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Citadels are now on Singularity

First post
Author
Eli Stan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#141 - 2016-03-23 02:15:05 UTC
A few things I've noticed with the March 22 update.


  1. When I take control of my Keepstar, I cannot activate damage modules like Standup AXL Missile Launcher. The message I get is "01:47:53 Notify Your ship is realigning its magnetic field, please wait a moment." even after many minutes. Isn't that the typical message for the undocking invulnerability? I can activate ewar and neuts and web without issue. Scram gives me "02:07:29 Notify You cannot activate Standup Warp Scrambler I whilst invulnerable."
  2. Fighters deployed by a character controlling a Citadel do not show up as purple for fleet members, including for the deploying character itself..
  3. Could be user error, but I cannot get bombs to launch from Heavy Fighters. I go through the targeting UI, but the bombs don't launch. The bomb button is then blinking, and if I try again I get this message "01:53:38 Notify Cannot activate the Ametat II Launch bomb ability again as it is already active."
  4. I'm unable to zoom the view of the Ship Hangar when in capital ships, so they appear overstuffed.
  5. When the station services is set skinny enough, the "View Outside Structure" label word-wraps on top of the "Station Services" label.
  6. When I select launched fighters via the fighter UI, there's no indication in space which fighter I have selected. When I click on a fighter in space, or from the overview, there's no selection of it in the fighter UI.
  7. Targeting range of Citadels is, graphically, represented as the distance from the center point of the Citadel. However, the overview range and the range checked for module activation seem to be from the tether ring of the Citadel.


And I LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE how the line drawn for overview items to the plane of one's ship is now curved such that it shows actual distance to that item. Don't ever ever ever change that please. The Homeworld-style targeting UI does not follow this paradigm, however. It's set-straight-out from center of ship, the set-straight-up/down from that distance. It should follow the curve of the sphere - as in, first set distance out, then set where on the sphere at that distance. It also would be nice to somehow be able to rotate the camera view with the targeting UI active - it's difficult to tell just what I'm pointing at otherwise.

I'm also a big fan of the red indication of optimal and falloff ranges for weapons.


Lugh Crow-Slave
#142 - 2016-03-23 03:52:18 UTC
For your number 4 issue it may be because capital ships are not supposed to be using the same hanger as the sub caps at least the CSM minutes talked about a second hanger interior for them so that may be why it is bugged (I however have no idea of this is the case still)


And another issue I found with the most recent patch is that the manual fighter control does not work for citadel fighters only carrier launched ones
Sabirah Seldanar
#143 - 2016-03-23 04:12:49 UTC
Posting our corp feedback after interacting with astraus and fortizar type of citadels:

1) Anchoring and deploying

After we launched the citadels from fleet hangar / freighter we had issues in moving it and rotating on the grid, most of the time we have been unable to move / rotate it and instead we moved the camera. Intuitively, we used the left and right mouse button on the citadel wireframe, as you did with pos structures in the past.

The undocking direction was not clear when we anchored; on our first deployment try, we faced a fortizar in very bad undocking direction (opposite of all system gates), and we found out we cannot change the direction of it once the anchoring order was given, nor once it was fully operational. Considering the decommission timer of 7 days, I would love to see some arrows on the wireframe of the citadel indicating the general undocking direction and / or the option to rotate it once operational. The latter maybe with a long cool down.

2) Fitting the citadel

It was not specified you had to sit in the driver seat to start the fitting process, but it was rather intuitive. The corpmate with the structure skills proceeded then to equip missile launchers, a couple of energy neut and a point defense in the high slots. The point defense module didn't active as intended stating the safety measure prevented it from activating, we didn't test however what would happen turning the security off (red).
We tested webbing, scrambling, neut, repulsion and tractor beam. The last two are not yet implemented, they did activate but nothing happened, the other modules performed their intended role.
We then tried to activate some services. The refinery couldn't be equipped while the cloning bay didn't turn on, as expected as they are not implemented.
We equipped the market and proceeded to turn it on. The service appeared in the citadel management tool, but not inside the citadel. We tried to make a market order, the corp mate commanding the citadel had not trading skills, and the item even it was at the same station required marketing I to be placed on sale; The error message he got was with his skill was limited to placing orders only the station. Once the order was placed it appeared on my sell orders, but it could not be found anywhere on the market. Either we didn't set properly the market authorizations or I don't know, I admit it was not very clear what we had to do, probably adding it to the market module description or in the ingame guide would be for the best.
From what we discovered the only way to turn off / on a service is by commanding the structure, maybe adding the option to the citadel management tool for directors to turn services on and off would be a good idea, since you don't need any skill for activating them and powergrid / cpu of the citadel is not affected by any skills.

