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On this day, and on the day of my death

Author
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#1 - 2016-04-11 19:58:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon
Three years ago Prime Minister Karin Midular was shot in Luminaire. It took over two months before the man whose hand raised the gun was brought to justice, and even longer before she was let go from this world to that of her ancestors.

To this day, no investigation on what forces moved that man have been properly conducted. His own testimonial on that fact was quickly cut short. A threat of armed conflict quickly turned interests to the other way. Once the weapon was in tribal hands, the trial was short and the execution swift.

Where is Mentas Blaque? He sits at the head of the Federal Intelligence Office.

And who had the most to win? The same man whose power is founded on multiple assasinations to begin with.

Oh let me live a dutiful life
Let me find my Fate and fulfill it
May my ancestors smile when they look over me
On this day, and on the day of my death
Mizhara Del'thul
Kyn'aldrnari
#2 - 2016-04-11 20:39:14 UTC
Executions of traitors, perhaps. The very article you link speak of the evidence left behind. You would perhaps prefer they remained in the power structure, so Midular's appeasement continued to be the policy enacted? The purging of the corrupt and the inveiglers was perhaps the finest act of patriotism and love for the Tribes I have seen in my life, enacted decisively and with precision.

I can only hope, should I ever be in a position where I act against my people in the way those traitors did, that someone has the strength and determination to dispatch me in the same way, leaving behind the evidence of a just act.
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#3 - 2016-04-11 20:42:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon
I would, Del'thul, that our tribal leaders held proper trials before they execute anyone as a traitor.

Too much to ask?
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#4 - 2016-04-11 21:10:40 UTC
I'd like to see Mentas Blaque having some tribal justice as well. Gallenteans are racists and even their government is racist.

But honestly, I'd prefer to see them getting Caldari justice.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Mizhara Del'thul
Kyn'aldrnari
#5 - 2016-04-11 21:24:41 UTC
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
I would, Del'thul, that our tribal leaders held proper trials before they execute anyone as a traitor.

Too much to ask?


Who will investigate and arbitrate in a corrupt system? When something is that rotten, it can't be remedied piecemeal. It needs to be torn down and rebuilt with new materials. Even worse, saddling the broken system with many hundreds of accusations, investigations and strife during such a critical moment? It would be tantamount to crippling the tribes and destroying us from within.

It's unfortunate that it ever came to that, but when it got that bad the situation required swift and decisive action, which is exactly what happened. Sometimes you can only choose between a lesser or a greater evil.

Yes, in that situation it was most certainly too much to ask.

I do recall asking rather politely, and repeatedly, not to call me Del'thul.
Louella Dougans
Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine
#6 - 2016-04-11 21:33:14 UTC
I once saw some 'evidence' that a certain Minmatar pilot, was responsible for the murder of several hundred thousand freed slaves, allegedly for "not being Minmatar enough".
And some other 'evidence' that those several hundred thousands had actually just been sold back to Cartel slavers, to provide funds for fighting slavery.

If that 'evidence' had been professionally made, rather than what appeared to be some kind of half-baked frame-up, well then.

Be a Space Nun, it is fun. \o/

Deitra Vess
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#7 - 2016-04-11 23:01:44 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
I'd like to see Mentas Blaque having some tribal justice as well. Gallenteans are racists and even their government is racist.

But honestly, I'd prefer to see them getting Caldari justice.

Respectfully, who do you think has it worse? Whether it be true or not mind you, those under the authority of Matari justice or Caldari justice? It's safe to say you want to see them suffer, where would they suffer more?

Hasn't the events surrounding that "certain pilot" been beaten long after its death by now?

May Midular's spirit find rest. I may not agree with her policies fully but I respect what she was.
Ayallah
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2016-04-12 00:14:55 UTC
I am sure the FIO will be prompt in responding to the Ice Cream Audit Office as to the status of their investigation into if the Ray of Matar was assassinated by the SanMatar.. After all it is clear he has gained so much ???? from her death.

Goddess of the IGS

As strength goes.

Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#9 - 2016-04-12 05:10:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon
Quote:
I am sure the FIO will be prompt in responding to the Ice Cream Audit Office

Oh, Ayallah, FIO needs not to respond to IceAO, for this is not corporation business. IceAO is not a political entity.

Hell, FIO does not need to talk to me, either.

Just doing their job would be enough.

Without Mentas Blaque it would be more believable, though.

Quote:
Who will investigate and arbitrate in a corrupt system?

It is interesting, Mizhara, that you consider your tribal elders capable of issuing justice by murder, but not capable of issuing justice by trial. After all, the only tribe whose leadership has changed since is the Sebiestor tribe, and that did not happen until much later than the Parliament massacre. Surely, if they were then so deep in the corruption that they could not deal with it in a civilized manner, they are not fit to lead now either?
Ayallah
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2016-04-12 06:22:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Ayallah
You forget the Nefantir and Starkmanir. But I suppose expecting a Sebiestor supremacist to consider the other Tribes is too much.

Perhaps you should go back to blaming Shakor for breaking up the old republic?






....Because that was Midular.

Goddess of the IGS

As strength goes.

Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#11 - 2016-04-12 06:46:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon
Call me supremacist as much as you like, but when brain functions of certain other people are on the level where legally dissolving a parliament is a worse act against the Republic than murdering said parliament's members, rigging an election, and seizing dictatorship, it is a little hard not to consider myself a tad above average.

I did not forget the Nefantar and the Starkmanir, either. They did not exactly change leadership, but for some reason unclear to me had to have their leaders blessed by the aforementioned dictator in a fancy ceremony before being allowed to call them Chiefs.
Mizhara Del'thul
Kyn'aldrnari
#12 - 2016-04-12 08:02:16 UTC
You don't see the weight such trials would put on the Tribes at that time? How saddling the system with hundreds of very high profile trials, investigations and more that could potentially go nowhere due to the corruption involved would cripple us? Sometimes what has to be done isn't nice, pretty or legal. It still has to be done, for our people and for the Tribes.

Of course, you have been more than willing to abandon our people in the Empire in the past, so I shouldn't be surprised that you'd prefer leaving the Nefantar and Starkmanir behind as well, in favor of a bloated and corrupt Midular appeasement favoring government. Because that is what would have happened if the cancer within hadn't been swiftly carved out with precision and skill. You think their liberation would have succeeded with all those traitors in our midst? Then again, you were more than willing to cower in Republic space and abandon our kin to the Empire before.

If you think the Tribes are under a dictatorship, rise up and fight against it. Do what has to be done.
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#13 - 2016-04-12 08:12:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon
I did not abandon our kin. While some people were in zero sec complaining of lack of warmongering, I was running one of the biggest "underground railroads" across the Amarrian border. Gradient brought millions home over the years, ran refugee camps, provided jobs, connected clans.

Of course, no one remembers, because it was not, at the time, practical to make PR out of something that might have given the Amarrians an excuse to invade.

Practicality - the fact that we would have lost, still likely would lose an all-out war - was never an argument enough for you people to stop warmongering. Plausible deniability you called dishonorable, because for you, practical concerns about what it would mean to the tribes if we went after our own in force were not something we should consider before honor.

Somehow the toll to the tribes becomes a relevant argument when it is about murdering your own, though.

Funny, that.
Mizhara Del'thul
Kyn'aldrnari
#14 - 2016-04-12 08:44:11 UTC
You seem to think I had anything at all to do with Ushra'Khan in those days. Bah, what point is there in trying to reason with an extremist zealot? The hate for anything that didn't kiss the hem of Midular's dress is too ingrained.

That you would consider traitors working for the Amarr 'your own' just to spite Shakor says it all.
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#15 - 2016-04-12 08:47:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon
Yes, I consider any member of my tribe as a member of my tribe until such time that due process has been conducted to outcast them.

Even criminals. Even convicted criminals, so why not those who have been denied a trial?

And U'K has very little to do with what I said, apart from, obviously, being an example of the type of people I spoke of. Only an example, though, and a historical one at that - I think most of them have gotten over it.
Ayallah
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2016-04-12 09:35:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Ayallah
Dissolving the government in a time of crisis because it and the people it represents disagree with you does not make you a dictator, being beloved by the people and no one stepping forward to run against you does. This is your assertion?

