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WoD, etc really screwed us

Author
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#21 - 2016-02-24 17:37:50 UTC
SurrenderMonkey wrote:
I take it you're a "millennial", OP?

Just based on the fact that you think that your $15 monthly expenditure entitles you to tell CCP how to run their company.


Dude, do you run around the forums posting this same post in every thread?

Also, yes, it kinda does. It's called Customer Feedback. And without things like the Summer of Rage, we would indeed be playing Space-Barbie, paying $1000 for vanity items, and buying gold ammo from the NEX.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY

stg slate
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#22 - 2016-02-24 17:47:12 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:

Your type is typical of any forum (hell, humanity in general). If someone else does something, why they are jsut being arrogant know it alls,. but if YOU do the same thing (and many would agree that your op here is worse than anything I've every said about CCP), well, that's perfectly ok.

You're simply a hypocrite, When others have problems with what CCP is doing, you jump all over them as if CCP is perfect, but then you have a problem with CCP and think it's legitimate. Don't get mad at me or others for pointing that out, you're the one with the problems.


I say EVE could be different, and wonder how it could been. I do not claim I understand the game better than they do.

Every post you make on these forums you speak from superior as if you know better than them and they just don't listen to you.

I agree I do not run a game company and I don't know how to make it better, just wish it was. Wondering what it would have been like if things were different and they spent time different is not some huge criticism of CCP.

You hate all the recent game changes so badly, Fozzie Sov, Jump Fatigue, SP trading, Dev Blogs, at least they are working on the game and iterating over design. Not touching the game at all is stagnation and death.

Big difference.
Jenn aSide
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#23 - 2016-02-24 18:16:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenn aSide
stg slate wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:

Your type is typical of any forum (hell, humanity in general). If someone else does something, why they are jsut being arrogant know it alls,. but if YOU do the same thing (and many would agree that your op here is worse than anything I've every said about CCP), well, that's perfectly ok.

You're simply a hypocrite, When others have problems with what CCP is doing, you jump all over them as if CCP is perfect, but then you have a problem with CCP and think it's legitimate. Don't get mad at me or others for pointing that out, you're the one with the problems.


I say EVE could be different, and wonder how it could been. I do not claim I understand the game better than they do.

Every post you make on these forums you speak from superior as if you know better than them and they just don't listen to you.

I agree I do not run a game company and I don't know how to make it better, just wish it was. Wondering what it would have been like if things were different and they spent time different is not some huge criticism of CCP.

You hate all the recent game changes so badly, Fozzie Sov, Jump Fatigue, SP trading, Dev Blogs, at least they are working on the game and iterating over design. Not touching the game at all is stagnation and death.

Big difference.


blah blah it's different when I do it blah.

You specifically named things CCP did, the specifically suggested that CCP could have taken those resources and did things you would like. That's no different at all from me saying something CCP did could have been different. And no one said anything about not touching the game, all I've ever said is that CCP needs to be smart about changes and reexamine their thinking from time to time, because lately they've done some falling short (example here).

You've said in the past English isn't your native tongue, so I'll give you a small benefit of the doubt here because you may not understand exactly how what you are saying comes across. But only a small one, because if you don't know what you are saying in a given language, it's usually best to STFU until you learn it better.
SurrenderMonkey
The Exchange Collective
Solyaris Chtonium
#24 - 2016-02-24 18:16:57 UTC
Soldarius wrote:
SurrenderMonkey wrote:
I take it you're a "millennial", OP?

Just based on the fact that you think that your $15 monthly expenditure entitles you to tell CCP how to run their company.


Dude, do you run around the forums posting this same post in every thread?

Also, yes, it kinda does. It's called Customer Feedback. And without things like the Summer of Rage, we would indeed be playing Space-Barbie, paying $1000 for vanity items, and buying gold ammo from the NEX.



It's almost like there are a lot of entitled brats whining about how they've been "screwed" today.

PS: Come on back to the command ships thread, you owe me an apology for your inability to math.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/

stg slate
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#25 - 2016-02-24 18:25:10 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
because of you don't know what you are saying in a given language, it's usually best to STFU until you learn it better.


This is the sort of racist treatment always comes. I will leave for other language communities and no longer post here.

Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#26 - 2016-02-24 18:59:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Crosi Wesdo
Alissa Solette wrote:
I do agree with you in principle. I think the biggest mistake was to make Dust console-only (especially since all EVE players already own a PC and would be the most likely candidates to at least give Dust a try).

But at least CCP learnt their lesson and are not going to repeat the mistake by making Valkyrie only run on 500+ dollar proprietary hardware that you need to buy first.... Oh wait.

