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Crime & Punishment

 
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Feedback : high sec security (ganking question)

Author
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#21 - 2016-01-07 14:17:03 UTC
Droidster wrote:
Jason Kusion wrote:
Dear Saredan

I would first like to thank you for acknowledging my solo efforts to eliminate the autopiloting menace. Indeed, it is quite unfair that someone like me can operate 12 accounts while most struggle to operate a single account; However, I'm sure an equally skilled player would be able to evade me with minimal effort. Perhaps you should try getting on my level.

I am pleased to inform you that killrights are not necessary to intervene with our operations. CODE. alliance and our affiliates are almost exclusively -10 security status and all pilots of New Eden are welcome to engage us as they please. Even you are allowed to come blow us up without ever needing to pay for a killright.

I hope you find this information helpful. I look forward to seeing you soon in the tradelanes!

♥Jason Kusion♥


Ironically this guy and his 12 clones blew me up too last night (and destroyed my implants, I guess out of spite). Its like Jake Kusion, Justin Kusion, Joel Kusion, Jeremiah Kusion, etc, etc. More -10 tards than in one of those incestuous families in West Virginia.

I was trying to figure out the math of this. He only got about 300 million in stuff off me, because most of the good stuff got destroyed, but I noticed from his killboard he has destroyed some 8 billion ISK freighters, not even sure how he collects those, another account with a freighter? So, let's say he averages 500 million per gank, then he only needs to gank about 30 high value ships per month to fund his 12-15 accounts, which is 1 per night, and checking the killboard again we see he is killing like 20 ships on some nights, so it looks pretty profitable.

I think he must have yet another account which does nothing but make Thrashers.

I'm guessing that there's a 'neutral' hauler involved to scavenge the chunky bits left over. There are others who make the Thrashers, I'm sure. Even the implant destruction has an impact on the economy, as it drives up the demand for them. Cycle of life, yo. I'd have all sorts of rad insights on this crap if only I knew anyone who sold weed anymore. Ganking is a pretty legit playstyle in my book, even though I generally dont indulge in it. Money to be made, tears to be harvested, and most importantly it keeps crap from getting too damned boring in high sec.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.

Nitshe Razvedka
#22 - 2016-01-07 14:34:22 UTC
admiral root wrote:
OP, please learn to play Eve. Oh, and post on your main or GTFO, too.

like you make posting nazi rules, delusions of grandeur
you n your pig gtfo

Thieving pirates discuss INTEGRITY; Anarchist gankers give us LAWS; and Whoring merc's cry then blow off clients with INSULTS.

Up is down and down is up in the C&P Forum.

Amanda Rekenwhith
Safeties On Red
#23 - 2016-01-07 14:36:08 UTC
"Game mechanics operating as intended." - Every GM who ever responded to complaints of this nature.

Have you tried bulkheading your freighter and keeping cargo value low (below 1 billion).

Or...have you bought a permit?

For dessert we're offering humble pie.  Would you like some after you're done eating crow?

Sipphakta en Gravonere
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#24 - 2016-01-07 14:36:56 UTC
Nitshe Razvedka wrote:
admiral root wrote:
OP, please learn to play Eve. Oh, and post on your main or GTFO, too.

like you make posting nazi rules, delusions of grandeur
you n your pig gtfo


Miner, please calm down. There is no need to get all riled up over some pixels.
Paranoid Loyd
#25 - 2016-01-07 14:45:08 UTC
Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:
Nitshe Razvedka wrote:
admiral root wrote:
OP, please learn to play Eve. Oh, and post on your main or GTFO, too.

like you make posting nazi rules, delusions of grandeur
you n your pig gtfo


Miner, please calm down. There is no need to get all riled up over some pixels.

Ganker, please learn to spot bait and not take it. Blink

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!

Leila Meurtrier
Why Am I Not Surprised
#26 - 2016-01-07 14:45:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Leila Meurtrier
Welp, completely wrong thread. Nvm.
Solecist Project
#27 - 2016-01-07 14:50:15 UTC
Leila Meurtrier wrote:
Welp, completely wrong thread. Nvm.

*grabs Leila*

No you stay here forever!!!!!11111

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia

Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#28 - 2016-01-07 14:52:23 UTC
Oi. Generate your Yuri field in the appropriate place. That being my living room floor.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.

