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[December] Module Tiericide - Warp Disruption Field Generators

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Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#381 - 2016-01-27 17:40:01 UTC
Stitch Kaneland wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Trinkets friend wrote:
I think this is overall a good change for HICs.

The current meta of HICs runs like this:
hisec = gate camping instalock HICs (basically it's just marmites, etc)
lowsec = gate camping instalock HICs, infinipoint HICs for capturing supers with logon traps
nullsec = bubble HICs occasionally (but rarely), infinipoint HICs occasionally
wormhole = camping hisec holes in solo HICs, occasional ganking with bubbles, bubble interdiction in fleet fights

For hisec, the ability to turn off MWDs and MJDs will adversely empower the instalock HICs to capture the only ships capable of escaping them at the moment (MJD fit DST's). Overall, not too bad; the DST could have also been caught by a 3-point scram fit Keres or similar. So a few more people will lose DST's.

The ability to turn off MWD's at 25km isn't too OP considering the presence of Garmurs, Keres, and the new Navy maulus coming.

For lowsec, the ability for a HIC to fit a 25km scram is actually going to see utilisation possibilities increase quite a lot. HICs will become good for tackling kiters, especially considering they will be very tough to kill. I'd expect to see utilisation rates increase markedly.

For nullsec, too, the ability of HICs to deal with MWDing foes will broaden their appeal. Right now they are too slow to be effective long-point ships, and can't stop MJDs with their bubble. This restricts them, really, to gate camping interdiction, which is fine but a lot of foes still MWD and MJD away. Infinipoint scramming will at least allow dual-bubble fits to stop a gang and keep one of them on field. Unlike other long-scram tackle, the tank of HICs will become valuable, unlike a navy maulus or Garmur.

For wormholes, the HIC will become very useful for stopping rolling BS which can often MJD off a hole. The 25km scram is also going to be quite useful for frig hole HICs, especially the Onyx in C13's, which will be able to bubble up through a hole and then have an effective tackle option.

Five stars, would tiercide again!


THe Shutdown MWD with HIC script basically shuts down the whole concept of minmatar way of fight. I know ccp is tryign to destroy racial differences for years, but damm.. make all ships same for once then.

Using speed was the ONLY way to use pilot skil in this game, everythign else is FITTING skill/money and Social skill. PIloting skill was completely limited to speed ships. Now they are dead. Well not all.. true but the ones that are not dead are the.. wtf? the CALDARI ones? because they can fight outside HIC range. While minmatar tha was suppsoed to be the speedy race simply cannot ( do nto even try to tell me a vaga can be effective at 40 km)

That change is stupid because it is not a tune on the game it is a massive carpet bombing over innocent ships to hit a few offending ships. And the worse.. it does not kill the offendign ships.. the ONLY ships that are really kileld are the innocent ones. Also it removes even more the ONLY good thing battleships had on their sides.



Seriously< i usually try to be respectful to CCP employees, but this is among the most idiotic ideas ever attempted without even havign a clear view of the side effects.


I agree to with what you said to an extent. Maybe your neck of the woods has more HIC's than mine, but i've been pleasantly surprised by the low number of HIC's roaming around. So this is not as big as an issue as anticipated. However, 6 months later, things might be very different. Few things i don't like about HIC scram is that a pimp fit, linked arazu/lach/keres cannot even get close to the scram range of the HIC. I find it a bit silly, that a HIC has more scram range than a ship dedicated to long scrams/points.

Now, what i'm expecting to hear is "But HIC's are the perfect counter for command destroyers! It makes sense with the new CD's".

No. A destroyer sized ship should never have been given the capability to jump itself AND ships around it. In what world do smaller ships have the capacity to launch not only themselves, but ships around them, but large ships can only jump themselves? It makes no damn sense. So once again, big ships take one in the chin for **** that small ships are screwing up.

