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Reprocessing Formula Change
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Regnar Avastum
#1 - 2016-05-01 20:05:11 UTC
Hi,

So due to the new patch the reprocessing formula has changed. The only information I could find on the subject is:
"Science & Industry:

Reprocessing tax has been changed from a material tax to an ISK tax"

I can reproduce the formula to get the refined units amount just fine. On the other hand I don't understand how the isk tax is calculated. It seems to be based on the estimated value but I didn't find any logic to it. Any ideas?

Also, where can I import the in-game estimated value of items from?

Thanks!

♔ ℜegnar's High-End Spreadsheets ♔™
0000000000ZERO0000000000
Zero Zentharis
#2 - 2016-05-02 00:12:36 UTC
Logic is that when you own a citadel and someone refines ore/ice in it, you can collect tax based on isk value rather than mineral amount.
Regnar Avastum
#3 - 2016-05-02 04:22:02 UTC
The tax is already implemented for NPC stations also. :D

♔ ℜegnar's High-End Spreadsheets ♔™
Professor Humbert
Project Fruit House
#4 - 2016-05-02 06:17:19 UTC
Regnar Avastum wrote:
Hi,

So due to the new patch the reprocessing formula has changed. The only information I could find on the subject is:
"Science & Industry:

Reprocessing tax has been changed from a material tax to an ISK tax"

I can reproduce the formula to get the refined units amount just fine. On the other hand I don't understand how the isk tax is calculated. It seems to be based on the estimated value but I didn't find any logic to it. Any ideas?

Also, where can I import the in-game estimated value of items from?

Thanks!


This is a good question really.
Regnar Avastum
#5 - 2016-05-02 13:04:34 UTC
The old formula for reprocessing: http://eve-industry.org/export/IndustryFormulas.pdf

Example of the current reprocessing: http://postimg.org/image/k51opu029/

The old 5% tax applied as ISK tax with comparison to the real cost: http://postimg.org/image/4klkr6s41/

♔ ℜegnar's High-End Spreadsheets ♔™
Aky Ambraelle
The Mythically Intoxicated
#6 - 2016-05-02 19:18:52 UTC
Regnar Avastum wrote:
Hi,

So due to the new patch the reprocessing formula has changed. The only information I could find on the subject is:
"Science & Industry:

Reprocessing tax has been changed from a material tax to an ISK tax"

I can reproduce the formula to get the refined units amount just fine. On the other hand I don't understand how the isk tax is calculated. It seems to be based on the estimated value but I didn't find any logic to it. Any ideas?

Also, where can I import the in-game estimated value of items from?

Thanks!


Asking from a "newbye" point of view, I am just starting to do some mining, I do'nt have much ISK and i see that i can make more isk by reprocessing the ore. What happens when the ISK tax is BIGGER than the ore worth in ISK?
Also, this tax is'nt explained or told why was introduced. Remember not all players are building Citadels!

Regnar Avastum, I am sorry, you are wrong:
" Reprocessing tax has been changed from a material tax to an ISK tax"
There are BOTH taxes!
Regnar Avastum
#7 - 2016-05-02 19:38:00 UTC
Aky Ambraelle wrote:
Regnar Avastum wrote:
Hi,

So due to the new patch the reprocessing formula has changed. The only information I could find on the subject is:
"Science & Industry:

Reprocessing tax has been changed from a material tax to an ISK tax"

I can reproduce the formula to get the refined units amount just fine. On the other hand I don't understand how the isk tax is calculated. It seems to be based on the estimated value but I didn't find any logic to it. Any ideas?

Also, where can I import the in-game estimated value of items from?

Thanks!


Asking from a "newbye" point of view, I am just starting to do some mining, I do'nt have much ISK and i see that i can make more isk by reprocessing the ore. What happens when the ISK tax is BIGGER than the ore worth in ISK?
Also, this tax is'nt explained or told why was introduced. Remember not all players are building Citadels!

Regnar Avastum, I am sorry, you are wrong:
" Reprocessing tax has been changed from a material tax to an ISK tax"
There are BOTH taxes!


Hi,

Sorry but they are not both applied. You can check the breakdown in the reprocessing window. The only loss in reprocessing is the unrecoverable part which is not a tax but related to skills and facility.

♔ ℜegnar's High-End Spreadsheets ♔™
Shayla Etherodyne
Delta Laroth Industries
#8 - 2016-05-03 06:27:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Shayla Etherodyne
A strange thing is that, so far, my reprocessing tax in isk has been 0. I have done that only in stations where I have a high standing (9.93 and 9.73), but I don't think it is meant to be totally cancelled.
I should do a bug report.

