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Recurring Opportunities coming soon

First post
Author
Lugh Crow-Slave
#1661 - 2016-04-15 02:57:35 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Shallanna Yassavi wrote:
If the daily were "go out and get podded", it would be a lot more interesting. That's something you don't want to bring +5s to, and the low-level implant market would go wheeeeee!


would it? i would just stay in a dumb clone untill i needed to swap then go to jita in a pod and send a duel request


It's like some of the poster rightfully against this idea are also so triggered into a fit of hate they forget to use their brain to think for even a second how an EVE player would skirt around their proposed rule...


i know and leave it to CCP to use their brains right for once to understand exactly how players will use this change
Side1Bu2Rnz9
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1662 - 2016-04-15 03:01:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Side1Bu2Rnz9
CCP Rise wrote:
Okay, let's see if I can provide some context for our decision to add daily opportunities to eve and maybe answer some of your bigger questions.

Why Dailies?
So first lets talk a little history. EVE had a daily logon incentive for most of it's existence: the 24 hour skill queue limit. Back in Phoebe, we removed those limitations. Now, at the time, we were of two minds internally. We didn't like the experience around being punished for not logging in to update your queue, but also knew that some of those logins might be leading to meaningful gameplay and we shouldn't lightly let go of them. We leaned to the side of a better experience and removed the limitations, hoping that the logins we were generating were fairly empty, rarely leading to more actual activity in the universe. Well, it turns out we were wrong about that. Now, with before and after data we can see that making it into the client is a huge step towards real activity, even if the reason for logging in in the first place seems artificial. So this leads us to where we are now, attempting to find ways to create more logins that also don't feel like such a punishment as the skill queue limitations did. This may not turn out to be the perfect alternative but that's what we're looking for.


Have you ever stopped to consider maybe the meaningful game play decline is not because you introduces >24 hour training queues and more because the game "features" (aka jump fatigue, and fozzie sov) that people have been complaining about since their introduction? Seriously it's like you're trying to create more problems just in order to ignore your bigger **** ups..

I honestly have no idea why CCP seems to be soooo damn stupid and neglects to fix problems or just decides to ignore their customer base in favor of doing **** no body wants just because they can... NEWS FLASH CCP!! WE ARE YOUR CUSTOMERS! YOUR ONE JOB IS TO MAKE A GAME WE WANT TO PLAY. Creating "feature" that decrease that desire to play and then introducing "features" to force that play to cover up your failures is not only a terrible business plan, but utterly STUPID!
Lugh Crow-Slave
#1663 - 2016-04-15 03:10:49 UTC
Side1Bu2Rnz9 wrote:
CCP Rise wrote:
Okay, let's see if I can provide some context for our decision to add daily opportunities to eve and maybe answer some of your bigger questions.

Why Dailies?
So first lets talk a little history. EVE had a daily logon incentive for most of it's existence: the 24 hour skill queue limit. Back in Phoebe, we removed those limitations. Now, at the time, we were of two minds internally. We didn't like the experience around being punished for not logging in to update your queue, but also knew that some of those logins might be leading to meaningful gameplay and we shouldn't lightly let go of them. We leaned to the side of a better experience and removed the limitations, hoping that the logins we were generating were fairly empty, rarely leading to more actual activity in the universe. Well, it turns out we were wrong about that. Now, with before and after data we can see that making it into the client is a huge step towards real activity, even if the reason for logging in in the first place seems artificial. So this leads us to where we are now, attempting to find ways to create more logins that also don't feel like such a punishment as the skill queue limitations did. This may not turn out to be the perfect alternative but that's what we're looking for.


Have you ever stopped to consider maybe the meaningful game play decline is not because you introduces >24 hour training queues and more because the game "features" (aka jump fatigue, and fozzie sov) that people have been complaining about since their introduction? Seriously it's like you're trying to create more problems just in order to ignore your bigger **** ups..

I honestly have no idea why CCP seems to be soooo damn stupid and neglects to fix problems or just decides to ignore their customer base in favor of doing **** no body wants just because they can... NEWS FLASH CCP!! WE ARE YOUR CUSTOMERS! YOUR ONE JOB IS TO MAKE A GAME WE WANT TO PLAY. Creating "feature" that decrease that desire to play and then introducing "features" to force that play to cover up your failures is not only a terrible business plan, but utterly STUPID!


to be honest at least where im at (and i may be the exception) activity both capital and sub cap went up with fatigue because we weren't afraid we would be dropped on by pl. and Fozzie sov as an idea wasn't bad but they didn't keep up on tweaking it like they saud they would rather they left a half done mess to go work on the next thing
Side1Bu2Rnz9
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1664 - 2016-04-15 03:26:32 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Side1Bu2Rnz9 wrote:
CCP Rise wrote:
Okay, let's see if I can provide some context for our decision to add daily opportunities to eve and maybe answer some of your bigger questions.

