as whatever goals you are setting are met. Don't get attached to a ship.

-EVE looks like a space game but is actually a people game (no other games lets EVERYONE play together one one "server" like EVE does), if you just want a space ship/fighter game, other games are superior....in fact EVERY OTHER SPACE GAME (starting with the old Wing Commander game on the SNES) is a superior space game to EVE mechanics wise, EVE is about people.

If they get through the above NPE, THEN they'll be capsuleers lol.
TigerXtrm
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#7 - 2016-05-25 14:37:06 UTC
Aside from the whole separate server thing, I really like this idea. Traditionally you first see the character when they have just become a capsuleer. To have the tutorial part of the game follow the narrative and training of actually becoming one is not only awesome, but it actually makes sense from a lore perspective. Becoming a capsuleer requires a lot of money and a lot of training. You don't simply learn to control kilometer long ships with your mind overnight, after all.

However there is no real reason this needs to take place outside of the main game. The game can open with the new player being a peasant in one of the empires, working their way up from the planet to a station, and from a station to a ship and from a ship to being wealthy enough to pay for the capsuleer license whatever thing (I'm not brushed up on the lore). This could all be an extended cutscene to introduce some lore.

Then when the player takes control they are in the newbie constellation (this crap with 4 different areas for newbies really needs to go, it's bad game design). The constellation would be open for everyone, but would only have one way out to act as a sort of funnel to the main universe. Vets can hang out in those systems if they want, but there won't be much there in terms of resources and harassing new players is already against the rules, so that should sort itself out fairly quickly.

This new constellation could be under control of Upwell (taking over Capsuleer training facilities or something, make something up), further emphasizing the Empires losing their power bit by bit. And from there the actual tutorial kicks in, giving the new players 5 interconnected systems to learn the ropes in relative peace. If they jump the gate out of the tutorial constellation they will be informed that they are leaving the Capsuleer Training Facilities and will be on their own from there, including a warning about scamming and non-consensual PVP (something that really needs to be more prominently made clear to new players). Of course they may return there whenever they want to complete unfinished business.

TL;DR:


  • Do away with 4 separate newbie zones and create a new constellation on the borders of all 4 empires where all new character spawn after a short background "becoming the capsuleer" cutscene.
  • Move all career agents to this new constellation and have all tutorial missions take place within this constellation.
  • All resources in the training constellation should be spawned from tutorial missions, including rats and ore.
  • The constellation should only have one way out, with a big red warning label on the exit about scamming and PVP.

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KaarBaak
Squirrel Team
#8 - 2016-05-25 15:43:20 UTC  |  Edited by: KaarBaak
CCP has been tinkering with the NPE since before I started playing in 2008.

The NPE teaches basic mechanics, not story. The "story" is covered in the 3 minute intro vid. I'm convinced that "working on NPE" is something that happens at CCP for new devs to work with near-retirement devs learning dev mechanics.

I agree with the previous post that states that CCP should focus on finding new players who fit the game, rather than trying to pull in random players and convince them that this is the game for them.

It's a marketing issue, not an NPE issue.

KB

Dum Spiro Spero
Kolodi Ramal
Sanxing Yi
#9 - 2016-05-25 16:02:43 UTC
I was thinking about this the other day. It would be extremely welcome, from an RP/lore standpoint, if the new NPE at least indicated somehow what it takes to become a capsuleer. The full requirements are described in the EVE Source book and nowhere else. To obtain this basic information, you have to either get ahold of that book and find it in there, or find certain player-made forum threads where players have paraphrased the information. smh.
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#10 - 2016-05-25 16:21:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
I would like to see more introduction to world of EVE, but in fact it can be done very easily even outside the game, thru interactive website presenting to them the stories they could come up with, something like a quiz, when your choices have many diferent effects on the world. I think new servers are not needed.

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Borat Guereen
Doomheim
#11 - 2016-05-25 17:12:44 UTC
I think you are wrong in assuming NPC empires are grossly irrelevant in the game. You chose to make them irrelevant for your play style, but it is only your choice. Some players look at Eve with only economics in mind, others look at Eve from the perspective of a character in a science fiction world. This is part of the sandbox, and is a choice each player can make, much like some fast food companies chose to not be open on Sundays for ideological reasons, rather than maxing up their income by being open every day of the week.

I do agree that the idea of linking the NPE experience to how does someone become a capsuleer, and how this experience can differ from each of the 4 main civilization choices, and their subset, would be a great story to start the game. I even believe that the NPE basics should be taught in instances, rather than on the common server we all share, to limit griefing of new players until they have chosen to skip the tutorial or completed it. The current opportunities are a great way to complete the training once in New Eden.

We already know about the intricate Voluval ceremony in the Minmatar lore, how does such a tribal civilization would transition its chosen tribes members from mortal to immortal?
We know the sacred flesh doctrine of the Amarr prevents an emperor to be a capsuleer, so why do regular Amarr citizens willingly become abominations? Cool



Candidate for CSM XII
IcyMind Arierep
Elysian Technologies Enclave
Fraternity.
#12 - 2016-05-25 17:27:34 UTC
In other MMO everyone is a hero, here the definition of hero can be achieved by different things.

Heroes

Logi pilots that keep fleet alive
Hauler, people that keep hauling stuff for corp member that can't move their stuff.
Industrialist, builders that keep you with the stuff that you need.
Scout , the one that says gates clear go go go..


There is so many ways to be a hero but is not like other MMO, there is no cookie at the end, maybe some isk from your fellow corpies.

and I kno is hard for new players , but the reward is good , better than just getting the same item everyone gets.
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#13 - 2016-05-25 17:32:38 UTC
You know what else is bullshit? Evading the profanity filter, that's what.

