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I'd erase T3 and Caps from the game if it was in my power.
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Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#61 - 2015-12-26 01:21:04 UTC
If u do so you would find yourself alone in the deep cold space...

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
Arsine Mayhem
Doomheim
#62 - 2015-12-26 04:41:49 UTC
Kuronaga wrote:
Nothing good ever came from either. But dreams are nice to have.


They exist to give old players something to train for to keep them in the game longer.

Probably would be better without them.
Kuronaga
The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc.
The Chicken Coop
#63 - 2015-12-26 05:26:28 UTC
MidnightWyvern wrote:
Kuronaga wrote:
Caps are just oversized battleships that serve no additional purpose other than to make you lose more isk when they finally blow up. Any unique purpose they ever served was continually nerfed and nerfed and nerfed, or never realized at all. Docking in Titans? Nah. We'll let them blow up entire subcap fleets though. Nah wait, thats stupid too. Actually caps are pretty stupid in general so we'll just make it a cap-killing weapon.

T3 doesn't need much explanation. It is simply toxic as hell to balance and completely screws with the hull-size hierarchy. When balancing by isk, we already had rare and expensive modules which serve all ship sizes. T3 was simply a function that funneled additional power gain to a much smaller number of ships at only two hull sizes. How the hell was that good for the game?

This statement being made when T3 is next up for a balance pass and Capitals are having their role completely rebuilt in the next Expansion seems a bit misinformed.



This isn't the first time they've been "rebalanced" and it wont be the last. Nothing will change.
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#64 - 2015-12-26 05:30:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Mallak Azaria
I'd be happy if T3 cruisers were balanced to be a 'jack of all trades, master of none' as I think they were originally intended to be as opposed to a 'I can do everything better than any other single hull' platform with very few exceptions. They've been around too long to just remove because X individual doesn't like them.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Kuronaga
The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc.
The Chicken Coop
#65 - 2015-12-26 05:33:54 UTC
Of course they won't be removed. That would be too efficient.
Primary This Rifter
Mutual Fund of the Something
#66 - 2015-12-26 11:16:18 UTC
Kuronaga wrote:
MidnightWyvern wrote:
Kuronaga wrote:
Caps are just oversized battleships that serve no additional purpose other than to make you lose more isk when they finally blow up. Any unique purpose they ever served was continually nerfed and nerfed and nerfed, or never realized at all. Docking in Titans? Nah. We'll let them blow up entire subcap fleets though. Nah wait, thats stupid too. Actually caps are pretty stupid in general so we'll just make it a cap-killing weapon.

T3 doesn't need much explanation. It is simply toxic as hell to balance and completely screws with the hull-size hierarchy. When balancing by isk, we already had rare and expensive modules which serve all ship sizes. T3 was simply a function that funneled additional power gain to a much smaller number of ships at only two hull sizes. How the hell was that good for the game?

This statement being made when T3 is next up for a balance pass and Capitals are having their role completely rebuilt in the next Expansion seems a bit misinformed.



This isn't the first time they've been "rebalanced" and it wont be the last. Nothing will change.

Except that capital ships aren't just getting rebalanced, they're getting a fundamentally massive change to their mechanics and roles. That's something that they really haven't had since they were created.
Solecist Project
#67 - 2015-12-26 11:57:19 UTC
My svipul is insane!

mwd, AB, cloak, core probe launcher, long range artillery and fast as a bullet!
Not all at the same time, but that barely matters! :D

And the sig, omg the sig!


That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
Val'Dore
PlanetCorp InterStellar
#68 - 2015-12-26 12:21:39 UTC
Mr Epeen wrote:
Val'Dore wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Subcaps online would be pretty amusing... especially the structure shoots.


Believe it or not, POS hp was balanced around the subcaps meant to take them down.


As for the OP, Capitals sure, they weren't implemented very well and they didn't actually add anything useful to the game.

T3s, well, T3s are inevitable.
I have nothing to say here but Merry Christmas Val'Dore and Alavaria.

Mr Epeen Cool


You just want to shoot me and see whats in my stockings.

Star Jump Drive A new way to traverse the galaxy.

I invented Tiericide
Kuronaga
The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc.
The Chicken Coop
#69 - 2015-12-26 18:24:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Kuronaga
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Kuronaga wrote:
MidnightWyvern wrote:
Kuronaga wrote:
Caps are just oversized battleships that serve no additional purpose other than to make you lose more isk when they finally blow up. Any unique purpose they ever served was continually nerfed and nerfed and nerfed, or never realized at all. Docking in Titans? Nah. We'll let them blow up entire subcap fleets though. Nah wait, thats stupid too. Actually caps are pretty stupid in general so we'll just make it a cap-killing weapon.

T3 doesn't need much explanation. It is simply toxic as hell to balance and completely screws with the hull-size hierarchy. When balancing by isk, we already had rare and expensive modules which serve all ship sizes. T3 was simply a function that funneled additional power gain to a much smaller number of ships at only two hull sizes. How the hell was that good for the game?

This statement being made when T3 is next up for a balance pass and Capitals are having their role completely rebuilt in the next Expansion seems a bit misinformed.



