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Dev blog: Reworking Capital Ships: Skills, Modules and Refitting

First post
Author
Rain6637
Simulacra and Simulation
Goonswarm Federation
#201 - 2016-02-16 08:07:25 UTC
also the only case where I am okay with the idea of having to train a new set of damn drone remap skills.
Siginek
Perun Inc.
#202 - 2016-02-16 10:22:02 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
Ssssoooo support fighters will be the logistics drones? That's the only case where it makes sense that fighters and fighter-bomber skills wouldn't transfer into them.


Could also be ewar support - neut drones, webbing drones etc ...
Lugh Crow-Slave
#203 - 2016-02-16 12:16:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
Rain6637 wrote:
Ssssoooo support fighters will be the logistics drones? That's the only case where it makes sense that fighters and fighter-bomber skills wouldn't transfer into them.


You did read the blog right you need to train fighters to train the other 3 fighter skills from the looks of it only fighter bombers is changing its name

So this means you nor only have to train support fighters but light fighters too now good thing you can just inject sp though right?


Support fighters were described as Ewar when they were announced but I guess that doesn't mean they couldn't also be logistics
Rain6637
Simulacra and Simulation
Goonswarm Federation
#204 - 2016-02-16 13:53:21 UTC
I just have some cap pilots with all their drone skills and specs trained, and I'm wondering what I have to train now to keep that pretty yellow eveboard.
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#205 - 2016-02-16 14:17:14 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
I just have some cap pilots with all their drone skills and specs trained, and I'm wondering what I have to train now to keep that pretty yellow eveboard.


If you are mapped for perception and willpower, train the racial fleet auxiliary skills, then transfer the SP when they remove those skills.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

Mishra San
#206 - 2016-02-16 14:52:44 UTC
read blog for pictures, no pictures.

well one picture.

pictures?
CaesarGREG2
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#207 - 2016-02-16 16:51:28 UTC
Carriers should have some kind Bastion Module, if u want take away Triage from carriers.


Carriers without Remote Repair bonuses on triage wont be so effective, so Triage should stay on Carriers, for Self Reps bonuses useage. Thats my opinion.
(Self repairing platform immobile waiting for reiforcment to arive :) thats point

Capitals r bigs ships and ppl should not lose them so easly like sub - caps!

Syri Taneka
NOVA-CAINE
#208 - 2016-02-16 18:55:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Syri Taneka
ergherhdfgh wrote:
In the current era of carriers Gallente and Minmatar carriers are at a huge disadvantage or should I say suffer from usefullness problems. Before I go on I just want to say that I ran a mass carrier production effort for several years so I feel like I have a decent handle on what sells and what does not when it comes to carriers.

Gallente carriers with their drone bonus may be able to be made into decent solo ratting platforms but not really all that much better than a properly fit faction or T2 BS. And when you consider how long it takes them to warp from site to site maybe not as good. When it comes to Triage mode without the ability to cap trans at the same range as their tank trans combined with the lack of a tank bonus they fall behind the Amarr and Caldari versions.

The Nidhoggur seemed to me like there were situations where it could be useful with it's bonus to tank trans amount. However again without a tank bonus and cap trans bonus they seemed to not get used much.

So now with these Force Auxiliaries you guys are giving resistance bonuses to the Amarr and Caldari again also with capacitor bonus. Gallente and Minmatar get bonus to local rep amount ( which is a huge disadvantage to resistance amount in large fleet fights ) combined with a cap charge bonus which is really kind of negated by the cycle time bonus that is given en lieu of boost amount.

Now I understand that this is sticking with the bonuses with the racial lines. However for cruiser sized logistics ships the ability to operate solo makes the Gallente and Minmatar ships very valuable in small and medium sized gangs as well as smaller incursion groups.

However when we are talking about capital class ships these typically only fight in groups, at least by choice anyway. Any time that I see a solo capital ship reported in intel it winds up being one of two things. Either someone hoping to travel through that got caught with their pants down or bait and far more often bait.

So with Force Auxiliaries I really don't see much of a role for the Gallente and Minmatar. I'm sure that they will get used and people will buy them however at a much lower rate than the the other two and probably more significantly the Apostle since the Archon was out selling the other 3 combined last time that I was involved in carrier sales.


I understand what you're arguing, but you are aware that Capital Cap Chain gameplay is going away, right? Remote modules will only be useful on FAUX and will only then be useful in Triage, where you can't be remote assisted. I doubt many people will be willing to fly fleets that depend on capital cap trans to function (outside of Titans), so that bonus is almost worthless. Only thing to consider then is whether tank bonus is worth more or less than repair bonus and worse slot layout.

Secondly... the purpose of Capacitor capacity bonuses is Capacitor levels after jumping. The bigger a pool you start with, the more you have afterwards. Really important for something planning to drop in and Triage right away. Enemies expecting you to come can do horrible things to low-pool capitals using a wave or two of void bombs. Bigger base capacity protects against that. On the other hand, we have the Gallente and Minmatar versions which are better at recovering from that with stronger cap injection.
Estella Osoka
Perkone
Caldari State
#209 - 2016-02-16 19:56:09 UTC
Didn't some guy use skill injectors to max out a character? Now he's gonna have a lot of extra skill points.
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#210 - 2016-02-17 00:05:59 UTC
Estella Osoka wrote:
Didn't some guy use skill injectors to max out a character? Now he's gonna have a lot of extra skill points.