And don't even get me started on WoD... when I think about all those man-years of dev time that was wasted on Incarna (which was mainly done to create and beta-test a 3d engine that supports digital eyelash rendering for use in WoD) then it really makes me sad.


Being on consoles might have been a problem but i dont think so really. Lots of people play FPS on consoles. The problem was it was not a very good FPS. Sure it might have more depth than CoD, but depth doesnt keep you coming back to an FPS, fast, exciting and immersive gameplay does. Not clunky and generic gameplay with dated graphics.

Also, the idea that you could have an FPS follow EVEs path and expect people to still be playing it along side EVE a decade down the line has to be the single worst business expectation in human history. It shows a complete lack of understanding of the market cycles in that genre and a cancer in CCP where people must have pointed this out but were ignored.

There is a reason that the top FPS franchises release a new title every single year.
Ibutho Inkosi
Doomheim
#27 - 2016-02-24 19:23:46 UTC
stg slate wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
because of you don't know what you are saying in a given language, it's usually best to STFU until you learn it better.
This is the sort of racist treatment always comes. I will leave for other language communities and no longer post here.
Wait...you started this here. Now you LEAVE? By the way, the language thing is "cultural" not "racial". Maybe a better handle on the language you're arguing in is in order.

As long as the tale of the hunt is told by the hunter, and not the lion, it will favor the hunter.

Sugilite
Perkone
Caldari State
#28 - 2016-02-24 19:24:25 UTC
Imagine if they had spent their time with an experienced fps team/devoloper making a Dust PC game instead of that console game Roll
Sugilite
Perkone
Caldari State
#29 - 2016-02-24 19:26:16 UTC
Crosi Wesdo wrote:

There is a reason that the top FPS franchises release a new title every single year.

Yeah, like tf2, quake and counter strike.
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#30 - 2016-02-24 19:28:08 UTC
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Alissa Solette wrote:
I do agree with you in principle. I think the biggest mistake was to make Dust console-only (especially since all EVE players already own a PC and would be the most likely candidates to at least give Dust a try).

But at least CCP learnt their lesson and are not going to repeat the mistake by making Valkyrie only run on 500+ dollar proprietary hardware that you need to buy first.... Oh wait.

And don't even get me started on WoD... when I think about all those man-years of dev time that was wasted on Incarna (which was mainly done to create and beta-test a 3d engine that supports digital eyelash rendering for use in WoD) then it really makes me sad.


Being on consoles might have been a problem but i dont think so really. Lots of people play FPS on consoles. The problem was it was not a very good FPS. Sure it might have more depth than CoD, but depth doesnt keep you coming back to an FPS, fast, exciting and immersive gameplay does. Not clunky and generic gameplay with dated graphics.

Also, the idea that you could have an FPS follow EVEs path and expect people to still be playing it along side EVE a decade down the line has to be the single worst business expectation in human history. It shows a complete lack of understanding of the market cycles in that genre and a cancer in CCP where people must have pointed this out but were ignored.

There is a reason that the top FPS franchises release a new title every single year.


The "big player" in the FPS game market are also some of the most criticized corporation in the gaming industry while essentially releasing block buster year after years because people still buy them. It's really a market pretty much nobody ever "get".
Ian Morbius
Potomac Greeting Card Company
#31 - 2016-02-24 19:31:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Ian Morbius
World of Darkness, and Dust514 have came and gone. No reason to be ashamed at attempting, and failing at doing great things.

Good job, CCP Games.
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#32 - 2016-02-24 19:35:38 UTC
Sugilite wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:

There is a reason that the top FPS franchises release a new title every single year.

Yeah, like tf2, quake and counter strike.


2 games from Valve with cosmetic shops and from from a franchise who hasn't done anything since 2007. Good picks...
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#33 - 2016-02-24 19:49:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Crosi Wesdo
Frostys Virpio wrote:

The "big player" in the FPS game market are also some of the most criticized corporation in the gaming industry while essentially releasing block buster year after years because people still buy them. It's really a market pretty much nobody ever "get".


Ground breaking graphics, new gimmicks in gameplay, big name with a now huge loyal playerbase and a fresh title every year will make up for a tiny fraction of people who complain about DRM or some companies customer service.

Most people just want to play a game, but most of all they want to know what to expect when they throw AAA cash at a game. There is comfort in familiarity.
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#34 - 2016-02-24 19:57:04 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Droidster wrote:


I think most of the EVE community is with you in wanting the development company to focus on the core aspects of EVE.