Ginnie
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#29 - 2016-01-07 16:53:18 UTC
To be fair, I understand the OP point. There really isn't a lot risked in High Sec ganking compared to the ships that are getting ganked. The gankers lose what a destroyer? A rookie ship? Most of the ships that CONCORD destroys according to their zkillboard page are pretty small.

There are ways that as players we can mitigate the risks of getting ganked on our own.

I regularly review the CONCORD zkillboard page and add the Alliances and Corporations whose players get destroyed in High Sec. I have 50 to 60 Alliances and Corporations with Terrible Standing. I watch Local, when players enter that have the little red box with the white tick mark in the middle, I dock up at a station and wait for them to leave.

I also randomly look at players in Local, especially, if I am traveling long distances for an escalated unrated DED site, and add players that have a negative security standing to my contacts list with Terrible Standing as well. I added a guy just the other night with a -9.7 security standing. He was a hunter and was out looking for prey.

Personally, I would like to see gankers lose something more than a little security standing and a T1 destroyer, but, yeah, its part of the game and we just need to learn to adapt to it and mitigate the risks as best we can.

It sounds plausible enough tonight, but wait until tomorrow. Wait for the common sense of the morning.

Mike Adoulin
Happys Happy Hamster Hunting Club
#30 - 2016-01-07 17:29:52 UTC
Nitshe Razvedka wrote:
pig tears



We make the rules here, scum. Now post on your main or GTFO.

Don't like it? Wardec me.

Bet you won't.

Everything in EVE is a trap.

And if it isn't, it's your job to make it a trap...:)

You want to know what immorality in EVE Online looks like? Look no further than Ripard "Jester" Teg.

Chribba is the Chuck Norris of EVE.

FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#31 - 2016-01-07 18:11:17 UTC
Saredan wrote:
the problem is that they don't get enought penalties doing that compared to the amount of money peoples lost when piloting a freighter and the amount of money CODE and other corp gain doing this .


Let's see...

  1. Drop in sec status that ultimately results in a permanent criminal status. This means they're always vulnerable to attack and can never loiter.
  2. Killrights that can be make public for whatever price the victim chooses to set
  3. Destruction of their ship
  4. Loss of any insurance payment
  5. 15 minutes in the penalty box, where CONCORD will shoot them for being in space in anything but a pod.


That's actually quite a lot of penalty.

On a side note, an alt of mine got shot by a member of CODE not too long ago (the gank failed, my alt runs a troll tank that looks shitfit but isn't). I set the killright to 315, because that's what it should always be.

Saredan wrote:
some peoples begin the game and get ganked by these kind of corporations ...and are not willing to stay enough in the game because of that .


This I can kind of support. I'm not a huge fan of ganking noobs. I'd rather see CODE. self-impose a rule that a character has to be a certain age before they're a gank target, or at give them a few warnings so they can understand the expectation prior to losing their first ship unexpectedly.

Saredan wrote:
4 :(optionnal) (don't know if possible) limit the number of client possible running from the same IP adress

Terrible idea.

Saredan wrote:
make another high sec route around uedama and sivala (gank point) so the traffic can be derived to another route if needed and not making 40 jumps .

Yes, because what Eve really needs is alternate routes so that we have to interact with each other even less.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.

FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#32 - 2016-01-07 18:14:38 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
If ever I can manage to simultaneously annoy 30000 players I will consider myself to have won EVE.

Dude, you have no idea how much fun it can be. I got to ride Psychotic Monk's coattails into our 15 minutes of notoriety, and it was a blast. I doubt we ever achieved 30k enraged players, but enraging the entire incursion community at its zenith made for a lot of free publicity and still yields occasional "omg it's Floppie!" comments in local.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#33 - 2016-01-07 18:20:24 UTC
Saredan wrote:
hello , i was roaming around and i see one night a complete system was LOCKED by these gankers named CODE .
the problem is that they don't get enought penalties doing that compared to the amount of money peoples lost when piloting a freighter and the amount of money CODE and other corp gain doing this .

the second problem is : kill rights
the kill rights are by far too expensive , we need to be able to punish them for cheap

some peoples begin the game and get ganked by these kind of corporations .

