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Moar subcap action, more content simple fix
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VallyInDaClub
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2015-11-19 13:36:50 UTC
Short and sweet.

Logi is the lynchpin factor in a subcap fleet. Logi or lack of it can be a deciding factor in the fight but also even if that fight ever happens.
The Problem : Killboards have become such a thing in fleet and strat ops that everyone who wants to fight wants to be on that KM or all of them. FCs are partly to blame, alliances are partly to blame and CCP, as usual, is at fault in the majority.

The Easy Fix: Put logistics on killmails for ships they rep! We've been told (and bought the rotten shark flavoured popcorn) that this is complicated beyond reasonable implementation. It's not! If it is possible to pass aggression to my logistics ship it's easiky possible to pass me onto that km.

Get more logi out there by recognising them in the fight and you will get more fights! Simple as that. More Keres and ewar solutions will be trained, more testing of those fleets will happen, so more fights will happen. I know there are roams, fleets even strat ops have stood down across null and low due to low logi numbers! (Please don't reply with whoring drones as a solution because anylogi having to concentrate on whoring is really doing it wrong!)

Yes, I know it's been proposed and ignored completely by CCP.
Yes I have spoken to individual CSM members and they have said "CCP won't listen"

But it goes here anyway and please comment here to keep it live.
RatterMatter
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2015-11-19 14:27:40 UTC
Couldn't agree more +1
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#3 - 2015-11-19 15:16:35 UTC
It's a player issue and not a game issue. Make your player stop bothering about the killmails and you will get logi. If you only manage to recruit people who are selfish and only want to participate when their name will be attached to a kill report, you need to recruit less shallow players.
Asserted Invaluability
The Nexus 7's
#4 - 2015-11-19 17:47:20 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
It's a player issue and not a game issue. Make your player stop bothering about the killmails and you will get logi. If you only manage to recruit people who are selfish and only want to participate when their name will be attached to a kill report, you need to recruit less shallow players.


Spoken like a true goon. And I've flown in many goon fleets as a spy and you guys are the worst for linking zkills in fleet and on comms.

It's not a player issue it's a gameplay issue. Did logi save the fleet? (Or at least play a vital roll in allowing more damage application?) If yes goto "make them feel part of the overall experience".
Iain Cariaba
#5 - 2015-11-23 08:30:22 UTC
Asserted Invaluability wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
It's a player issue and not a game issue. Make your player stop bothering about the killmails and you will get logi. If you only manage to recruit people who are selfish and only want to participate when their name will be attached to a kill report, you need to recruit less shallow players.


Spoken like a true goon. And I've flown in many goon fleets as a spy and you guys are the worst for linking zkills in fleet and on comms.

It's not a player issue it's a gameplay issue. Did logi save the fleet? (Or at least play a vital roll in allowing more damage application?) If yes goto "make them feel part of the overall experience".

No, it is entirely a player issue. Most large alliances I've flown with use third party apps to track fleet participation, so the need to have your name on a km to prove you were ther is pointless. Additionally, most large alliances I've flown with have a policy of 100% SRP for logi, which makes it possible to profit off losing a logi in battle.

Lastly, all logi can carry drones, so if you're that hard up to whore on kms, assign combat drones to someone with a gun.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#6 - 2015-11-23 11:43:31 UTC
OP?

I fly logi. I'd really rather not tell everyone who glances at my killboard exactly how much logi I fly and how well I do it.

Start putting me on killmails, and I'll have to go fly something else.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#7 - 2015-11-23 16:00:38 UTC
Asserted Invaluability wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
It's a player issue and not a game issue. Make your player stop bothering about the killmails and you will get logi. If you only manage to recruit people who are selfish and only want to participate when their name will be attached to a kill report, you need to recruit less shallow players.


Spoken like a true goon. And I've flown in many goon fleets as a spy and you guys are the worst for linking zkills in fleet and on comms.

It's not a player issue it's a gameplay issue. Did logi save the fleet? (Or at least play a vital roll in allowing more damage application?) If yes goto "make them feel part of the overall experience".


Logi know damn well if they saved the fleet or not. If you need someone to pat you on the back after flying such a support role, you really need to re-think how you see yourself.

The issue is the "ME ME ME ME" behavior of players who somehow think they need to be "validated" by a killmail. As I said before, if you can't field enough logi, get less selfish people in your fleet/corp/alliance so the key roles can be filled. Hell if that does not work, you can introduce incentive by yourself so people are more willing to fly those.
Terminal Insanity
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#8 - 2015-12-13 15:21:36 UTC
the new command destroyers are a huge boost to small gang subcaps.

Also, stop thinking about subcaps and caps as hugely different. Your frigate and a Battleship share the same difference, should we hate on battleships just because we dont have one and that guy does?

"War declarations are never officially considered griefing and are not a bannable offense, and it has been repeatedly stated by the developers that the possibility for non-consensual PvP is an intended feature." - CCP
Xplecit
Phantom Space
Space Madness.
#9 - 2015-12-14 13:05:39 UTC
If you work has a logi need to be recognized and appreciated on a killmail. Maybe you playing the wrong role.


Why appear on a killmail and be on a kill and not appear the % repair when a ship goes down get destroy and reps wherent enough to save them just to see if any logi bro where sleeping!

But puting logi on the kill mail just for the good of being in the killmail... greed more!

Maybe if you where giving remote tracking or sensor booster.. But even them will links ships will be on kill mails also? Thoose do more them logi sometimes!
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#10 - 2015-12-15 13:30:00 UTC
Xplecit wrote:



Why appear on a killmail and be on a kill and not appear the % repair when a ship goes down get destroy and reps wherent enough to save them just to see if any logi bro where sleeping!



The damage don't get tracked correctly when reps are applied on a kill (only enough damage to kill the ship is shown even if you repped the ship 100 times over) and you think the data for reps would actually mean anything? Add to that the over-repping effect the new longer cycle time will bring and it become kind of moot.

The role should already be appreciated by itself without the need to appear on kill/loss reports anyway. It's like people rage about how powerfull logi are and how game breaking it was and then can't appreciate themselves for doing that work because "MUH KILLBOARD!!!"...
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#11 - 2015-12-15 14:13:56 UTC
If you want more subscap action, undock one and shoot someone.

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff
SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#12 - 2015-12-21 18:25:31 UTC
How does that quote go?

Every complex problem has a solution that is clear, simple, and wrong?

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/