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Author
Rain6639
Simulacra and Simulation
Dracarys.
#901 - 2016-04-11 00:52:25 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:

falcons pretty good about it to.. though i havent seen anything from him is he gone too?

As far as I know Falcon is still kicking. He's okay and he has that older brother type of thing going on but he's still not how Soundwave used to be, very forthcoming especially in person.
Shallanna Yassavi
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#902 - 2016-04-11 00:53:37 UTC
I've got an alternative way to put "free" SP in the mix which won't turn it into a daily grind:
With every skillbook comes enough SP to train it to level 2. It will be one-time and a lot more newbie-friendly, and won't be enough to be worth farming.

A signature :o

Lugh Crow-Slave
#903 - 2016-04-11 00:58:36 UTC
Rain6639 wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:

falcons pretty good about it to.. though i havent seen anything from him is he gone too?

As far as I know Falcon is still kicking. He's okay and he has that older brother type of thing going on but he's still not how Soundwave used to be, very forthcoming especially in person.


oh certainly not as good as soundwave but there is a chance with his still there to get a clear answer
Kovl
Jita Flipping Inc.
#904 - 2016-04-11 01:07:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Kovl
Dailies
Dailies
Dailies
Dailies

Dailies
Dailies
Dailies
Dailies


For those still wondering why it's bad. And 1 mob (erm 1 rat) is only the beginning.

Don't do this **** in this game please, no matter what "rewards" get applied (though we all know very well why SP was chosen).

Many people (especially new people for which SP is paramount and injectors are ISK-wise out of reach (whales aside) /and/ coming from other themepark games where a daily is literally a religion) /will/ be doing this **** around the clock, and repetivity will quicly make them hate it (and in turn EvE).
Zoltan Cole
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#905 - 2016-04-11 01:13:18 UTC
Moac Tor wrote:
Zoltan Cole wrote:
Yet, the net whole is more players online. That's neat -- the game progression being mostly offline is an absolutely awful design for an MMO

SP Progression happens offline, yet game progression certainly happens online (or at least online in the meta sense). Eve progression is a hard concept to grasp for most newbies, progression depends solely upon what goal you set yourself and not grinding towards some arbitrary level cap.

Progression for the majority of demographics is bigger and better stuff. If it seems so interesting, look it up; but trying to claim, in a situation where SP is patched in every other expansion, that there's no problem is just baseless.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#906 - 2016-04-11 01:21:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
Zoltan Cole wrote:
Moac Tor wrote:
Zoltan Cole wrote:
Yet, the net whole is more players online. That's neat -- the game progression being mostly offline is an absolutely awful design for an MMO

SP Progression happens offline, yet game progression certainly happens online (or at least online in the meta sense). Eve progression is a hard concept to grasp for most newbies, progression depends solely upon what goal you set yourself and not grinding towards some arbitrary level cap.

Progression for the majority of demographics is bigger and better stuff. If it seems so interesting, look it up; but trying to claim, in a situation where SP is patched in every other expansion, that there's no problem is just baseless.

\what?

not 100% sure what you said but progression is just moving forward with a goal


the idea that its something bigger and better is a little juvenile
Rain6639
Simulacra and Simulation
Dracarys.
#907 - 2016-04-11 01:27:42 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Rain6639 wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:

falcons pretty good about it to.. though i havent seen anything from him is he gone too?

As far as I know Falcon is still kicking. He's okay and he has that older brother type of thing going on but he's still not how Soundwave used to be, very forthcoming especially in person.


oh certainly not as good as soundwave but there is a chance with his still there to get a clear answer

watch fanfest and eve vegas presentations by both devs consecutively and tell me what you think
Zoltan Cole
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#908 - 2016-04-11 01:30:20 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Zoltan Cole wrote:
Moac Tor wrote:
SP Progression happens offline, yet game progression certainly happens online (or at least online in the meta sense). Eve progression is a hard concept to grasp for most newbies, progression depends solely upon what goal you set yourself and not grinding towards some arbitrary level cap.

Progression for the majority of demographics is bigger and better stuff. If it seems so interesting, look it up; but trying to claim, in a situation where SP is patched in every other expansion, that there's no problem is just baseless.