1 : they have no money and want to play the game an progress .
2 : some peoples feel miserable because of this situation and are not willing to stay enough in the game because of that .
3 : by making a better environnement , i'm sure more beginners will stay .


please CCP :

steps to make :

1 : lower the kill rights cost or make it no cost (or make a cost cap )
2 : lower the kill right cost for a particular pirat each time the same pirat kill someone in high sec .
3 : make a system looking if a high sec system is constantly under pirat attack (of the same persons) and make that CONCORD roam in large fleets in all the system after let say 30 min of repetitive attack of same pirat persons in high sec .
4 :(optionnal) (don't know if possible) limit the number of client possible running from the same IP adress
this can prevent a high sec system lock
5 : make another high sec route around uedama and sivala (gank point) so the traffic can be derived to another route if needed and not making 40 jumps .

it is unacceptable that a SINGLE person can lock out a system with 12 accounts .
we are 30000 players live and we got annoyed by 1 man with 12 accounts .
i know a lot of peoples who say same as me .

gank will still exist , but in a limited way than it is actually .

thanks . viewing my feedback .
regards .


A whole complete system? Leaving you barely 1200 other highsec systems to do stuff in?

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#34 - 2016-01-07 18:23:28 UTC
Ginnie wrote:
There really isn't a lot risked in High Sec ganking compared to the ships that are getting ganked. The gankers lose what a destroyer? A rookie ship?


I've gone hunting for multi-billion isk ratting ships in nullsec with bombers and T1 cruisers. Any time one party is prepared for PVP while the other is not, isk value is irrelevant. There SHOULD be a disparity in cost here, because one ship is purpose-built to kill and the other is not.

Ginnie wrote:
I regularly review the CONCORD zkillboard page and add the Alliances and Corporations whose players get destroyed in High Sec. I have 50 to 60 Alliances and Corporations with Terrible Standing. I watch Local, when players enter that have the little red box with the white tick mark in the middle, I dock up at a station and wait for them to leave.

I also randomly look at players in Local, especially, if I am traveling long distances for an escalated unrated DED site, and add players that have a negative security standing to my contacts list with Terrible Standing as well. I added a guy just the other night with a -9.7 security standing. He was a hunter and was out looking for prey.


This is just...amazing. You invest a lot of time and effort into avoiding people who 99.99% of the time have no idea you even exist. And their mere presence in local is enough to put you to station.

Ginnie wrote:
Personally, I would like to see gankers lose something more than a little security standing and a T1 destroyer

So tank properly, don't afk in lower-security space, and generally make yourself as unpalatable a target as you can.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.

FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#35 - 2016-01-07 18:25:39 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
A whole complete system? Leaving you barely 1200 other highsec systems to do stuff in?

More to the point: I really want to understand how 12 accounts locked the system. Could he not jump through the gate? Or does "locked down" mean "ganked someone, making the system too scary for me to go through"

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.

Ginnie
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#36 - 2016-01-07 18:45:23 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
This is just...amazing. You invest a lot of time and effort into avoiding people who 99.99% of the time have no idea you even exist. And their mere presence in local is enough to put you to station.


It really doesn't take that much time...I like to browse zkillboard anyways for the comments and vids, they are fun to read and watch. And that's 50 to 60 Alliances and Corporations since 2009; although, I've added probably 10 or so since I returned in October.

And, since I've been back in October, I've only docked up twice, to be entirely fair. I like to play in remote off the beaten path systems where there is only one or two other people in the system at the same time as myself.

FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
So tank properly, don't afk in lower-security space, and generally make yourself as unpalatable a target as you can.


I don't mine and don't play AFK, but this is excellent advice whether you are mining, running a mission, or exploring, in general, actually.

It sounds plausible enough tonight, but wait until tomorrow. Wait for the common sense of the morning.

Jason Kusion
KUSION SPECIAL TEAM
Goonswarm Federation
#37 - 2016-01-07 18:48:18 UTC
Droidster wrote:
Jason Kusion wrote:
Dear Saredan

I would first like to thank you for acknowledging my solo efforts to eliminate the autopiloting menace. Indeed, it is quite unfair that someone like me can operate 12 accounts while most struggle to operate a single account; However, I'm sure an equally skilled player would be able to evade me with minimal effort. Perhaps you should try getting on my level.