This isn't the first time they've been "rebalanced" and it wont be the last. Nothing will change.

Except that capital ships aren't just getting rebalanced, they're getting a fundamentally massive change to their mechanics and roles. That's something that they really haven't had since they were created.



How much you wanna bet someone still finds a way to rat with them?

I mean hell, I've watched Moros IN SIEGE MODE farm sleepers. I have no faith in the process of capital balance.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#70 - 2015-12-26 21:05:03 UTC
Kuronaga wrote:
How much you wanna bet someone still finds a way to rat with them?

I mean hell, I've watched Moros IN SIEGE MODE farm sleepers. I have no faith in the process of capital balance.

Ratting is wonderful, so knowing the ships are flexible enough to accomodate pve roles is quite a bonus.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Amber Starview
Doomheim
#71 - 2015-12-26 21:39:21 UTC
These ships to undock feels like I am cheating as they are so much better .... I cannot say about caps but all T3 should just disappear or be restricted to wh only
Solecist Project
#72 - 2015-12-26 23:26:22 UTC
Amber Starview wrote:
These ships to undock feels like I am cheating as they are so much better .... I cannot say about caps but all T3 should just disappear or be restricted to wh only

I suggest flying one if you feel it's so OP.

When it explodes ...
... please come back and tell us how OP they are.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
Amber Starview
Doomheim
#73 - 2015-12-27 00:26:28 UTC
Solecist Project wrote:
Amber Starview wrote:
These ships to undock feels like I am cheating as they are so much better .... I cannot say about caps but all T3 should just disappear or be restricted to wh only

I suggest flying one if you feel it's so OP.

When it explodes ...
... please come back and tell us how OP they are.


You missed the point completely....

I do fly one and it does not explode
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#74 - 2015-12-27 00:30:30 UTC
There are too many ship types in the game.

I suggest eliminating all the combat frigates and destroyers as a good start. New players should be restricted to flying mining ships and tackle until they have 'done their time" then at the cruiser level have only T2 and T3 and for battlecruiers just the Gnosis. Eliminate Battleships altogether as they are stupid and useless and restrict caps to just supers and titans but let them back into hisec.

That should simplify the game nicely and spuce things up a bit :D
Solecist Project
#75 - 2015-12-27 00:53:11 UTC
Amber Starview wrote:
Solecist Project wrote:
Amber Starview wrote:
These ships to undock feels like I am cheating as they are so much better .... I cannot say about caps but all T3 should just disappear or be restricted to wh only

I suggest flying one if you feel it's so OP.

When it explodes ...
... please come back and tell us how OP they are.


You missed the point completely....

I do fly one and it does not explode

Yeah but that doesn't really tell anything about *why* it doesn't explode.

Unless you post evidence that you indeed use one and rarely ever lose one ...
... especially after getting involved in lots of fights regularly ...
... then you simply have no actual point to make.


Where's that killboard of yours?

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#76 - 2015-12-27 01:14:01 UTC
Hasikan Miallok wrote:
There are too many ship types in the game.

I suggest eliminating all the combat frigates and destroyers as a good start. New players should be restricted to flying mining ships and tackle until they have 'done their time" then at the cruiser level have only T2 and T3 and for battlecruiers just the Gnosis. Eliminate Battleships altogether as they are stupid and useless and restrict caps to just supers and titans but let them back into hisec.

That should simplify the game nicely and spuce things up a bit :D

This would certainly be different.
Amber Starview
Doomheim
#77 - 2015-12-27 13:28:32 UTC
[/quote]
Yeah but that doesn't really tell anything about *why* it doesn't explode.

Unless you post evidence that you indeed use one and rarely ever lose one ...
... especially after getting involved in lots of fights regularly ...
... then you simply have no actual point to make.


Where's that killboard of yours?[/quote]

I don't base my opinion on kill board stats .....I have played long enough to be able to form my own personal opinion

I understand you are trying hard to argue but maybe if you care about stats so much maybe you should dig some out yourself instead of half assed entering a thread and saying all is ok and people need stats to have a opinion....but you don't lol

FYI you want stats and care about stats and think kill board is life you prove it ...I don't my opinion is from me not a website
Solecist Project
#78 - 2015-12-27 13:46:50 UTC
Amber Starview wrote:

I don't base my opinion on kill board stats .....I have played long enough to be able to form my own personal opinion

I understand you are trying hard to argue but maybe if you care about stats so much maybe you should dig some out yourself instead of half assed entering a thread and saying all is ok and people need stats to have a opinion....but you don't lol

FYI you want stats and care about stats and think kill board is life you prove it ...I don't my opinion is from me not a website

No, I am not trying hard to argue.

I am calling out someone who declares something to be OP ...
... without even the shed of a proof that it is the case.

The fact that you claim to be using one ...
... while not even having a killboard to prove it ...
... shows that you should be dismissed.


Which I now do.


Your personal opinion on the matter is irrelevant.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
SetSail ForEpicFail
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#79 - 2015-12-27 14:59:18 UTC
keep the frigs atleast
Jennifer Maxwell
Crimson Serpent Syndicate
#80 - 2015-12-27 15:30:20 UTC
I'd remove the ability for capitals to jump to cynos.