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With no EVElopedia, who do we go to now?

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Pix Severus
Empty You
#41 - 2016-04-29 00:59:11 UTC
Some of you talk about third party sites like they can't be trusted to provide accurate information. Lets not forget that the official wiki itself was outdated, and therefore incorrect, on many of it's articles.

How many of you here use zkillboard, EVE Survival, or any of Chribba's many sites? Do you have issues trusting the information there?

I think the playerbase can create a better wiki than the old one, we just need someone to step up to the plate.

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Nick Bete
Highsec Haulers Inc.
#42 - 2016-04-29 05:15:32 UTC
You're missing the point. It's not that there aren't many well-known, long-standing and accurate sites out there. Obviously they exist but, the issue is they're NOT OFFICIAL. CCP has absolutely no control over what's posted on them and therefore the information could be incomplete or deliberately misleading. With a game as complex as Eve there needs to be vetted CCP-created documentation. Relying on third parties like Chribba or Eve Uni to provide docs for Eve is akin to Porsche deciding one day to stop including an owners' manual with each vehicle sold and expecting people to Google how to change the oil or find the right tire pressures. It's silly, inefficient and irresponsible.

It's all well and good that third parties are providing documentation that CCP should be but let's face it, anyone can put up a web page or wiki and fill it with information. Maybe that info is valid and maybe it's not. How will players, especially new ones with no clue about who to trust, tell the difference?

P.S. This doesn't even begin to deal with how much PVE, lore and backstory-related information is potentially lost.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#43 - 2016-04-29 06:00:11 UTC
Player-written documentation has always been superior to what CCP provides. Misleading, incorrect or incomplete information was far more prevalent in EVElopedia than on any decent player-run wiki, and the only people "vetting" the information on that wiki were ISD.

We already have eve-wiki.net and the EVE Uni wiki. Why create another one?

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Alessienne Ellecon
Doomheim
#44 - 2016-04-29 06:11:20 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Alessienne Ellecon wrote:
I'm totally up for creating an evelopedia replacement, who's with me?


That is CCP's job. It is THEIR software and it is THEIR duty to document it. And not just the new shiny, but also all the essential mechanics, from how powergrid works when fitting to how to set up a corporation role.


Well, they're obviously not doing it, are they? Instead of sitting on this forum and whining like a little b****, I'm proposing we make a comprehensive EVE wiki to end all EVE wikis and put the Evelopedia to shame.

Also, screw EVE Uni.

"CONCORD are the space cops. If you attack someone in a high-security solar system, CONCORD will commit police brutality." - Encyclopedia Dramatica

If EVE is a PvP game, then Anti-Ganking is emergent gameplay.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#45 - 2016-04-29 06:13:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Andski
It's almost like you can build upon an existing wiki instead of starting one from scratch!

Seriously, any "let's start an awesome EVE wiki!" project will be a massive pain for the person who ends up doing all of the work. It's easy to launch a wiki, but you'd also have to make the stylesheets and artwork so that it doesn't look like dog ****. You'd also need to use CCP SSO because it's the surest way to keep spammers away, unless you want to clean up RMT spam on a daily basis. There are multiple people who have figured this all out and laid the groundwork, and their wikis have plenty of content to build on.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
GFSM
Doomheim
#46 - 2016-04-29 12:49:54 UTC
I'd think (therefore I don't know) there's two issues at stake.

1: Technical info. Most play EVE as a game, and one that can "be won". IMO there's plenty of info out there for this.
2: Lore/RPG. This is an "aesthetic hook" for many, the "soul" of the game.

I honestly LOVE CCP for what they've made, but taking down EVEopedia and then uploading things like "Wrecking Machine" is reckless. We all love Permaband, but honestly....

If CCP did a lore based wiki (and lore only) and let all the "pew pew crew" make third party sites it would cost about a fifth of Permaband's wardrobe and about 03.75% of the cost of the 07 Show.

That MIGHT be a nice compromise.
Akira Kata
AkiCo LLC
#47 - 2016-05-02 18:02:41 UTC
ISD Fractal wrote:
The most comprehensive Eve wiki that I'm aware of is Eve University's wiki. As for the links in game, feel free to submit a bug report every time you see something that looks out of place. I'm sure references to the Evelopedia are all over the place and CCP could probably use a hand finding them.

Edited to more explicitly state that you should submit a bug report.


++ irony as I was once told by CCP that they didn't accept game data from 3rd parties (UNIWiki) when I submitted a petition re an escalation trigger that seemed bugged. Roll
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#48 - 2016-05-03 01:21:04 UTC
Andski wrote:
Player-written documentation has always been superior to what CCP provides. Misleading, incorrect or incomplete information was far more prevalent in EVElopedia than on any decent player-run wiki, and the only people "vetting" the information on that wiki were ISD.

We already have eve-wiki.net and the EVE Uni wiki. Why create another one?

Most of the info in the 3rd party wiki's that you mentioned was copy/paste from Evelopedia.

Also most of the PvE info in Evelopedia was regularly updated by the playerbase. CCP ignored updating their 'Official' pages which were locked and those soon became as you say - misleading, incorrect or incomplete.



DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Buzz Orti
State War Academy
Caldari State
#49 - 2016-05-03 01:45:01 UTC
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Andski wrote:
Player-written documentation has always been superior to what CCP provides. Misleading, incorrect or incomplete information was far more prevalent in EVElopedia than on any decent player-run wiki, and the only people "vetting" the information on that wiki were ISD.

We already have eve-wiki.net and the EVE Uni wiki. Why create another one?

Most of the info in the 3rd party wiki's that you mentioned was copy/paste from Evelopedia.

Also most of the PvE info in Evelopedia was regularly updated by the playerbase. CCP ignored updating their 'Official' pages which were locked and those soon became as you say - misleading, incorrect or incomplete.



DMC

One could update the eve wikipedia, including players.
Some reasons why CCP would rather outsource the info is that, they keep their own records of it more secret to public now.
CCP (they) also get some benefit in having other entities keep info on the new game system.

There is less risk or less vulnerability of being coined as misleading, incorrect or incomplete, even if it does happen.
That is credit that they can put to their own use , even if someone tried to discredit them for it.

The CCP info on the patches and releases as well as discussion for new feature are published in their own places.
There is the EVE News, link or
http://updates.eveonline.com/

https://community.eveonline.com/news/patch-notes/patch-notes-for-eve-online-citadel

https://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/

...
Perfect examples (3) of how not to link to the EVE Online links and minimize server overload risks.
Do not do this at home.
Do not try this at home.
There is no try.

Builds ship in empty Quafe bottle.
Kenneth Endashi
Kor-Azor Slave Holdings
#50 - 2016-05-03 03:39:39 UTC
Hello, I run several websites professionally, and I'd like to make an offer.

If it's a hosting problem, then I will host the site on my own dime and operate it for free, for the community.

I give permission to the ISDs to give my contact information to developers for this purpose.

I don't want intellectual property rights or anything. I just want EVElopedia back and I'd be happy to run it for the community's benefit (and CCP's).

I hope that's all it is, and we can get the site back ourselves. I don't see why CCP would decline unless they're worried about us ******* it up.

Thanks, and good luck.
Geronimo McVain
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#51 - 2016-05-03 06:46:19 UTC
Kenneth Endashi wrote:
Hello, I run several websites professionally, and I'd like to make an offer.

If it's a hosting problem, then I will host the site on my own dime and operate it for free, for the community.

That's a generous offer but that's not the problem. It's who's job it is to make a manual. Search for the new Carriers: Uni-Wiki doesn't know them.
A s a new player I was searching how to upgrade my clone because a lot of websites stated, that this was really important........
I grinded faction standing to install my first jump clone........

Eve is lore wise at the moment par with Doom and Serious Sam. Something that is shaming for such an old and complex game.

CCP need to have all the infos to make a actual manual. Look at the announcements for the citadel patch. To condense all these Infos into a manual would take less then 1 day work for someone skilled (RLP). That's nothing.
They could start from the old evelopedia and put it into a new design and keep it actual. The main work was done a long time ago and keepinmg it up to date isn't really so much work.
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#52 - 2016-05-03 07:01:28 UTC
Yesterday I read this on the comments to a blog by Neville Smit:

Quote:

(...)
So I'd like to see a more obvious tutorial and better documentation from CCP. What company doesn't have documentation readily available for new players, explaining the UI you're presented with?
(...)


CCP, obviously. Lol
Buzz Orti
State War Academy
Caldari State
#53 - 2016-05-03 15:48:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Buzz Orti
Kenneth Endashi wrote:
Hello, I run several websites professionally, and I'd like to make an offer.

If it's a hosting problem, then I will host the site on my own dime and operate it for free, for the community.

I give permission to the ISDs to give my contact information to developers for this purpose.

I don't want intellectual property rights or anything. I just want EVElopedia back and I'd be happy to run it for the community's benefit (and CCP's).

I hope that's all it is, and we can get the site back ourselves. I don't see why CCP would decline unless they're worried about us ******* it up.

Thanks, and good luck.

There is the EVElopedia archive relic which, although I never managed to make it work yet, managed to download after around 5 tries or more.

I forgot the file format, but it may be an XML file or some other database type of file format.
It certainly is not an Excel file.

(let me check, brb)

the file is called:
Evelopedia Database Copy 2016-02-17.sql

and obviously should be an .sql file, Sequential Query Language, which is indeed used for database running on the SQL database language.

Builds ship in empty Quafe bottle.
Alessienne Ellecon
Doomheim
#54 - 2016-05-11 17:01:07 UTC
Encyclopaedia Nova Edenica is now online at neweden.wikia.com. Be aware that I will be running a tight ship, so if you want to contribute, it better be good. So far, I've sorted out the basic design and colour scheme, and created a streamlined navigation structure which is easily accessible from a single portal menu; one click and you've got the pertinent categories at your fingertips.

"CONCORD are the space cops. If you attack someone in a high-security solar system, CONCORD will commit police brutality." - Encyclopedia Dramatica

If EVE is a PvP game, then Anti-Ganking is emergent gameplay.
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