I can't stress this enough, CCP please stop introducing small ships that do things larger ships can do and then introducing mechanics to counter small ships that completely remove larger ship gameplay. I didn't spend months training up BS and BC skills for all the races just so you can dumpster those because you wanted more small gimmicky bulls---.

Anyway, i'd be fine if HIC scrams only shut off MWD's, but not MJD's. Or at least not large ship MJD's. But thats just my opinion... Its not like BS or BC's are rampaging across new eden. Or people are out with pitchforks against drakes.


The real issue is that we are stuck with the jump field generators in game now. It's definitely not getting removed...
Stitch Kaneland
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#382 - 2016-01-27 18:38:57 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Stitch Kaneland wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
[quote=Trinkets friend]I think this is overall a good change for HICs.

The current meta of HICs runs like this:
hisec = gate camping instalock HICs (basically it's just marmites, etc)
lowsec = gate camping instalock HICs, infinipoint HICs for capturing supers with logon traps
nullsec = bubble HICs occasionally (but rarely), infinipoint HICs occasionally
wormhole = camping hisec holes in solo HICs, occasional ganking with bubbles, bubble interdiction in fleet fights

For hisec, the ability to turn off MWDs and MJDs will adversely empower the instalock HICs to capture the only ships capable of escaping them at the moment (MJD fit DST's). Overall, not too bad; the DST could have also been caught by a 3-point scram fit Keres or similar. So a few more people will lose DST's.

The ability to turn off MWD's at 25km isn't too OP considering the presence of Garmurs, Keres, and the new Navy maulus coming.

For lowsec, the ability for a HIC to fit a 25km scram is actually going to see utilisation possibilities increase quite a lot. HICs will become good for tackling kiters, especially considering they will be very tough to kill. I'd expect to see utilisation rates increase markedly.

For nullsec, too, the ability of HICs to deal with MWDing foes will broaden their appeal. Right now they are too slow to be effective long-point ships, and can't stop MJDs with their bubble. This restricts them, really, to gate camping interdiction, which is fine but a lot of foes still MWD and MJD away. Infinipoint scramming will at least allow dual-bubble fits to stop a gang and keep one of them on field. Unlike other long-scram tackle, the tank of HICs will become valuable, unlike a navy maulus or Garmur.

For wormholes, the HIC will become very useful for stopping rolling BS which can often MJD off a hole. The 25km scram is also going to be quite useful for frig hole HICs, especially the Onyx in C13's, which will be able to bubble up through a hole and then have an effective tackle option.

Five stars, would tiercide again!


THe Shutdown MWD with HIC script basically shuts down the whole concept of minmatar way of fight. I know ccp is tryign to destroy racial differences for years, but damm.. make all ships same for once then.

Using speed was the ONLY way to use pilot skil in this game, everythign else is FITTING skill/money and Social skill. PIloting skill was completely limited to speed ships. Now they are dead. Well not all.. true but the ones that are not dead are the.. wtf? the CALDARI ones? because they can fight outside HIC range. While minmatar tha was suppsoed to be the speedy race simply cannot ( do nto even try to tell me a vaga can be effective at 40 km)

That change is stupid because it is not a tune on the game it is a massive carpet bombing over innocent ships to hit a few offending ships. And the worse.. it does not kill the offendign ships.. the ONLY ships that are really kileld are the innocent ones. Also it removes even more the ONLY good thing battleships had on their sides.


Seriously< i usually try to be respectful to CCP employees, but this is among the most idiotic ideas ever attempted without even havign a clear view of the side effects.


The real issue is that we are stuck with the jump field generators in game now. It's definitely not getting removed...


Thats fine. I don't expect them to be removed. Countering/killing them isn't a problem.

The problem is CCP seems to be obsessed with small ships, and have barely given ships larger than cruisers a second look. BC rebalance was great i'll admit, but half of what they accomplished in the rebalance was removed when you give HIC's 40km scrams. Goodbye viable MJD module and even attempting to kite in a BC. Assuming HIC's will become more popular as people train into them in the coming months.

