Player Features and Ideas Discussion

BC's get no bonuses to them at all, so any BC fitted with RLML is instead incredibly weak (in theory) vs other BC & Cruisers.

Part of the problem you are seeing is how bad HM & HAM are for application, they have supposed better DPS but in reality even vs their own ship class they aren't applying that DPS.

They however don't need any nerf, Missiles already apply badly enough to start with. Just accept that a frigate isn't always the right counter to a particular RLML fit cruiser or BC. They have fitted specifically to fight frigates, so bring a non frigate to fight them.

Personally the turrets should all get the same treatment and the 'smallest' weapon in each class becomes actually a 'dual' or 'quad' of the class below like the name says. It would help stop the 'frigates > all' meta that has evolved.

what "frigates > all" meta? The meta I see of late is RLML Cruisers (Orthrus, Caracal, Cerberus, etc) and T3 destroyers. All of which will wreck any frigate's day.

You want to kill Frigates, bring Destroyers. They're all very, very good at popping even well flown, well fitted Frigates.

Yes, I abbreviated slightly.
Now please tell me between HM, HAM & RLML which of the three applies the most 'real' damage, rather than paper damage to T3 Destroyers and Orthrus.
Caracal and Cerb unless overpropped are slow enough to make it a bit more of a question, but even in those cases you have listed RLML is the obvious counter because of how badly HM & HAM apply.
And their targets are all the frigates that are out there roaming.

The only thing making frigates bad right now are the T2 destroyers (soon to be the obscenely overpowered new ones too), not any particular cruiser weapon system.

my whole point is: that burst damage is massively overpowered AGAINST FRIGATES.

My point is, it's supposed to be overpowered against frigates... That's why they're not frigate class weapons.
If they were on frigs, I would definitely see a problem.

The issue here is that their other options suck, so they fly around using the only viable weapon system that just so happens to pen frigs.
If HML and HAM were rebalanced to be more effect against anything other that a BS or larger, then you would likely see a reduced usage of RLMs, thus alleviating your concern.

You're suggesting nerfs to a weapon system because it does exactly what it was intended to do, and ignoring the fact that the only reason they're currently imbalance is because it's all they have worth using.
Thus, frigs die easy and attacking anything larger is a bit risky.

Rebalance the other missile systems, RLMs start getting used less, frigs are able to counter heavy and ham fit depending on the fit of both pilots, and rapid light cruisers become niche, and intended specifically for anti-frig warfare, as opposed to the only meta.

Anti frigate weapon systems trumping cruisers and overshadowing cruiser weapon systems is terrible balance. T1 Cruisers killing 3 faction or t2 frigates with one clip is horrific balance.

Of course they are the perfect weapons for fighting frigates that is what they were made for but they ate week against a fleet of anything bigger than a destroyer.


That said one nerf I would put forth is raising the CPU need ultimately lowering their tank and making then easier to counter with a cruiser in one on one

The orthrus and Garmur are also getting nerfed, as they're known to be OP. So you can't use the orthrus as an example of the OP nature of RLMs.

Now, I will say that I have suggested before that RLMs not be effected by ship bonuses just as RHMs are not effected on most BS hulls. However, this would likely also call for a slight buff to the RLML itself, as they're not worth much without the hull bonuses.
This would not only be a slight DPS nerf (if a DPS nerf at all) but the main thing would be a range nerf, as they're currently effected by range bonuses on most,'if not all, cruisers.

So, again, the RLMLs are not the problem, but instead the bonuses of certain hulls are the problem, such as a Cerberus with insane RLM range.
The Golem doesn't get any bonuses to RHMLs, unless maybe in bastion with the range bonus, and I'm not even sure on that.

As far as your statement on r/eve;'the conversations are no different over there.
Those that act one way on here,'act the same if not worse over there.
However, you cannot label me as one of those people.
I do not consider myself better than anyone else, and if you search my forum history, you will find that I rarely troll, and express my opinions, concerns, ideas, and counter arguments to the best of my ability.
You cannot walk into a thread and accuse me of demagoguing simply because we do not share the same view point.

Until lunchtime, then it's all about the onyx baby.