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#14 - 2016-05-25 17:32:45 UTC
It all boils down to how the game is advertised and a multi-pronged approach is needed overall.

If the banner ads are all about being "space d!cks", then you will have a game full of space d!cks.

If the ads are all about blowing things up, then you will have a game full of people who just want to blow stuff up.

If the ads are all about "he who has most ISK wins", then you will have players neurotically min-maxing with one eye on the wallet the entire time.

Now if you immerse new players in lore, the lore is indeed interesting enough to capture the science fiction fans, but if the advertisement is not in the same vector, it'll either bore them out of the game or they'll spend 20 minutes on it and move on.

I really don't think the NPE is the cornerstone of retention rate. And frankly, if someone comes to the game with stars in his eyes and then leaves in disgust because it might take a little work to get to space villain/baron/d!ck/savior/infamy status, who needs people like that?

(notably the quickest route to gratification in the game is ganking - 14 days to a gank cat - and lo and behold the entitled mindset you find there)

Where it up to me™ I would put player interaction and PVP into the NPE. I would add missions that actually involve having to fight another player who also has the same mission to get the item or to the goal the mission requires, starting at level 2. I would put in achievements that involve shooting another player, up to and including a solo PVP victory.
The idea being, if you get noobs shooting each other early on, they won't tend towards grinding and get bored out of the game and they won't be all about spinning bling boats as some kind of goal.


For the lore aspect, I would reserve that for Faction Warfare. That is, FW would be an entire career path and since it's directly connected to the lore and empires, enrich this content to include a rank-connected SRP system. That is, issue ships to FW players, empire doctrine fits, free to players but since they are operating under a military environment, the fitting is locked, and anybody flying a military-registered hull who is not in FW goes flashy red (assumed deserter or AWOL). But as players move up in the ranks, they are issued better ships with better faction modules. I would also add in specific FW missions that also involve a quota requirement of blowing up other players' ships.
That aspect can be as immersed in lore as it can get.

But the bottom line is, while the griefers will claim that ganking players is some means of retention, they only have it half right: interaction in general is what does it, but a more positive interaction of having a shot at being an aggressor instead of just getting raeped by entitled bittervets and early on will do the job much better. New missions are needed that pit players against each other in more controlled situations so that they can learn to fight and die against other players early on and then whey they decide to join a corp or move out to less protected space they are ready for that instead of having to resign themselves to being someone else's entertainment.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#15 - 2016-05-25 17:46:18 UTC
Salah ad-Din al-Jawahiri wrote:
Are you saying someone still cares about EVE's lore?

CCP sure doesn't!
Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2016-05-25 17:59:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Tipa Riot
Tend to share that it is actually a marketing problem ... some random thoughts ahead:

Capsuleers are very special, they are immortal demi-gods compared to regular humans, though there are 500000 of them ...

EvE can be compared to Second Life, a parallel universe

You don't need to be uber creative, just join the story other players write for you (corps, fleets, ...)

EvE has a vibrant, pure capitalist player driven economy (simulator)

EvE allows you to create something (virtually) persistent with your char and assets, which becomes part of the history (kill mails) when destroyed.

The "This is EvE" trailer is spot on, why people don't believe?

Get rid of that spreadsheet in space preconception ... it's BS

EvE will be there forever ...

I'm my own NPC alt.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#17 - 2016-05-25 18:04:39 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
Salah ad-Din al-Jawahiri wrote:
Are you saying someone still cares about EVE's lore?

CCP sure doesn't!



You may well be right about that.

(ruefully remembering the chronicles and when there were novels based on the game)

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#18 - 2016-05-25 18:09:03 UTC
There are some really good suggestions in here, lets hope CCP Ghost reads them.

Tiger is getting 9/10, great thinking :)

But I'd limit access to the likes of Mike Azariah and the couple of guys from CAS who nurture new players. Letting just anyone in would just be the same as is happening now.

Closing off a few systems shouldn't be too big a task, maybe give them a week to learn stuff...then give them a choice of exit gates..with the suggested warnings.

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#19 - 2016-05-25 18:10:38 UTC
Empyrean Age is probably the worst book I ever read. I'm actually really glad Tony Gonzales doesn't work for CCP anymore.

But yes, the total lack of development of the EVE lore, the completely stagnant storylines that go nowhere and the removal of Evelopedia which provided easier access the information about the universe is bad.

CCP should get their **** together and put all of the existent EVE lore together and put it somewhere people can access it easily so people with an interest in that kind of thing don't need to trawl though third party websites.
TigerXtrm
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#20 - 2016-05-25 19:13:13 UTC
Drago Shouna wrote:
There are some really good suggestions in here, lets hope CCP Ghost reads them.

Tiger is getting 9/10, great thinking :)

But I'd limit access to the likes of Mike Azariah and the couple of guys from CAS who nurture new players. Letting just anyone in would just be the same as is happening now.

Closing off a few systems shouldn't be too big a task, maybe give them a week to learn stuff...then give them a choice of exit gates..with the suggested warnings.


The thing with a closed off tutorial area is;

1. It would be unique within the EVE universe, no other place in New Eden is off limits aside from Jove space, but no-one has actually ever been there to begin with anyway. Not allowing people to return to where they began is very un-EVE like.

2. Having the area open allows those who wish to assist new players to do so without issues.

There really isn't an issue right now, aside from the spawning systems being so far apart. It's forbidden to harass new players in any way, so gankers could hang out in those newbie systems all day and the second they blow someone up or try to scam them they are acting against the rules and the GMs will have their asses.

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