He already does.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#211 - 2016-02-17 03:53:07 UTC
CaesarGREG2 wrote:
Carriers should have some kind Bastion Module, if u want take away Triage from carriers.


Carriers without Remote Repair bonuses on triage wont be so effective, so Triage should stay on Carriers, for Self Reps bonuses useage. Thats my opinion.
(Self repairing platform immobile waiting for reiforcment to arive :) thats point

Capitals r bigs ships and ppl should not lose them so easly like sub - caps!



I have no idea the stats of local tank modules

i have no idea the stats of a carrier


But god damn ccp you better do what i say i know so much more
Lugh Crow-Slave
#212 - 2016-02-17 11:55:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
Considering thwe FAX will in almost if not all large fleet fights be the primary why not give triage an immunity to the local effect of target spectrum breakers. I don't think this would be overpowered and it may give the fax a chance in big fights while having little to no impact on small ones

And ofc let them fit one
Rain6637
Simulacra and Simulation
Goonswarm Federation
#213 - 2016-02-17 11:59:13 UTC
FT Diomedes wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
I just have some cap pilots with all their drone skills and specs trained, and I'm wondering what I have to train now to keep that pretty yellow eveboard.


If you are mapped for perception and willpower, train the racial fleet auxiliary skills, then transfer the SP when they remove those skills.

That's a great idea, I wish I thought of it. However, I'm remapped to Intel/Mem on 3 out of 4 cap pilots.

I'm going to use that idea for the one. Thanks.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#214 - 2016-02-17 12:07:24 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
FT Diomedes wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
I just have some cap pilots with all their drone skills and specs trained, and I'm wondering what I have to train now to keep that pretty yellow eveboard.


If you are mapped for perception and willpower, train the racial fleet auxiliary skills, then transfer the SP when they remove those skills.

That's a great idea, I wish I thought of it. However, I'm remapped to Intel/Mem on 3 out of 4 cap pilots.

I'm going to use that idea for the one. Thanks.


Them ccp pulls another oh never mind we ate just going to make the fax skills another set of bragging rights rather than remove and refundTwisted
Cyrek Ohaya
Blazing Sun Group
#215 - 2016-02-17 14:12:51 UTC
Do they truly believe Minmatar and Gallente Force Auxiliaries are going to compete with Caldari and Amarr? Well we never know.
Rain6637
Simulacra and Simulation
Goonswarm Federation
#216 - 2016-02-17 14:23:06 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
FT Diomedes wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
I just have some cap pilots with all their drone skills and specs trained, and I'm wondering what I have to train now to keep that pretty yellow eveboard.


If you are mapped for perception and willpower, train the racial fleet auxiliary skills, then transfer the SP when they remove those skills.

That's a great idea, I wish I thought of it. However, I'm remapped to Intel/Mem on 3 out of 4 cap pilots.

I'm going to use that idea for the one. Thanks.


Them ccp pulls another oh never mind we ate just going to make the fax skills another set of bragging rights rather than remove and refundTwisted

well. I picked the amarr one.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#217 - 2016-02-17 14:56:00 UTC
Cyrek Ohaya wrote:
Do they truly believe Minmatar and Gallente Force Auxiliaries are going to compete with Caldari and Amarr? Well we never know.



depends on base stats but in a C4-C1 wh i could see them being used they will have a better resistance to nuets and thats basically the only thing that can kill a decent fleet with carrier support in those environments


but large fleet fights will probably only see the amarr one shield RR in a cap fight has always been a joke so no caldari
Destiny Dain2
Your Destiny Corporation
#218 - 2016-02-17 16:45:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Destiny Dain2
Does combat refitting also include changing your ship during the timer?

If so, then what about when your done running a site, shooting rats. We just sit there in space waiting for the timer before we can do anything else?

And now if I leave a site to heal up before I return to finish, I have to sit in space waiting for a timer to even fit the repairers. Watching my site get finished by someone else?
Faren Shalni
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#219 - 2016-02-17 22:24:20 UTC
Destiny Dain2 wrote:
Does combat refitting also include changing your ship during the timer?

If so, then what about when your done running a site, shooting rats. We just sit there in space waiting for the timer before we can do anything else?

And now if I leave a site to heal up before I return to finish, I have to sit in space waiting for a timer to even fit the repairers. Watching my site get finished by someone else?


Its the weapons timer not pvp or pve timers. You only get weapons timers for offensive actions against players or assiting players using offensive modules. Or bastion

Also has CCP decided on if Triage and Siege will receive a weapons timer. Because if that is the case they really are killing triage.

So Much Space

Faren Shalni
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#220 - 2016-02-17 22:29:10 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Cyrek Ohaya wrote:
Do they truly believe Minmatar and Gallente Force Auxiliaries are going to compete with Caldari and Amarr? Well we never know.



depends on base stats but in a C4-C1 wh i could see them being used they will have a better resistance to nuets and thats basically the only thing that can kill a decent fleet with carrier support in those environments


but large fleet fights will probably only see the amarr one shield RR in a cap fight has always been a joke so no caldari


It Definitely looks like Amarr and Caldari for large scale pvp with capitals. Minmitar and Gallente for Small gang/ Wh's

Triple ASB, Cap injected, Armour Repping Minmitar FAX are going to be OP as hell in Wspace. massive Burst tank and Strong capacitors with injection. Your going to need a lot of neuts/DPS to kill one

So Much Space