\what?

not 100% sure what you said but progression is just moving forward with a goal


the idea that its something bigger and better is a little juvenile

It's only "bigger and better" because that's how the game generally sets up progression rewards. Bigger ships are more effective at making ISK, and ordinarily at engaging multiple targets (because there's more of a chance they're smaller and weaker).

If that's juvenile, then so is this game.

The point is to experience the whole game..

Tippia wrote:
Sean Parisi wrote:
I don't want you to stop getting SP for being logged off - but what is wrong with providing a bit more acceleration for people who do actually engage in game?

Because it's not necessary. And in this particular case, mainly because the proposal does nothing of the kind — quite the opposite.

How is it not necessary? Why else would they add it.. As stated, with all the SP patching, there is a problem for keeping fresh characters subbed, clearly.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#909 - 2016-04-11 01:33:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
Zoltan Cole wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Zoltan Cole wrote:
Moac Tor wrote:
SP Progression happens offline, yet game progression certainly happens online (or at least online in the meta sense). Eve progression is a hard concept to grasp for most newbies, progression depends solely upon what goal you set yourself and not grinding towards some arbitrary level cap.

Progression for the majority of demographics is bigger and better stuff. If it seems so interesting, look it up; but trying to claim, in a situation where SP is patched in every other expansion, that there's no problem is just baseless.

\what?

not 100% sure what you said but progression is just moving forward with a goal


the idea that its something bigger and better is a little juvenile

It's only "bigger and better" because that's how the game generally sets up progression rewards. Bigger ships are more effective at making ISK, and ordinarily at engaging multiple targets (because there's more of a chance they're smaller and weaker).

If that's juvenile, then so is this game.

The point is to experience the whole game..



bigger ships are generally worse when it comes to pvp and a titan sure as hell is not the best thing at making isk

in eve bigger is not better

also what do you mean they keep patching sp?

they added in a cash grab and about a year ago altered starting sp that's it

this has nothing to do with an SP balance issue and most of us aren't even upset over the sp part

this is just a poorly vailed attempt to manipulate players into logging on and increasing their log in numbers
Caleb Seremshur
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#910 - 2016-04-11 01:34:09 UTC
Aka CCP looked at f2p games and their strategies to get people to log in. A free 5 hrs of sp just for logging in one a day and killing an npc? Sure. Easy done.
Zoltan Cole
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#911 - 2016-04-11 01:42:24 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Zoltan Cole wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Zoltan Cole wrote:
Moac Tor wrote:
SP Progression happens offline, yet game progression certainly happens online (or at least online in the meta sense). Eve progression is a hard concept to grasp for most newbies, progression depends solely upon what goal you set yourself and not grinding towards some arbitrary level cap.

Progression for the majority of demographics is bigger and better stuff. If it seems so interesting, look it up; but trying to claim, in a situation where SP is patched in every other expansion, that there's no problem is just baseless.

\what?

not 100% sure what you said but progression is just moving forward with a goal


the idea that its something bigger and better is a little juvenile

It's only "bigger and better" because that's how the game generally sets up progression rewards. Bigger ships are more effective at making ISK, and ordinarily at engaging multiple targets (because there's more of a chance they're smaller and weaker).

If that's juvenile, then so is this game.

The point is to experience the whole game..



bigger ships are generally worse when it comes to pvp and a titan sure as hell is not the best thing at making isk

in eve bigger is not better

also what do you mean they keep patching sp?

they added in a cash grab and about a year ago altered starting sp that's it

this has nothing to do with an SP balance issue and most of us aren't even upset over the sp part

this is just a poorly vailed attempt to manipulate players into logging on and increasing their log in numbers

A vague claim and a single example in no manner mitigates the whole trend. Larger (and more expensive) ships trend toward making more ISK, and no, flown properly, larger ships are not generally worse at PvP. That's because the meta has settled at T2s and T3s, so they're required to stay on field.

Increased starter SP.
SP trading.
SP for ratting.