Why Dailies?
So first lets talk a little history. EVE had a daily logon incentive for most of it's existence: the 24 hour skill queue limit. Back in Phoebe, we removed those limitations. Now, at the time, we were of two minds internally. We didn't like the experience around being punished for not logging in to update your queue, but also knew that some of those logins might be leading to meaningful gameplay and we shouldn't lightly let go of them. We leaned to the side of a better experience and removed the limitations, hoping that the logins we were generating were fairly empty, rarely leading to more actual activity in the universe. Well, it turns out we were wrong about that. Now, with before and after data we can see that making it into the client is a huge step towards real activity, even if the reason for logging in in the first place seems artificial. So this leads us to where we are now, attempting to find ways to create more logins that also don't feel like such a punishment as the skill queue limitations did. This may not turn out to be the perfect alternative but that's what we're looking for.


Have you ever stopped to consider maybe the meaningful game play decline is not because you introduces >24 hour training queues and more because the game "features" (aka jump fatigue, and fozzie sov) that people have been complaining about since their introduction? Seriously it's like you're trying to create more problems just in order to ignore your bigger **** ups..

I honestly have no idea why CCP seems to be soooo damn stupid and neglects to fix problems or just decides to ignore their customer base in favor of doing **** no body wants just because they can... NEWS FLASH CCP!! WE ARE YOUR CUSTOMERS! YOUR ONE JOB IS TO MAKE A GAME WE WANT TO PLAY. Creating "feature" that decrease that desire to play and then introducing "features" to force that play to cover up your failures is not only a terrible business plan, but utterly STUPID!


to be honest at least where im at (and i may be the exception) activity both capital and sub cap went up with fatigue because we weren't afraid we would be dropped on by pl. and Fozzie sov as an idea wasn't bad but they didn't keep up on tweaking it like they saud they would rather they left a half done mess to go work on the next thing


Yeah I don't disagree that these changes had some benefits but it also resulted in a lot of people I knew just losing interest in EVE and never logging back in. Also as you mentioned these changes could have been adjusted to make them playable but CCP decided to just ignore the problem and add bandaids instead of fixing/tweaking to problem away.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#1665 - 2016-04-15 03:37:17 UTC
also i want to point out that when ccp changed the queue there were ppl who pointed out that it would lead to lower log ins (i wont lie i was all for it. but had you told me the fee would have been dailies... oh how i wish i could turn back time)

ccp said they didn't believe that would be true.


so to fix this issue they are adding in something that the player base is pointing out will be bad for the game
Mikkal Rune
Doomheim
#1666 - 2016-04-15 03:50:39 UTC
I’m just going to have to learn to take skill points less seriously, so that it doesn’t bother me when I miss out on these little “rewards”. Because I’ll be damned if CCP is going to tell me how to play this game.
Pryce Caesar
Cloak and Daggers
The Initiative.
#1667 - 2016-04-15 04:02:21 UTC
Side1Bu2Rnz9 wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Side1Bu2Rnz9 wrote:
CCP Rise wrote:
Okay, let's see if I can provide some context for our decision to add daily opportunities to eve and maybe answer some of your bigger questions.

Why Dailies?
So first lets talk a little history. EVE had a daily logon incentive for most of it's existence: the 24 hour skill queue limit. Back in Phoebe, we removed those limitations. Now, at the time, we were of two minds internally. We didn't like the experience around being punished for not logging in to update your queue, but also knew that some of those logins might be leading to meaningful gameplay and we shouldn't lightly let go of them. We leaned to the side of a better experience and removed the limitations, hoping that the logins we were generating were fairly empty, rarely leading to more actual activity in the universe. Well, it turns out we were wrong about that. Now, with before and after data we can see that making it into the client is a huge step towards real activity, even if the reason for logging in in the first place seems artificial. So this leads us to where we are now, attempting to find ways to create more logins that also don't feel like such a punishment as the skill queue limitations did. This may not turn out to be the perfect alternative but that's what we're looking for.


Have you ever stopped to consider maybe the meaningful game play decline is not because you introduces >24 hour training queues and more because the game "features" (aka jump fatigue, and fozzie sov) that people have been complaining about since their introduction? Seriously it's like you're trying to create more problems just in order to ignore your bigger **** ups..

