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[Citadels Release] Capital Ship changes reaching Singularity!

First post
Author
Lugh Crow-Slave
#221 - 2016-03-25 16:55:50 UTC
any chance we can get the markets outside 6-c seeded with the new mods as well?
Marranar Amatin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#222 - 2016-03-25 18:02:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Marranar Amatin
A few possible bugs:

-It can happen that a fighter orbits one target, but tries to shoot a different one, causing it to do 0 damage because it is too far away. This was with templar, and probably caused by firing a missile salvo on a different target.

-It can happen that the microwarpdrive shows the "active" animation instead of the "cooldown" animation. no idea why, but the same fighter kept showing that behaviour.

-when activating rockets on a target out of range (either missile salvo or micro missile swarm) this is interpreted as "orbit" command, the launcher immeditely deactivates again

-the damage of gram (and maybe the other small fighters) is broken. The tooltip says 85 hp per fighter. so a full squadron should do 1020 damage per salvo. It does 69 against a battleship with 79% explo resists. With 15m explo radius and 300m/s explosion speed it should do 214 damage against this target.
(edit: it should be noted that the 85 hp damage from the tooltip is before any bonus... I was using a char with almost all relevant skills on V, a thanatos full with drone damage amplifier and fighters support units. so there is a huge amount of damage missing, not "only" the difference from 214 to 69)

__________


A different point that is not really a bug but a design question:

With the current version, carrier became completely useless in pve. Is this on purpose?

On tranquility there are two ways to use carrier in pve:
-with sentries as mostly afk ship
-with fighters as high damage ship

The first option is obviously gone without a drone bay.
The second option is also gone, since the damage in pve is horrible. It took me 27 minutes to finish a sanctum. That resulted in a 28 mio tick (and it will be even worse if npc attack fighters). Thats horrible, I can make ~50 mio ticks on tranqu. 28 mio is what a cheap rattle can do. There would be no reason ever to fly a super expensive carrier, that has to replace expensive fighters and is slow as a brick, when a cheap bs can do the job just as well.


Could you please clarify if that is on purpose?
Lugh Crow-Slave
#223 - 2016-03-25 18:05:48 UTC
Marranar Amatin wrote:


Could you please clarify if that is on purpose?


asked ccp that when dealing with if they were meant to be used against capitals at all (atm they cant hurt capitals)

the response i got back was "we are expressly not telling what we expect these to be used for"
Lugh Crow-Slave
#224 - 2016-03-25 19:17:00 UTC
so quick question.....

is the phoenix meant to have a turret point?

i mean i dont think it would hurt anything and it is a nice call back to old caldari layouts but is it supposed to be there
Lugh Crow-Slave
#225 - 2016-03-25 20:31:04 UTC
CCP Lebowski wrote:

  • Fixed various text errors


  • want to try for round 2?


    in the mean time what is the skill supposed to be

    5% to both vel and damage or 5 % just to one of them
    Captain Semper
    Fusion Enterprises Ltd
    Pandemic Horde
    #226 - 2016-03-25 20:39:23 UTC
    Marranar Amatin wrote:
    A few possible bugs:

    On tranquility there are two ways to use carrier in pve:
    -with sentries as mostly afk ship
    -with fighters as high damage ship

    The first option is obviously gone without a drone bay.
    The second option is also gone, since the damage in pve is horrible. It took me 27 minutes to finish a sanctum. That resulted in a 28 mio tick (and it will be even worse if npc attack fighters). Thats horrible, I can make ~50 mio ticks on tranqu. 28 mio is what a cheap rattle can do. There would be no reason ever to fly a super expensive carrier, that has to replace expensive fighters and is slow as a brick, when a cheap bs can do the job just as well.


    Could you please clarify if that is on purpose?

    Carrier have ~1,5-2k DPS. Its pretty ok.

    Also look

    https://youtu.be/sgHZfXcl8Vg
    Marranar Amatin
    Center for Advanced Studies
    Gallente Federation
    #227 - 2016-03-25 21:01:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Marranar Amatin
    No that is not ok. You cant just post random numbers and then claim its ok. I just explained why its not ok, and just posting some dps numbers does not refute any of that.



    Also the video that you posted is a super carrier. They are much much better, so you can not compare this at all.


    another bug:
    cant unload fighters from tube when docked. works fine when undocked.
    also cant load when docked... strange, it worked before.

    also:
    5 drone navigation comps stops the drones mwd from working. Is there some kind of speed limit? I think the fifth one might boost the mwd speed just above 10km/s.
    Oxide Ammar
    #228 - 2016-03-25 21:50:10 UTC
    Can someone confirm pls that DDA don't affect light or heavy fighters anymore ?

    Lady Areola Fappington:  Solo PVP isn't dead!  You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.

    Circumstantial Evidence
    #229 - 2016-03-25 22:04:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Circumstantial Evidence
    [nothing to see here]
    Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
    CK-0FF
    Intergalactic Space Hobos
    #230 - 2016-03-25 22:13:47 UTC
    Oxide Ammar wrote:
    Can someone confirm pls that DDA don't affect light or heavy fighters anymore ?

    They did on SiSi yesterday.
    Lugh Crow-Slave
    #231 - 2016-03-25 23:06:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
    Marranar Amatin wrote:
    No that is not ok. You cant just post random numbers and then claim its ok. I just explained why its not ok, and just posting some dps numbers does not refute any of that.






    no it is ok. why because if a capital loses the ability to rat then thats OK if they hasn't then it makes no diferance
    Marranar Amatin
    Center for Advanced Studies
    Gallente Federation
    #232 - 2016-03-25 23:36:36 UTC
    care to explain why it is ok if caps loose the ability to rat? Just because you dont like to do this?