Wew.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#912 - 2016-04-11 01:57:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
bigger ships are not better they are different

the reason cruisers tend to be flown more is because they are more versatile being able to handle both large and small ships along with not being too slow when roaming. the lack of speed and versatility is what makes larger ships less common in pvp

and blops titans dreads along with several t1 battle ships are not better at making isk than ships smaller and cheaper than them
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#913 - 2016-04-11 02:32:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Zoltan Cole wrote:
How is it not necessary?

Because engaging in the game has all kinds of rewards as it is. On top of that, adding skill progression to that list has already proven to create very perverse incentives that objectively make the game worse. We know this because it has already been attempted, with predictable results.

Quote:
Why else would they add it.

Because it artificially inflates one of their key metrics for success without them actually making any of the changes that would improve that metric by being successful. They're trying to bribe their way to success rather than do any actual work.

Quote:
If that's juvenile, then so is this game.

Bigger is not better in this game.
Wulfi Ozan
State War Academy
Caldari State
#914 - 2016-04-11 02:44:55 UTC
can we please stop trying to make the game easier.... your aready walking a fine line with the skill injectors and have a good SP sink there but please dont make us like wow for god sake NO!....

skill injectors in on the edge but okay because its still some guy training the skillpoints you are injecting but ny adding skillpoints out of the blue its just getting infladed.

Better idea get people to finnish all the tutorials and give them a reward for that if you need to help new players.

the reason it goes south for some mmo is because they make it too easy and people loose interest
Hopelesshobo
Hoboland
#915 - 2016-04-11 03:11:58 UTC
This really needs to be expanded to all forms of professions, and not be restricted to warping to a belt, killing a rat and logging off. All of the other choices should be just as easy as shooting a belt rat.

A few examples...
-Scanning any signature to 100%
-Put 1,000,000 isk worth of stuff on the market
-Completing a cycle on a mining laser
-Completing any mission
-Start or complete, research or production on a blueprint
etc

Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.

Mara Tessidar
Perkone
Caldari State
#916 - 2016-04-11 03:16:48 UTC
What a dumb mechanic. I play Eve to get away from grindy bullshit.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#917 - 2016-04-11 03:24:42 UTC
Hopelesshobo wrote:
This really needs to be expanded to all forms of professions, and not be restricted to warping to a belt, killing a rat and logging off. All of the other choices should be just as easy as shooting a belt rat.

A few examples...
-Scanning any signature to 100%
-Put 1,000,000 isk worth of stuff on the market
-Completing a cycle on a mining laser
-Completing any mission
-Start or complete, research or production on a blueprint
etc


no this really needs to not be implemented as there is no way to cover every play style in a balanced way
Rain6639
Simulacra and Simulation
Dracarys.
#918 - 2016-04-11 03:28:07 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Hopelesshobo wrote:
This really needs to be expanded to all forms of professions, and not be restricted to warping to a belt, killing a rat and logging off. All of the other choices should be just as easy as shooting a belt rat.

A few examples...
-Scanning any signature to 100%
-Put 1,000,000 isk worth of stuff on the market
-Completing a cycle on a mining laser
-Completing any mission
-Start or complete, research or production on a blueprint
etc


no this really needs to not be implemented as there is no way to cover every play style in a balanced way

I kind of thought it was a good point, perhaps the daily bonus could cycle between different tasks.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#919 - 2016-04-11 03:34:35 UTC
Rain6639 wrote:

I kind of thought it was a good point, perhaps the daily bonus could cycle between different tasks.



lol so not only does everyone now have to grind but now everyone needs to grind crap they have 0 interest in?
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#920 - 2016-04-11 04:20:11 UTC
Big Lynx wrote:
People who are moaning that they "have to" log in everyday to compete with others in this questionable skillpoint-race should immediatly switch of their computers, go out and in a silent moment start to address a question to themselves: "Do I really want to let a pc game control my every day life?" (indepentently from the question how CCP will assemble this mechanic)


We do turn off our computers and go outside, hence the issues with punishing people who don't play every day. Training SP has always been an equal playing field between people who play all day every day and people who can only play every so often, this free SP for logging in every day flies in the face of one of the big selling points of EVE.