Done.
Zeranii
New Horizons Exploration Incorporated
#9 - 2016-05-04 14:10:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Zeranii
The tax appears to be 5% with some inverse proportion to the value, so at 100k value you pay 100% of the 5% tax (minus some for standings) then on a sliding scale upto approx 500m isk you pay 0% of the 5% tax.

So reprocessing is currently +5% free extra minerals on batches of over 500m in value. I have reported a bug, but in the mean time, the mineral ecconomy is going to be a bit strange.
Jason Dacos
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2016-05-04 18:46:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Jason Dacos
Regnar Avastum wrote:
Aky Ambraelle wrote:
Regnar Avastum wrote:
Hi,

So due to the new patch the reprocessing formula has changed. The only information I could find on the subject is:
"Science & Industry:

Reprocessing tax has been changed from a material tax to an ISK tax"

I can reproduce the formula to get the refined units amount just fine. On the other hand I don't understand how the isk tax is calculated. It seems to be based on the estimated value but I didn't find any logic to it. Any ideas?

Also, where can I import the in-game estimated value of items from?

Thanks!


Asking from a "newbye" point of view, I am just starting to do some mining, I do'nt have much ISK and i see that i can make more isk by reprocessing the ore. What happens when the ISK tax is BIGGER than the ore worth in ISK?
Also, this tax is'nt explained or told why was introduced. Remember not all players are building Citadels!

Regnar Avastum, I am sorry, you are wrong:
" Reprocessing tax has been changed from a material tax to an ISK tax"
There are BOTH taxes!


Hi,

Sorry but they are not both applied. You can check the breakdown in the reprocessing window. The only loss in reprocessing is the unrecoverable part which is not a tax but related to skills and facility.




https://www.google.ro/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eve-cost.eu%2Fimages%2FstationOwnerTax.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eve-cost.eu%2Freprocessing&docid=kVadhOnNp3ZDaM&tbnid=JM1_kl-Wvli7kM%3A&w=391&h=255&bih=671&biw=1280&ved=0ahUKEwirm5X7iMHMAhXJrxoKHfwZBo04ZBAzCBQoETAR&iact=mrc&uact=8#h=255&imgdii=JM1_kl-Wvli7kM%3A%3BJM1_kl-Wvli7kM%3A%3BLaUNZT-nx0zZKM%3A&w=391

the link is for an image of reprocessing tax (wich was untill ISK tax) - not mine

https://www.google.ro/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eve-cost.eu%2Fimages%2FstationOwnerTax.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eve-cost.eu%2Freprocessing&docid=kVadhOnNp3ZDaM&tbnid=JM1_kl-Wvli7kM%3A&w=391&h=255&bih=671&biw=1280&ved=0ahUKEwirm5X7iMHMAhXJrxoKHfwZBo04ZBAzCBQoETAR&iact=mrc&uact=8#h=255&imgdii=JM1_kl-Wvli7kM%3A%3BJM1_kl-Wvli7kM%3A%3BeBfhkVHu8gE7aM%3A&w=391 EVE ONLINE community - reprocessing tax



https://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/reprocess-all-the-things/ moore clearer formula for reprocessing (Old reprocessing formula)
Jason Dacos
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2016-05-04 19:15:03 UTC
So, basically, i need to pay ISK to be able to reprocess ore/items?!?!?!!?? IF i am in a place (null-sec) and i cannot have a ship but i can mine some ore....

I AM broke AND i must pay isk for reprocessing?
Sequester Risalo
German Corps of Engineers 17
Federation of Respect Honor Passion Alliance.
#12 - 2016-05-12 07:35:44 UTC
Jason Dacos wrote:
So, basically, i need to pay ISK to be able to reprocess ore/items?!?!?!!?? IF i am in a place (null-sec) and i cannot have a ship but i can mine some ore....

I AM broke AND i must pay isk for reprocessing?


technically you just have to sell one boatload of ore and will be able to finance the reprocessing of the next boatloads.
Shayla Etherodyne
Delta Laroth Industries
#13 - 2016-05-13 06:11:14 UTC
I have learned that above 6 and something standing you don't pay the reprocessing tax. So get standing with the NPC station you use and you are free from the tax.
PhatController
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#14 - 2016-05-19 01:10:58 UTC
Standings with the station you are at will effect the %. You negate it altogether with high enough standing, or using an POS, or an Citadel that has 0% tax set.