    There are many people that like to do so, and invested a lot of skillpoints and isk specifically for ratting in capitals. Taking that away just because you dont care about it, is awful.

    Hey I have a great idea, lets reduce titan hp to 1/1/1 with zero resists. I dont have one, so if they are not useable afterwards thats ok.

    Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
    CK-0FF
    Intergalactic Space Hobos
    #233 - 2016-03-25 23:37:46 UTC
    Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
    Marranar Amatin wrote:
    No that is not ok. You cant just post random numbers and then claim its ok. I just explained why its not ok, and just posting some dps numbers does not refute any of that.






    no it is ok. why because if a capital loses the ability to rat then thats OK if they hasn't then it makes no diferance

    And if everyone quits the game and goes elsewhere that's OK too.
    Eli Stan
    Center for Advanced Studies
    Gallente Federation
    #234 - 2016-03-26 00:11:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Eli Stan
    All numbers are still very much in flux, and CCP aren't talking about their plans. We're still in the phase of bug hunting and testing functionality. The time to worry about ratting ticks will be later.
    Lugh Crow-Slave
    #235 - 2016-03-26 00:33:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
    Marranar Amatin wrote:
    care to explain why it is ok if caps loose the ability to rat? Just because you dont like to do this?

    There are many people that like to do so, and invested a lot of skillpoints and isk specifically for ratting in capitals. Taking that away just because you dont care about it, is awful.

    Hey I have a great idea, lets reduce titan hp to 1/1/1 with zero resists. I dont have one, so if they are not useable afterwards thats ok.




    no because it is far more important to balance how these things work against other players rather than how they work against npcs

    its far worse to have a ship that is good for ratting but broken in pvp than a ship that is balanced in pvp but cant rat

    mission and ratting pay out can be adjusted if it has a huge impact

    trust me i want these things out ratting they are one of the best targets to blops onto but i dont want that at the expense of ballance
    Osat Bartlett
    your mouse sensitivity is low
    Platinum Sensitivity.
    #236 - 2016-03-26 03:32:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Osat Bartlett
    I guess that "Remote Repair Impedance" that siege and triage have as bonus don't work as planed.
    I've tested in Sisi. And I've confirmed that siegeDN and triageFAX can receive not only cap transfer(Is it included in remote assistance?),but also remote repair.
    I wonder if that "Remote Assistance Impedance" don't work too.

    Japan Wiki administrator

    Lugh Crow-Slave
    #237 - 2016-03-26 04:01:00 UTC
    Osat Bartlett wrote:
    I guess that "Remote Repair Impedance" that siege and triage have as bonus don't work as planed.
    I've tested in Sisi. And I've confirmed that siegeDN and triageCV receive not only cap transfer(Is it included in remote assistance?),but also remote repair.
    I wonder if that "Remote Assistance Impedance" don't work too.



    you can still triage CVs? thats def a bug
    Osat Bartlett
    your mouse sensitivity is low
    Platinum Sensitivity.
    #238 - 2016-03-26 04:49:49 UTC
    Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
    Osat Bartlett wrote:
    I guess that "Remote Repair Impedance" that siege and triage have as bonus don't work as planed.
    I've tested in Sisi. And I've confirmed that siegeDN and triageCV receive not only cap transfer(Is it included in remote assistance?),but also remote repair.
    I wonder if that "Remote Assistance Impedance" don't work too.



    you can still triage CVs? thats def a bug


    Oh,sorry. I made a correction.

    Japan Wiki administrator

    Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
    CK-0FF
    Intergalactic Space Hobos
    #239 - 2016-03-26 05:24:05 UTC
    Osat Bartlett wrote:
    I guess that "Remote Repair Impedance" that siege and triage have as bonus don't work as planed.
    I've tested in Sisi. And I've confirmed that siegeDN and triageFAX can receive not only cap transfer(Is it included in remote assistance?),but also remote repair.
    I wonder if that "Remote Assistance Impedance" don't work too.

    I can't check right now, but is the impedance 100%? If not, they should be valid targets for those effects and receive a certain percentage of the effects.
    Crazy KSK
    Tsunami Cartel
    #240 - 2016-03-26 05:50:41 UTC
    Modules:
    The duration of Triage and Siege feels far too long considering the reduction of hp on capitals, It is pretty much impossible to go in and out of triage as a combat tactic, module cycle time should be reduced.
    The Emergency hull energizer over a rep or plate doesn't feel worth it, It should use less power grid.
    Flex hardeners would be more interesting if they gave less resist but where not restricted to one module.

    Caps:
    All capitals powergrid feels too low with all the new modules added, power grid should be increased.
    The Nidhoggur cpu is too low to fit all slots without a lot of fitting modules.
    The Nidhoggurs cargo is so small it can only hold 8 navy 3200 cap boosters no enough to full load an asb.
    Active tank on carriers feels weak just like it does on super caps, Overall base line of capital active tanking modules should be looked at.

    Fighters:
    Heavy attack fighter torpedos do too much alpha, It feels too powerful against active tanked capitals (alpha is also just not a fun mechanic), Reduce alpha of torpedoes and increase fire rate and ammo count, also increase normal dps it feels too low.
    Space superiority fighters do too much dps against fighters the crazy tackle they have is strong enough they don't also need crazy dps.

    Misc:
    With all the clicking around in space there needs to be a way to lock alignment so you can't accidentally unalign yourself
    The 3d aiming systems feels pretty clunky not to mention that you can't turn the camera while using it, I suggest replacing the target marker with a probe with arrows and such.

    side note: Please add every item in a ship, be it in what ever cargo hold it is, to the saved fitting. Many Thanks.


    Quote CCP Fozzie: ... The days of balance and forget are over.