3) Fighters
We did a bit of fighter testing, mainly hitting stationary targets. I really felt the lack of an "approach and orbit" command or a "keep at range", this coming from homeworld where i could have a fighter squadron following the battleship group. So far once you activate your weapons, the fighter slowboat (unless you use mwd or other tools) to it.
The fighters required no skill to operate, but that's probably something it's going to be fixed in later builds I guess.
It is no clear how many fighters are needed to make a full squadron until you load them.
For the rest the system seemed pretty solid.

4) Others
The citadel min zoom in is still too far in our opinion.

Hope it helps, we will update the more we test.
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
#144 - 2016-03-23 04:57:51 UTC
Not sure if this is intentional or not, but it does not appear to be possible to activate a Cyno while tethered. The only feedback when attempting to light the cyno is not very informative: "Your ship is realigning its magnetic field, please wait a moment."

Locking a target, in this case a jettisoned can, without any further action, causes the tether to drop allowing me to light the cyno within tethering range but remain untethered.
If I remove the can by looting it, the can pops, no timer, and tether re-enages (the cyno is not active).

This makes sense that you cannot light the cyno while tethered. So:

1 - Will it be possible to light a cyno and cause the tethering to break just as you can lock something and cause tethering to break?

2 - Will CCP create something similar to the Cynosural Generator Array for Citadels?

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.

Lugh Crow-Slave
#145 - 2016-03-23 08:10:34 UTC
Si currently you can't refit a citadel of it is damaged now this makes a lot of sense. However you also can't refit dieing reinforce between fights I think this needs to be a possibility to let defenders react to an aggressors fleet and of course allow for the offending fleet to try to put think a defender who now has 24hrs to refit and reorganize.


Basically being able to refit the citadel will greatly enhance the meta game involved in such sieges
Ayira Naydir
Doomheim
#146 - 2016-03-23 08:44:39 UTC
Since the Game didn't let me submit a Bug Report (Can't chose a Category) i gona Post it here:

I set up three Citadels, which finally anchored after the Timer Bug got sorted out, the Medium and Large are just fine, but the XL Keepstar was Damaged for some reason, and is now stuck in a "Secure: 0s" Timer since yesterday. I can't repair it, nor does it Repair itself as stated. I started anchoring a second one which will go up in 13~hours and see how this acts upon going online, because it also shows ~29% Armor damaged like the other already.

http://imageshack.com/a/img924/5807/Jd5xkC.png
To Highlight the Timer
Amak Boma
Dragon Factory
#147 - 2016-03-23 09:47:18 UTC
this also affect highsec citadels. just anchored one and it has some armor damage cant repair it because of this weird timer
CCP Claymore
C C P
C C P Alliance
#148 - 2016-03-23 10:01:03 UTC
NextDarkKnight wrote:
I noticed if I'm tethered to a citadel, if I eject it still shows my name as being in the ship and stays tethered.


This sounds like a bug, if you can reproduce it again please enter a bug report through the F12 menu.

Quality Assurance Analyst Team Psycho Sisters

CCP Claymore
C C P
C C P Alliance
#149 - 2016-03-23 10:03:24 UTC
LoisMustDie All-One-Word wrote:
Any special restrictions for anchoring in wormholes? Currently, moonlocking prevents hostiles from easily setting up a beachhead for an invasion. Is that defensive measure going away with the release of citadels?


Moon locking is going away

Quality Assurance Analyst Team Psycho Sisters

Lugh Crow-Slave
#150 - 2016-03-23 10:05:17 UTC
CCP Claymore wrote:
NextDarkKnight wrote:
I noticed if I'm tethered to a citadel, if I eject it still shows my name as being in the ship and stays tethered.


This sounds like a bug, if you can reproduce it again please enter a bug report through the F12 menu.


Does that mean empty ships will not be able to tether?
CCP Claymore
C C P
C C P Alliance
#151 - 2016-03-23 10:06:36 UTC
Mark O'Helm wrote:
I did my first brawl today with a yellow blinky skiff. https://imgur.com/6tBCdR7

-the anticapital-missles didnt shot(not even the charon, that i tried before), there were no antisubcap-missles on the market.
-the traktor and the repulsor had no noticible effect
-the skiff could not fight back. the hobs didnt wanted to shoot the fighters


-Did you activate the missiles? I am trying to get the antisubcap missiles seeded
-These are not actually implemented yet
-I will look into this. If a Citadel is not vulnerable then you can't shoot it, but the fighters you should be able to I think

Quality Assurance Analyst Team Psycho Sisters

CCP Claymore
C C P
C C P Alliance
#152 - 2016-03-23 10:07:10 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
CCP Claymore wrote:
NextDarkKnight wrote:
I noticed if I'm tethered to a citadel, if I eject it still shows my name as being in the ship and stays tethered.