I am pleased to inform you that killrights are not necessary to intervene with our operations. CODE. alliance and our affiliates are almost exclusively -10 security status and all pilots of New Eden are welcome to engage us as they please. Even you are allowed to come blow us up without ever needing to pay for a killright.

I hope you find this information helpful. I look forward to seeing you soon in the tradelanes!

♥Jason Kusion♥


Ironically this guy and his 12 clones blew me up too last night (and destroyed my implants, I guess out of spite). Its like Jake Kusion, Justin Kusion, Joel Kusion, Jeremiah Kusion, etc, etc. More -10 tards than in one of those incestuous families in West Virginia.

I was trying to figure out the math of this. He only got about 300 million in stuff off me, because most of the good stuff got destroyed, but I noticed from his killboard he has destroyed some 8 billion ISK freighters, not even sure how he collects those, another account with a freighter? So, let's say he averages 500 million per gank, then he only needs to gank about 30 high value ships per month to fund his 12-15 accounts, which is 1 per night, and checking the killboard again we see he is killing like 20 ships on some nights, so it looks pretty profitable.

I think he must have yet another account which does nothing but make Thrashers.


Related: https://zkillboard.com/kill/51206861/ , https://zkillboard.com/kill/51206864/

Thanks for autopiloting!
Saredan
Doomheim
#38 - 2016-01-07 20:35:50 UTC
first :yes locked , because , the point is that is a "forced " passage if we want to go jita which is the hearth of the economy
second : i don't cry .
third : the 12 accounts are easily resubscribed with the loots from killed ships
four : simply as this : there is an unbalance between organized gankers risk and gain (even without the 12 accounts in one)
five : the 12 accounts/one person is unfair and unbalanced for the "normal" players (that play one or two accounts )

that said , i put myself in the gankers point of and i understand gankers point of view , i see that they had fun doing this it was a nice evening in the ganker side:


if some peoples want to gank in high sec it is permited and game mechanics are what they are. and it is good that that exist , it add freedom to do that kind of thing .
but a 12 account gank fleet piloted by 1 person only is where things are not right and just .
Paranoid Loyd
#39 - 2016-01-07 20:55:10 UTC
Saredan wrote:
second : i don't cry .
Yes you do, the OP is the very definition of it. The system is not locked, I go through it regularly. Seems to me you just dont know how to play the game and should figure out how instead of trying to change it.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!

Avi Shekelstien
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#40 - 2016-01-07 21:31:06 UTC
Saredan wrote:
hello , i was roaming around and i see one night a complete system was LOCKED by these gankers named CODE .
the problem is that they don't get enought penalties doing that compared to the amount of money peoples lost when piloting a freighter and the amount of money CODE and other corp gain doing this .

the second problem is : kill rights
the kill rights are by far too expensive , we need to be able to punish them for cheap

some peoples begin the game and get ganked by these kind of corporations .

1 : they have no money and want to play the game an progress .
2 : some peoples feel miserable because of this situation and are not willing to stay enough in the game because of that .
3 : by making a better environnement , i'm sure more beginners will stay .


please CCP :

steps to make :

1 : lower the kill rights cost or make it no cost (or make a cost cap )
2 : lower the kill right cost for a particular pirat each time the same pirat kill someone in high sec .
3 : make a system looking if a high sec system is constantly under pirat attack (of the same persons) and make that CONCORD roam in large fleets in all the system after let say 30 min of repetitive attack of same pirat persons in high sec .
4 :(optionnal) (don't know if possible) limit the number of client possible running from the same IP adress
this can prevent a high sec system lock
5 : make another high sec route around uedama and sivala (gank point) so the traffic can be derived to another route if needed and not making 40 jumps .

it is unacceptable that a SINGLE person can lock out a system with 12 accounts .
we are 30000 players live and we got annoyed by 1 man with 12 accounts .
i know a lot of peoples who say same as me .

gank will still exist , but in a limited way than it is actually .

thanks . viewing my feedback .
regards .

Next time you fly through uedama join the anti ganking chat channel to get some help.