CCP focusing on EVE has given us Aegis/Fozzie Sov (which people are still equating to some very deadly RL deseases, I've heard it called EbolacancerAids on teamspeak), Jump Fatigue that makes moving around harder for individuals while giving groups like Goons and PL unassailable local super-cap superiority (so much so that PL is dropping super carriers on CRUISERS lol) and SP trading whIch stands to possible upend the entire culture of the EVE Community. And the latest Dev Blog about security is an incredible mess

If that's what CCP focusing on the game gets us, I hope to BoB they find something else to focus on soon. I'd rather they renew interest on Incarna than give us more of this recent stuff....



I;'m going to give you a counter argument. All the things, minus skill trading you listed, Jump fatigue, Fozzie sov, etc are thigns the eve community have been asking to have happen for years now. You cna search and find people pissing and moaning bout 'power projection' 'hot drops' how this stuff is cancer. People crying about how dominion sov is broken. This is currently ccp giving the customer what they asked for. And brings up an VERY old saying, Watch what you ask for, you might just get it.

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.

DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#35 - 2016-02-24 20:07:19 UTC  |  Edited by: DaReaper
Ok now for a serious reply:

Here is the thing, from a pure business standpoint, (minus buying White Wolf, i am not touching that) WoD and Dust 514 were both GOOD things.

CCP has a single product, EVE, sure it was slowly growing, but for how long? A Company that stakes all its claims on a single product, is a company that is doomed to die. Focusing on eve, fully, would of been a VERY foolish decision form a business perceptive. If you are a Video Game company you can not focus on a single product.

WoD suffered, as has been said, form poaching people over its 8 years of development to do stuff in eve (i heard of WoD being done in the 2007 fan fest, and it was dead in 2014, they were already a year into working on it by then). any progress made was put on hold to work on eve, then relooked at and redone cause momentum was loss. CCP missed a huge oppertunity, becuase there flagship, eve, needed to stay alive. CCP should of dumped WoD earilyer, but meh.

Dust 514, for all the nay sayers, is profitable, and there for a success. However, CCP again missed an opertunity, and Dust was suppose to be out 18 months before it was released. CCP dropped the ball, but made money of fit anyway. edit: Being on console from a business perpective is again brillant. tap into that market and get new blood. But ccp bungled this some, and here we are.

Gunjack seems ot be selling well. And Valk will make a ton of money, as if you have actually played it, you will see why.

This discussion is pointless. And CCP focusing on new Eden and on pc now is a good thing. As i said, staying just 'we are an eve company' is a recipe for death of your business. hind sight is always 20/20, but we have no idea what the workings of the company were fully. For the all 'it needs more pissh' stories we only get parts of the picture. The mmo market was going to delcine eventually, the writing was on the wall, so ccp has to expand or risk going under. And even when they focused on eve, and made some mismanaged decisions (ignoring old issues for incarina, cq sucking, greed is good, and monical gate [all together thats what hurt them, not just one but all]) they very nearly did go under. The current plan of focusing on the New Eden brand, and the eve ip is brillant imo.

now there is no point debating, whats done is done, we are still in a repair and rebuild phase, and i still believe eve will be stronger in 2017 as we come out of it.

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.

Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#36 - 2016-02-24 20:21:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Crosi Wesdo
DaReaper wrote:
And Valk will make a ton of money, as if you have actually played it, you will see why.


Having played Valk on a DK2, i can say that it represents, like all the other technical demos for oculus, a real insight into exactly how good the technology is.

The experience of Valkyrie, along with lots of other titles promises great things for VR, but Valkyrie itself it is just another round based repetitive shooter. Its also being given away with the retail oculus so not sure what cut CCP will get from that.

When the RPGs, FPS, Driving sims, and many other genres arrive, Valkyrie, for most people will be that game they got free that showed off the hardware for about 10 hours but they dont play it any more because better space/flight sims are out all the time.
Sugilite
Perkone
Caldari State
#37 - 2016-02-24 20:56:06 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Sugilite wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:

There is a reason that the top FPS franchises release a new title every single year.

Yeah, like tf2, quake and counter strike.


2 games from Valve with cosmetic shops and from from a franchise who hasn't done anything since 2007. Good picks...

Yes. Valve knows how to make FPS games.
Hal Morsh
Doomheim
#38 - 2016-02-24 22:59:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Hal Morsh
stg slate wrote:
screwing in Stations.



http://img12.deviantart.net/ac24/i/2015/364/4/1/niden___a_room_with_a_view__eve_online_artwork__by_nidensommer-d9m4306.jpg


CCplz

Oh, I perfectly understand, Hal Morsh — a mission like this requires courage, skill, and heroism… qualities you are clearly lacking. Have you forgotten you're one of the bloody immortals!?

Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#39 - 2016-02-24 23:25:50 UTC
^ this......




So i Can perv from that moon over there.

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard

May Arethusa
Junction Systems
#40 - 2016-02-25 00:13:57 UTC
You mean CCP screwed up WoD, right?