You live in the Republic and should know better than to call the SanMatar a dictator. The Chiefs rule, not him. The only thing more inane in this thread is Mizhara of all people to wear a face mark coming at you for abandoning your people.

...I take that back, it is you implying that Chief Valkanir and Chief Setul are in their positions because they support the SanMatar and not because their Tribes chose them. Pretending Chief Valkanir did not earn her position after her many years of service to her people at extreme personal risk is particularly distasteful. It is no wonder the Tribal leaders are deaf to you and those like you. You spit on a thousand years of tradition, "fancy ceremony" and the greatest victory the Matari people have won since they won their freedom just to imply justification for your vendetta against the San Matar.

For the rest of the future of the Republic its people will remember the re-unification of the Tribes, the Chiefs and San Matar who proved to the entire cluster that you cannot wipe out the Matari.

What will they remember about you? Your long record of service in combat and to your people or your aged and delusional ramblings?



Just a confectionary vendor spewing conspiracy theories. Long past her prime.

Goddess of the IGS

As strength goes.

Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#17 - 2016-04-12 09:43:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon
Aged? I am hardly forty in conventional reckoning, barely old enough to count as a wise adult where I come from. I hope I have a long time till senility.

Dissolving of the parliament would have lead to a free re-election of the parliament in two months, had the events proceeded on the legal course. Instead, what we got was a charade of an election for Prime Minister, with one candidate. Yea, my assertion is that this did not exactly go as it should have.

And yes, it is interesting that "Chiefs rule" should convince us this is a free tribal republic when, as you point out, all those Chiefs are now pretty much hand-picked by the blind man on the top.

PS. It's not unification when we are not united. Calling "you should all do as I say" "Unity" is so... Providencial.
Ayallah
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2016-04-12 09:56:36 UTC
None of them were picked by Shakor and I never implied they were. They were chosen by their people. Something that seems to confound you about how the SanMatar was chosen as well. Perhaps you forgot already the celebration all across the Republic the day he was named. Perhaps you forget that this is the Republic we are speaking of and not a Federation or a State.

Perhaps you forget that a planet of Matari people had been taken over by the Angel Cartel and your would be martyr did nothing. Perhaps you forget that the Starkmanir would not exist had two months passed. Perhaps you forget how much worse it was in the old Republic, corrupt and weak and ineffectual.

It is your conspiracy theory that is aged, I said nothing about how long you have been alive. What I did say was how pathetic and insulting it was to throw away the work the Chiefs have done to earn their title. To imply they were picked by the San Matar and not chosen for their people they sweat and bled for.

You have no respect at all for anything but your own narrow view of a wronged Sebiestor supremacy. You would return to unequal and broken Tribes, a corrupt and weak government, just to spite a single man who re-united the Tribes.

If Shakor had been the minister who dissolved parliament and Midular the one to re-unite the Tribes I am sure you would be singing a far different song.

Goddess of the IGS

As strength goes.

Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#19 - 2016-04-12 10:08:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon
Perhaps your words would have more effect if you did not just mindlessly parrot the official propaganda.

How conveniently you forget that it was Midular's government who started the negotiations with the Nefantar; how conveniently you forget it was not the Sanmatar but the so-called Elder Fleet who went for the Starkmanir. All he did for the unification was stand in the ceremonies that followed.

And what has he achieved since? Are the people still in Empire any freer? Are the local governments less corrupt?

And I'd stand with any leader of the Republic who came to their power by legal means. I am oath-sworn to do that. Tribe is irrelevant, there.
Kithrus
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#20 - 2016-04-12 14:38:11 UTC
I'd offer to help but realistically as soon as I do true republic supporting tribes men start spitting hot coals even as the words leave my mouth so....

God Speed?

Darkness is more then absence of light, it is ignorance and corruption. I will be the Bulwark from such things that you may live in the light. Pray so my arms do not grow weary and my footing remain sure.

If you are brave, join me in the dark.

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