We have had 17 new small ships released in the past year or so. T2 logi frigs, faction EWAR, command dessies, expedition frig and T3D's. Its just getting a little old. Small ships have been the healthiest in the game for awhile and we add more, yet they're ignoring BS, bombers, Blops, T3's, or even the potential for pirate battlecruisers.

I would just like to see a little more focus on ship classes that need help, or area's where there is potential for new things. Why couldn't the MJD dessies have been BC's or BS? That seems a bit more realistic and easier to counter than 3-4k/s dessies with tanks better than AF or dictors.

Give Battlecruisers range to fullfil their Anti-Cruiser role - OP SUCCESS

Make the Muninn great again!
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#383 - 2016-01-27 23:32:48 UTC
I was against it at first but you are right, Stich.

People screamed for command destroyers and they got what they wished for with a vengeance. Now the only viable ships to fly are True Sansha ones.
I don't mind because I love them but getting killed in a 2-3 billion boat with 3 destroyers is so way out of line, I don't have words.

And congratulations CCP on the last tiericide - it was a complete failure. Now in the corner and feel bad then back to the drawing board.

Until then all battleships guns will get a signature resolution of 200mm and the base tracking is multiplied by 10, no exceptions.

The ships will get a signature resolution of 400mm. Let's call it "Revenge of the battleships". All battleships base targetting range is increased by 75km.
That should make the regular battleships worth their current pricetag.

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Shinzunn
Quantum Industrial Corporation
#384 - 2016-01-31 21:20:00 UTC
I'd like too know who's idea it was to allow the use of the Warp disruption Field Generators in high sec. That's crap... All it does is give the griefer corps that war dec you an instant win. I just had my ship destroyed in a 1.0 system by a broadsword that used this. Even though it says in the description that its banned in Empire Space.
Rawketsled
Generic Corp Name
#385 - 2016-02-01 02:09:26 UTC
Shinzunn wrote:
I'd like too know who's idea it was to allow the use of the Warp disruption Field Generators in high sec. That's crap... All it does is give the griefer corps that war dec you an instant win. I just had my ship destroyed in a 1.0 system by a broadsword that used this. Even though it says in the description that its banned in Empire Space.

The focus script changes that.

Sorry to hear that you didn't do the research.
h4kun4
Banana-Republic.
Shadow Cartel
#386 - 2016-02-26 12:10:05 UTC

While you are at the point of tiericiding warp disruption field gens i would like to propose, (if not already secretly planned in the future) to do the same with interdiction sphere launchers: Boni might be simmilar to the Bomb Launcher T2:

Reduced Reload time by 15% (from 60s to 51s)
increased Capacity by 33,3% (from 15m³ to 20m³ = 4 Probes)

Increased CPU need by 10% (from 100 to 110 TF)

Neccessary Skills:
Propulsion Jamming V
Graviton Physics V

Also, it is banned in empire if theres no script inside,, with script its just a Scram with practically infnite warp scram strengh
h4kun4
Banana-Republic.
Shadow Cartel
#387 - 2016-02-26 12:10:53 UTC  |  Edited by: h4kun4
h4kun4 wrote:

While you are at the point of tiericiding warp disruption field gens i would like to propose, (if not already secretly planned in the future) to do the same with interdiction sphere launchers: Boni might be simmilar to the Bomb Launcher T2:

Reduced Reload time by 15% (from 60s to 51s)
increased Capacity by 33,3% (from 15m³ to 20m³ = 4 Probes)

Increased CPU need by 10% (from 100 to 110 TF)

Neccessary Skills:
Propulsion Jamming V
Graviton Physics V


to Shinzunn
It is banned in empire if theres no script loaded, with script its just a Scram with practically infnite warp scram strengh

EDIT: seems im too stupid to find the edit button, and instead click the quate buttion, domt mind me *sigh*
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#388 - 2016-02-26 13:05:28 UTC
Don't feel bad. Years ago I had a "tackle fit" Onyx that I took into a wardec thinking the focused point would scram.

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