I honestly have no idea why CCP seems to be soooo damn stupid and neglects to fix problems or just decides to ignore their customer base in favor of doing **** no body wants just because they can... NEWS FLASH CCP!! WE ARE YOUR CUSTOMERS! YOUR ONE JOB IS TO MAKE A GAME WE WANT TO PLAY. Creating "feature" that decrease that desire to play and then introducing "features" to force that play to cover up your failures is not only a terrible business plan, but utterly STUPID!


to be honest at least where im at (and i may be the exception) activity both capital and sub cap went up with fatigue because we weren't afraid we would be dropped on by pl. and Fozzie sov as an idea wasn't bad but they didn't keep up on tweaking it like they saud they would rather they left a half done mess to go work on the next thing


Yeah I don't disagree that these changes had some benefits but it also resulted in a lot of people I knew just losing interest in EVE and never logging back in. Also as you mentioned these changes could have been adjusted to make them playable but CCP decided to just ignore the problem and add bandaids instead of fixing/tweaking to problem away.


If people logged out and never logged back in over something as simple as this, can they be said to have been so invested in EVE Online in the first place? Is one change really all that is required for some people to quit and never look back?

I find that rather disheartening, but perhaps I am just too new to Eve online as a whole. Dust had a system where players were rewarded skillpoints depending on what they accomplish in-game. Why is it so wrong in the main EVE game but perfectly fine over there?
NovaCat13
Seymourus and Co.
#1668 - 2016-04-15 04:11:08 UTC  |  Edited by: NovaCat13
Pryce Caesar wrote:

If people logged out and never logged back in over something as simple as this, can they be said to have been so invested in EVE Online in the first place? Is one change really all that is required for some people to quit and never look back?

I find that rather disheartening, but perhaps I am just too new to Eve online as a whole. Dust had a system where players were rewarded skillpoints depending on what they accomplish in-game. Why is it so wrong in the main EVE game but perfectly fine over there?



  • Dust was designed to be that way
  • Dust was free to play
  • Dust was an objective based shooter
  • EVE was not designed to be that way
  • EVE is not free to play
  • EVE is a sandbox

Just say NO to Dailies

Lugh Crow-Slave
#1669 - 2016-04-15 04:17:46 UTC
Pryce Caesar wrote:
Side1Bu2Rnz9 wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Side1Bu2Rnz9 wrote:
CCP Rise wrote:
Okay, let's see if I can provide some context for our decision to add daily opportunities to eve and maybe answer some of your bigger questions.

Why Dailies?
So first lets talk a little history. EVE had a daily logon incentive for most of it's existence: the 24 hour skill queue limit. Back in Phoebe, we removed those limitations. Now, at the time, we were of two minds internally. We didn't like the experience around being punished for not logging in to update your queue, but also knew that some of those logins might be leading to meaningful gameplay and we shouldn't lightly let go of them. We leaned to the side of a better experience and removed the limitations, hoping that the logins we were generating were fairly empty, rarely leading to more actual activity in the universe. Well, it turns out we were wrong about that. Now, with before and after data we can see that making it into the client is a huge step towards real activity, even if the reason for logging in in the first place seems artificial. So this leads us to where we are now, attempting to find ways to create more logins that also don't feel like such a punishment as the skill queue limitations did. This may not turn out to be the perfect alternative but that's what we're looking for.


Have you ever stopped to consider maybe the meaningful game play decline is not because you introduces >24 hour training queues and more because the game "features" (aka jump fatigue, and fozzie sov) that people have been complaining about since their introduction? Seriously it's like you're trying to create more problems just in order to ignore your bigger **** ups..

I honestly have no idea why CCP seems to be soooo damn stupid and neglects to fix problems or just decides to ignore their customer base in favor of doing **** no body wants just because they can... NEWS FLASH CCP!! WE ARE YOUR CUSTOMERS! YOUR ONE JOB IS TO MAKE A GAME WE WANT TO PLAY. Creating "feature" that decrease that desire to play and then introducing "features" to force that play to cover up your failures is not only a terrible business plan, but utterly STUPID!


to be honest at least where im at (and i may be the exception) activity both capital and sub cap went up with fatigue because we weren't afraid we would be dropped on by pl. and Fozzie sov as an idea wasn't bad but they didn't keep up on tweaking it like they saud they would rather they left a half done mess to go work on the next thing


Yeah I don't disagree that these changes had some benefits but it also resulted in a lot of people I knew just losing interest in EVE and never logging back in. Also as you mentioned these changes could have been adjusted to make them playable but CCP decided to just ignore the problem and add bandaids instead of fixing/tweaking to problem away.


If people logged out and never logged back in over something as simple as this, can they be said to have been so invested in EVE Online in the first place? Is one change really all that is required for some people to quit and never look back?

