Intergalactic Summit

5: Torture

So what is torture for? As we've established, it's not for extracting information - the boredom, loneliness and emotional manipulation of the interrogator do that job just fine. Which is why most detainees are in fact never tortured: they don't need to be.

So what is torture for?

Well, let's say we have a detainee who's lying to our face. And I don't mean an understandable lie, as might be told by somebody who still thinks he's in control of the situation. I'm not talking about the cover story or "official version" that the detainee will try to stick to at first. Those will normally be punctured by simply presenting the facts, exploring the logic, catching them in that lie.

Very few lies survive when the interrogator reveals that they know it's a lie. The detainee will most likely switch to a different falsehood, but they'll be caught in that one too, eventually. One way or another, they'll finally be backed into a corner where they can lie no more, and MUST tell the truth.

Some detainees, however, will just smile at you and continue to tell what you both know is a lie. This is a final and critical act of defiance. You know it's a lie, they know you know it's a lie, there's no doubt whatsoever, but they still tell that lie because it's a big obscene gesture right in your face.

The role of torture is to get them to stop that.



This is why properly done torture does not in fact involve, say, cutting on the detainee, or breaking their fingers, nor punching them or pulling out their teeth. You try those things, and they'll just grin at you, spit blood in your face and keep telling their defiant lie.

If you're mistakenly cutting up somebody who's telling the truth, yes they'll break and blabber whatever they think you want to hear. If you're correctly cutting on somebody who's lying to you, you'll make them want to lie all the harder. Either way, you've not got any closer to the truth and as I said: Intelligence operatives want the truth.

If, on the other hand, you tie your detainee down and tickle them... or let water drip slowly onto their forehead, one drop at a time every five seconds or so for hours and hours on end... or most effective of all, if you cover their mouth and nose with a cloth and pour water on them to simulate drowning...

Eventually they will panic. And panic is fatal to the defiant lie.

You see, pain is an abstract, and the conscious mind is good at overruling abstracts. if you've got a detainee who's telling the defiant naked lie, then they already have all the willpower and nous they need to ride through any pain you might inflict on them and use it to fuel their hatred for you. Every jolt of pain, every injury, every moment you use force, they win and they know it.

Panic, though? Panic is the death of the conscious mind. If you're panicking then you've reverted to an animal state, and animals don't defy. Remember the lab rat? Remember how I said it's admirable of humans that we're conscious enough to fight back?

Get the detainee to panic and you shut down that human factor, at which point that defiant naked lie of theirs will be dropped and dropped fast. When that happens, YOU have won, and their last ditch at resisting you has failed.

At that point, you return them to their cell under the trustworthy guidance of their guards. They will probably be much more compliant with the interrogator from now on.

THAT is what torture is for, and I hope Pilot Parmala you can see that your objections about the data gathered under torture don't actually apply. There is no such thing as data gathered under torture. The data is explicitly gathered through a relationship and rapport with the interrogator, and through a simple system of manipulation, rewards and incentives.

All that torture is is a means of dislodging the detainee when they've dug in and are refusing to move forward with that process. Done properly, it is 100% effective.

6: Any questions?

If anybody wants more information, now is the time to ask.

True enough. And goodness knows, there are plenty of people who ought to know better who are ignoring the common-sense good practice I just summarized above. Just look at those detention camps in Black Rise.

You seem to know alot about this business Stitcher.

Im guessing its something youve looked into, studied , rather than partaken in. If used correctly it is tool to get information, maybe valuable information from the enemy. Ive seen alot of people contradict that statement, say the exact opposite.

Where do you stand on the use of torture Stitcher , are you an advocate for the use of torture. Im guessing maybe you are, in certain circumstances.

You know, every time you say that, the people who actually know me are laughing at you.

Just because the obvious choices for what you wish to do may look down on your past employment, there's always other corporations who would look the other way. Your past/current employment may close some doors but there's still plenty of other doors if you don't mind traveling further down the hall way with your eyes open.

You do know that Stitcher was a law enforcement medic before becoming a capsuleer, right?

I'd be very surprised if he hasn't run medical overwatch on more than one interrogation.

Since they are all Sansha sleeper agents, those could very well be evil laughs!

You fiends!

As I understand it the interrogation techniques described above tend to show results over a period of days or weeks. I believe proper use of drugs in the food to confuse the body clock can accelerate the process. Sensory deprivation can be used to good effect as well. That's purely from memory though and I haven't checked the figures.

This is why any properly run insurgency, terrorist or spy operation limits the information a person has to what they need to know and no more. The assumption is that once you are caught, you will talk. It's just a matter of time. Indeed I believe it has been known to arrange attacks on the interrogation facility with the intent of killing the captive before they crack.

Captain Mokk's suggestion of TCMC usage probably has merit if the controlling agency is ruthless enough. I suspect the costs make it uneconomical except where a person is known to possess critical information.

Mh. I am not in favor of pretending it is something it isn't. Torture is torture, whether it's meant to induce panic or simply pain for some other reason.

You're forgetting the need to win hearts and minds. Ideally, the source should be released in as good if not better condition than they arrived - better fed, fitter, maybe even a little wealthier.

Militaries with an enlightened self-interestt will cultivate a reputation for nott needlessly torturing detainees. Far better to be known for treating your beaten foes fairly and well - that way they actually surrender to you, and everyone does is a potential source of intelligence.