I'm not a fan of the current system not:

a. Clearly stating the cost of refining (you have to mouse over each individual refined product to see the cost)
b. Not being very clear how much this tax % is, or how to reduce it in game.
Apon Nighthawk
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2016-06-01 01:20:39 UTC
I don't know if this was answered elsewhere or if someone else figured it out. But from what I can tell the ISK Tax doesn't make any sense unless they are doing something wonky.

I took 100 Units of Azure Plagioclase, went to Jita and reprocessed it. 65.8% Yield, 50% Base Yield, x1.15 from Reprocessing, x1.08 from Reprocessing Efficiency, and x1.06 from Plagioclase Processing. The estimated price of the Azure Plagioclase was 6,000 ISK, the estimated price of the minerals I got were 6,760 ISK, and it cost 192.79 ISK.

I got back 74 Units of Tritanium (Cost 16 ISK for Taxes), 147 Units of Pyerite (Cost 62 ISK for Taxes), and 74 Units of Mexallon (Cost 113 ISK for Taxes). You can see how much it is going to cost w/ taxes for each mineral if you hover over them in the Reprocessing Window. I then hovered over each one in my inventory and got the Estimated Price and calculated the percentage from that.

Tritanium, Estimated Price 6.13, Estimated Price for 74 Units 453.62
Pyerite , Estimated Price 10.5, Estimated Price for 74 Units 1543.5
Mexallon, Estimated Price 64.5, Estimated Price for 74 Units 4773

So from there I got the following tax percent. Now this is based off what you see when hovering over the individual minerals and is off by a few ISK. But that should result in numbers that are close together now ones so far apart.

Tritanium 3.53%
Pyerite 4.02%
Mexallon 2.37%

I didn't include my standing but that shouldn't matter since I should get a tax percent similar across the board but that isn't the case. We know it does some calculation based on the per mineral since it tells use the cost when we hover over them but it seems to be different per mineral.

Just for fun I went and figured out my Tax Rate based off the old information w/ my standing. 1.49 Standing should result in a 3.88% Tax Rate. If you try and use that for the numbers you get it results in the following.

Tritanium, 453.62 * 3.88% = 17.60
Pyerite, 1543.5 * 3.88% = 59.89
Mexallon, 4773 * 3.88% = 185.19

These numbers are above what we see per mineral and isn't correct.
Apon Nighthawk
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2016-06-11 00:57:38 UTC
Alright, I think I figured it all out and it's a pretty simple formula.

(Total Minerals * Mineral Base Value) * Tax Rate = Tax


The only problem is that you don't really know the Mineral Base Value. You do know how many Minerals you are going to get back, you can figure our your Tax Rate, and you can get the amount you are being taxed when rounded if you hover over the output items. This means you can rewrite the formula to be as follows...

Tax / Tax Rate / Total Minerals = Mineral Base Value


Now, since we are using the rounded amount of what you are being taxes the result you will get will be off. But if we put in a lot of items to reprocess to bring the Tax and Total Minerals up we will get a Mineral Base Value that is super super close to what it should be and be off by 0.001 to 0.01 or something close which allows you to guess at what the number should be.

Well I did just that and plugged the numbers into Excel to figure our the Mineral Base Value for everything at this moment....

Tritanium = 4.25
Pyerite = 8.11
Mexallon = 34.48
Isogen = 72.83
Nocxium = 423.15
Zydrine = 548.65
Megacyte = 1027.41


Now these numbers might be off by a cent or two but from what I can see it gets a number that is super close. So I took 20x Heavy Neutron Blaster I and put them into the Reprocessing Plant.

50% Base Yield + x1.06 Bonus from Scrapmetal Processing = 53%
Corporation Standing w/ Me = 0, 5% Tax

96,343 Tritanium * 4.25 * 5% = 20,472.89 ISK (Game shows 20,472)
29,531 Pyerite * 8.11 * 5% = 11,974.82 ISK (Game shows 11,974)
29,966 Mexallon * 4.25 * 5% = 51,661.38 ISK (Game shows 51,661)
148 Isogen * 4.25 * 5% = 538.94 ISK (Game shows 538)
10 Nocxium * 4.25 * 5% = 211.58 ISK (Game shows 211)

Total = 84,859.61 ISK
Game Total = 84,859.60 ISK


So in the end we were off by 0.01 ISK which is pretty close by my book. Now I am not sure if this works with the other items you get back besides just Minerals, but I would imagine it to be. I also don't know if the Base Mineral Value changes over time or it's a static number that is updated every few builds. But we can figure it out pretty easily now.