This sounds like a bug, if you can reproduce it again please enter a bug report through the F12 menu.


Does that mean empty ships will not be able to tether?


Empty ships can't be tethered.

Quality Assurance Analyst Team Psycho Sisters

CCP Claymore
C C P
C C P Alliance
#153 - 2016-03-23 10:08:59 UTC
Phoenix4264 wrote:

  1. Combat probing Citadels - When probing Citadels if you scan one down to 100% and then scan another location the result will degrade back to an un-warpable state. This is the same behavior we currently have for ships and deployables, so this is understandable, but it would be preferable that these results remain without needing to bookmark them. Structures are essentially celestials and cannot move without being unanchored and reanchored which takes a significant amount of time unlike a ship warping around a system. In particular this would be helpful for scouting the locations of all structures in a system. I live in w-space, and we regularly scout and catalog the locations of hostile POSs when exploring new systems. POSs are currently tied to moons, so we can scout these without ever needing to use probes. With the new structures we will need to probe them down to locate and put eyes on the hostile staging structure. This is already going to announce our presence to the locals more than we needed to do with the old POS system, I would prefer to be able to drop probes, quickly scan the structures and pull my probes before needing to warp around to look at them or make bookmarks.

  2. Probing while tethered - Currently you cannot launch probes while tethered, you get an error stating that "Your ship is realigning its magnetic field, please wait a moment." However if I leave the tether, either by flying out of range or warping off, I can launch probes and then return to the safety of the tether and continue probing. I don't have a particular preference one way or the other, but I feel you either should be able to probe while tethered in which case launching probes should be allowed or it should be disallowed entirely as it is currently when inside POS forcefields.


1. Will raise with team.
2. I think I have already raised this with the team but honestly can't remember so will do it again.

Quality Assurance Analyst Team Psycho Sisters

Grookshank
V0LTA
WE FORM V0LTA
#154 - 2016-03-23 10:11:32 UTC
Can we please have a confirmation on citadels in Thera? It was stated they will not be allowed in shattered wormhole systems, but they currently work in Thera on SISI.
CCP Claymore
C C P
C C P Alliance
#155 - 2016-03-23 10:14:07 UTC
Eli Stan wrote:
A few things I've noticed with the March 22 update.


  1. When I take control of my Keepstar, I cannot activate damage modules like Standup AXL Missile Launcher. The message I get is "01:47:53 Notify Your ship is realigning its magnetic field, please wait a moment." even after many minutes. Isn't that the typical message for the undocking invulnerability? I can activate ewar and neuts and web without issue. Scram gives me "02:07:29 Notify You cannot activate Standup Warp Scrambler I whilst invulnerable."
  2. Fighters deployed by a character controlling a Citadel do not show up as purple for fleet members, including for the deploying character itself..
  3. Could be user error, but I cannot get bombs to launch from Heavy Fighters. I go through the targeting UI, but the bombs don't launch. The bomb button is then blinking, and if I try again I get this message "01:53:38 Notify Cannot activate the Ametat II Launch bomb ability again as it is already active."
  4. I'm unable to zoom the view of the Ship Hangar when in capital ships, so they appear overstuffed.
  5. When the station services is set skinny enough, the "View Outside Structure" label word-wraps on top of the "Station Services" label.
  6. When I select launched fighters via the fighter UI, there's no indication in space which fighter I have selected. When I click on a fighter in space, or from the overview, there's no selection of it in the fighter UI.
  7. Targeting range of Citadels is, graphically, represented as the distance from the center point of the Citadel. However, the overview range and the range checked for module activation seem to be from the tether ring of the Citadel.


And I LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE how the line drawn for overview items to the plane of one's ship is now curved such that it shows actual distance to that item. Don't ever ever ever change that please. The Homeworld-style targeting UI does not follow this paradigm, however. It's set-straight-out from center of ship, the set-straight-up/down from that distance. It should follow the curve of the sphere - as in, first set distance out, then set where on the sphere at that distance. It also would be nice to somehow be able to rotate the camera view with the targeting UI active - it's difficult to tell just what I'm pointing at otherwise.

I'm also a big fan of the red indication of optimal and falloff ranges for weapons.




1. Will take a look as this is the second report I am reading of the missiles not working.
2. I will take a look
3. Will raise this with appropriate team
4. Capitals should be the same func as currently on TQ, supers and titans should not be able to move the camera at all in their hangar
5. Will raise this with appropriate team
6. I will take a look at this.

Quality Assurance Analyst Team Psycho Sisters

CCP Claymore
C C P
C C P Alliance
#156 - 2016-03-23 10:16:52 UTC
Petrified wrote:
Not sure if this is intentional or not, but it does not appear to be possible to activate a Cyno while tethered. The only feedback when attempting to light the cyno is not very informative: "Your ship is realigning its magnetic field, please wait a moment."