I find that rather disheartening, but perhaps I am just too new to Eve online as a whole. Dust had a system where players were rewarded skillpoints depending on what they accomplish in-game. Why is it so wrong in the main EVE game but perfectly fine over there?


it wasn't one change it was a slew of changes combined with a lack of faith that CCP still respected its player base as it started talking with them less and less and began to side line the CSM even harder than it had in the past
Manic Velocity
Bank Robbers
#1670 - 2016-04-15 04:29:19 UTC
CCP this is what you're doing to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPwkG2KEBjc

"The most punchable face in New Eden."

Be excellent to each other.

Twitter | Twitch | YouTube

Lugh Crow-Slave
#1671 - 2016-04-15 04:29:50 UTC
Mikkal Rune wrote:
I’m just going to have to learn to take skill points less seriously, so that it doesn’t bother me when I miss out on these little “rewards”. Because I’ll be damned if CCP is going to tell me how to play this game.


I'm not worried about you or me getting pulled in i'm worried about the adv player who is drawn to them. how long until there are so many to do that he turns down fleet to finish them
Lugh Crow-Slave
#1672 - 2016-04-15 04:44:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
Manic Velocity wrote:
CCP this is what you're doing to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPwkG2KEBjc



don't forget its 22hrs not dailies so not only do you need to log on every day to do this no its far more manipulative

you need to log in ever 22hrs ever second it takes you to do that is a second longer b4 you can run it again. rather than they reset at DT

just watch as the creep it down

22 ->15 ->10->4->1


pleas if anyone against this is going to fanfest please please talk to as many devs about why this is bad text on a screen can only go so far but face to face maybe we have a chance
NovaCat13
Seymourus and Co.
#1673 - 2016-04-15 04:56:50 UTC
Manic Velocity wrote:
CCP this is what you're doing to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPwkG2KEBjc


I feel this needs repeating.

Just say NO to Dailies

Lugh Crow-Slave
#1674 - 2016-04-15 05:02:50 UTC
NovaCat13 wrote:
Manic Velocity wrote:
CCP this is what you're doing to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPwkG2KEBjc


I feel this needs repeating.


i would keep quoting it if i thought ccp would watch it... or if i thought them watching it would change anything
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
Brave Collective
#1675 - 2016-04-15 05:39:30 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
NovaCat13 wrote:
Manic Velocity wrote:
CCP this is what you're doing to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPwkG2KEBjc


I feel this needs repeating.


i would keep quoting it if i thought ccp would watch it... or if i thought them watching it would change anything


Man I had this thought a while ago but sometime I really need to agree twice with you, like double-agree.

Also very, very much agree with Manic here, couldn't be said better.



EVERYONE QUOTE AND AGREE

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever

Lugh Crow-Slave
#1676 - 2016-04-15 06:00:27 UTC
elitatwo wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
NovaCat13 wrote:
Manic Velocity wrote:
CCP this is what you're doing to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPwkG2KEBjc


I feel this needs repeating.


i would keep quoting it if i thought ccp would watch it... or if i thought them watching it would change anything


Man I had this thought a while ago but sometime I really need to agree twice with you, like double-agree.

Also very, very much agree with Manic here, couldn't be said better.



EVERYONE QUOTE AND AGREE


any chance some one has the link to the other video made talking about why players feel so bad about this change? was a bit more scripted

maybe we can get them both seen by ccp
Mikkal Rune
Doomheim
#1677 - 2016-04-15 06:11:55 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
any chance some one has the link to the other video made talking about why players feel so bad about this change? was a bit more scripted

You mean this one?
Lugh Crow-Slave
#1678 - 2016-04-15 06:20:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
wrote:
wrote:
Manic Velocity wrote:
CCP this is what you're doing to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPwkG2KEBjc


I feel this needs repeating.




EVERYONE QUOTE AND AGREE


any chance some one has the link to the other video made talking about why players feel so bad about this change? was a bit more scripted

maybe we can get them both seen by ccp

Mikkal Rune wrote:

you mean this one?

exatly m8 Lol
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
#1679 - 2016-04-15 06:23:09 UTC
Manic Velocity wrote:
CCP this is what you're doing to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPwkG2KEBjc

First off all CCP wants to earn. For them more logins means more potential money. They are doing this game for some time now. It never attracted crowds. So they will implement mechnisms from other MMOs that will keep people to log on and maybe bring some new. PCU will grow, vets will leave, CCP will make money.

"I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas..." - Herman Melville

Lugh Crow-Slave
#1680 - 2016-04-15 06:34:54 UTC
Jeremiah Saken wrote:
Manic Velocity wrote:
CCP this is what you're doing to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPwkG2KEBjc

First off all CCP wants to earn. For them more logins means more potential money. They are doing this game for some time now. It never attracted crowds. So they will implement mechnisms from other MMOs that will keep people to log on and maybe bring some new. PCU will grow, vets will leave, CCP will make money.


i don't think anyone is questioning the motives it was even brought up inn the link you sent