Locking a target, in this case a jettisoned can, without any further action, causes the tether to drop allowing me to light the cyno within tethering range but remain untethered.
If I remove the can by looting it, the can pops, no timer, and tether re-enages (the cyno is not active).

This makes sense that you cannot light the cyno while tethered. So:

1 - Will it be possible to light a cyno and cause the tethering to break just as you can lock something and cause tethering to break?

2 - Will CCP create something similar to the Cynosural Generator Array for Citadels?


Cyno not working is something we are looking at. Just not implemented yet.

There will not be an alternative to Cynosural Generator Array on first release.

Quality Assurance Analyst Team Psycho Sisters

Lugh Crow-Slave
#157 - 2016-03-23 10:17:18 UTC
CCP Claymore wrote:
Phoenix4264 wrote:

  1. Combat probing Citadels - When probing Citadels if you scan one down to 100% and then scan another location the result will degrade back to an un-warpable state. This is the same behavior we currently have for ships and deployables, so this is understandable, but it would be preferable that these results remain without needing to bookmark them. Structures are essentially celestials and cannot move without being unanchored and reanchored which takes a significant amount of time unlike a ship warping around a system. In particular this would be helpful for scouting the locations of all structures in a system. I live in w-space, and we regularly scout and catalog the locations of hostile POSs when exploring new systems. POSs are currently tied to moons, so we can scout these without ever needing to use probes. With the new structures we will need to probe them down to locate and put eyes on the hostile staging structure. This is already going to announce our presence to the locals more than we needed to do with the old POS system, I would prefer to be able to drop probes, quickly scan the structures and pull my probes before needing to warp around to look at them or make bookmarks.

  2. Probing while tethered - Currently you cannot launch probes while tethered, you get an error stating that "Your ship is realigning its magnetic field, please wait a moment." However if I leave the tether, either by flying out of range or warping off, I can launch probes and then return to the safety of the tether and continue probing. I don't have a particular preference one way or the other, but I feel you either should be able to probe while tethered in which case launching probes should be allowed or it should be disallowed entirely as it is currently when inside POS forcefields.


1. Will raise with team.
2. I think I have already raised this with the team but honestly can't remember so will do it again.


Number two is currently how pos work of you launch probes outside the ff you can fly back in and continue


And with not being able to tether unmanned ships why is that (doesn't really bother me) currently I can put up a small pos and leave a capital just sitting there if I choose
CCP Claymore
C C P
C C P Alliance
#158 - 2016-03-23 10:17:52 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Si currently you can't refit a citadel of it is damaged now this makes a lot of sense. However you also can't refit dieing reinforce between fights I think this needs to be a possibility to let defenders react to an aggressors fleet and of course allow for the offending fleet to try to put think a defender who now has 24hrs to refit and reorganize.


Basically being able to refit the citadel will greatly enhance the meta game involved in such sieges


Good point, will raise with team. This might just be a bug tbh.

Quality Assurance Analyst Team Psycho Sisters

CCP Claymore
C C P
C C P Alliance
#159 - 2016-03-23 10:19:39 UTC
Grookshank wrote:
Can we please have a confirmation on citadels in Thera? It was stated they will not be allowed in shattered wormhole systems, but they currently work in Thera on SISI.


They will not be allowed.

We have just not implemented the restrictions yet.

Quality Assurance Analyst Team Psycho Sisters

Amak Boma
Dragon Factory
#160 - 2016-03-23 10:32:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Amak Boma
CCP Claymore wrote:
Grookshank wrote:
Can we please have a confirmation on citadels in Thera? It was stated they will not be allowed in shattered wormhole systems, but they currently work in Thera on SISI.


They will not be allowed.

We have just not implemented the restrictions yet.



kind of bad idea. why not let us have shattered wormhole restriction only to medium citadels? only these could be anchored as poses have no moon . med citadel could be handy we know wormholes never intended to be place to live in them but we do so why not give shattered wormhole a medium citadel? what is wrong with this. maybe add some negative effects sush 20% armor/shield/hull amount on citadels in shattered wormhole reduction 20% reduced damage done by citadel weapon systems in shattered wormholes? something like that but to be honest citadels in shattered wormholes could give another ignition effect for more wormhole wars. so my proposal is

1. shattered wormholes allowed to house only medium citadels
2. 20% reduced of damage done by citadel weapons
3. 25% citadel armor hull shield amounts reduced
4/ shattered wormhole citadels will be vulnerable all time
5. sleepers can attack your citadel if its 500km from anomaly sites

so if you want to have citadel in shatered wormhole you need group of players either to defend it or attack another citadel