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High Sec - Newb Training Area or the only space worth playing in?

Author
Paul Pohl
blue media poetry
#21 - 2015-11-05 05:05:10 UTC
Justin Cody wrote:
Aoife Fraoch wrote:
What does CCP the business get from encouraging people to be active outside of high sec beyond the current levels?


generally more diverse and exciting game play that attracts more players

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$


except your post would suggest the contrary - or it wouldn't exist
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#22 - 2015-11-05 05:48:11 UTC
Justin Cody wrote:
1) yes CCP needs to create more group content in null sec (and w-space for that matter)
2) You have to organize around something more than PVE - otherwise why do anything but HS incursions?
3) New player friendly should also mean low rewards and HS rewards are not low

1. W-space I think is mostly okay with that, although maybe a few group focused sites in lower class whs might be interesting?
2. yea, organization is usually one of the harder problems of MMOs.
3. one of the main problem with new player friendly is that older players can either run it faster, run it with less people, or even solo it. Although with t2 frig logi coming there might be a lot of frig level content that could open up.

Justin Cody wrote:
Option 1 - Stick: HS incursions = LP only payout - no isk
- Carrot: LS Incursion frequency increase and 100% drop rate for sansha super carrier bpc and shadow bomber bpcs

Option 2 - Stick/Carrot Hybrid = HS Incursions change sec status of the constellation to 0.4 making it a LS incursion for the duation until players fight back - lack of action makes incursion spread like space cancer to neighboring constellations and even across empires and player sov borders.

Just a couple ideas

I probably wouldn't completely remove the isk payout, but a nerf with a boost to LP might be interesting. And all that extra LP would nerf most mission running income too.

LS incursions seem to get run with some frequency. and a 100% drop rate would just get null blocks in to blitz the hell out of them for the BPC drop. although that could generate some big fights as people fight over the systems.
Justin Cody wrote:
Oh and move all level 4 missions to low sec - no high sec Level 4's at all. Increase payouts 25% in isk and LP. Also introduce low sec pirate missions that can get turned in at pirate citadels \o/

the move it all to low would probably be too much of a kick in the nuts to too many players. I really doubt that would go over well. maybe it would be best for the game in the long run. But I don't have access to the stats, could pull some stats and make some good guesses. might be interesting to look at the jumps:npc kills ratio, try and find the most active agents.

low level pirate missions in lowsec would probably be an interesting idea.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2015-11-05 05:59:10 UTC

Given that CCP haven't quite figured out what makes null enjoyable, maybe this isn't the best time to ask.

The answer to the question about what makes null enjoyable is tainted by the controversial choices presently at play.

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.

Paul Pohl
blue media poetry
#24 - 2015-11-05 06:03:24 UTC
Zerinia wrote:
[quote=Andrew Indy
Absolute bull. Blue nullsec is ver safe - if you're paying attention. And very lucrative. The solution is to make HS less safe, not less lucrative - I'd personally suggest that all non-rookie systems have a sec status of 0.5.


this is just nonsense

the most violent systems in the game are in high-sec - and always have been - for good reason

the only effect changing sec status would have would be to make the chance of omber etc more likely in more places - in terms of high-sec space the lower the declared sec the safer it is because it is entirely irrelevant to people sitting on the main pipes popping bog fat freighters coming in from low-sec - that is the lucrative part of high-sec - it's not mission running and making T1 stuff to sell at .01 ISK beneath the market price - even if it feels like it is at the time

there is a reason why the powerful alliances are not based in high-sec and it has little or nothing to do with the drive-by-shooting (fun) implied by your post
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2015-11-05 06:15:08 UTC

Paul Pohl wrote:
the most violent systems in the game are in high-sec - and always have been - for good reason


Catch is the most dangerous region in 2014. You've made a statement as if it's a fact. Please share your data.

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.

Vollhov
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#26 - 2015-11-05 06:18:22 UTC
What about the new system Sovereignty titled "Fozziesov" Question
What it has not helped, all was in vain. Question
Horrible. Twisted

End of Time. I'm not fanatic, I'm just a servant by Her Majesty the Empress Jamyl Sarum I. It's time to leave this world to me. YC111 to YC117.12.10 20:00

Zakks
CSR NAVY
Citizen's Star Republic
#27 - 2015-11-05 06:29:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Zakks
Why would I give up a 1-bedroom apartment in Manhattan for a shack in the Bronx?

Also, the overall % of Highseccers that actually run incursions is incredibly small by my observations. Nerfing or completely eliminating them will have almost no effect on the masses (or me).

Lastly, I think the trade hubs are the reason Highsec is so popular. If you could find a way to move the trade hubs then people will follow the trade.
Nick Bete
Highsec Haulers Inc.
#28 - 2015-11-05 06:42:12 UTC
Oh God, the 4 millionth thread about nerfing high sec... Roll

Do we really need number 4 million and one?
Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2015-11-05 06:46:41 UTC
I would explore the idea of allowing sov holders to create CONCORD mechanics in sov null.

Many people enjoy PVE in 'dangerous' space, because it can be fun, but generally speaking ISK-making in highsec is easier and less of a hassle. Besides, if you like the possibility of PVP, might as well straight-up roam in PVP ships instead of PVE-ing in something relatively defensible. Hence the common separation of ISK-making in highsec to fund PVP out of highsec.

People ask for sov 'to be more worth holding' - what's more valuable than being able to create your own highsec in null?

Then you could attract current highseccers with better space, competitive taxes (that you should be able to levy), etc...


Naturally mechanics would have to be designed to allow PVP as well; just as a rough example: CONCORD not spawning on-grid of entosis-able structures.


Highsec then could be greatly reduced (in number of systems), effectively becoming really just a starter zone.

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!

Vollhov
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#30 - 2015-11-05 06:49:19 UTC
Wait guys.
Here will be put the Citadel with the "Center for propaganda", and the will be on the periphery of the agents.
And all will be good.
The only pity is that the story begun to rewrite the roughly. (but it is Personally for me so)
But in general. Idea.
Using drifters. Make it so that the "invasion of Sansha" was only in systems with low levels of security. Pirate Drifters already demonstrated myself good in the creation of history.
Wait for the the summer of 2016. Big smile

End of Time. I'm not fanatic, I'm just a servant by Her Majesty the Empress Jamyl Sarum I. It's time to leave this world to me. YC111 to YC117.12.10 20:00

Tanthos
Tanthos Corp
#31 - 2015-11-05 07:00:25 UTC
Nerf bubbles. Nerf gate camps. They are what keep people out of null.
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
The Conference
#32 - 2015-11-05 07:50:39 UTC
Highsec is a lot of fun. It has a lot of issues, but we are working on it.
Helia Tranquilis
Confused Bunnies Inc
#33 - 2015-11-05 07:58:59 UTC
Add pointing rats to highsec gates with high respawn rate -> Highsec afking fixed.
Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#34 - 2015-11-05 08:44:23 UTC
If 70% of subscribers play in highsec - it isn't broken! You aren't going to push people to low or null by nerfing high - you will simply push them to some other game.

If you want more players in other regions - they need to offer enjoyable gameplay. Risk vs reward isn't just about ISK.

Bear in mind that many of us play Eve for the economic simulation - we actually enjoy building sand castles. Right now, nullsec alliances are recruiting miners, ratters and PVP pilots but I don't see a lot of demand for builders.

I suspect that those who want to PVP in low or null are already there or will find their way there in due time. CCP and alliance leadership need to do a better job of attracting industrialists - the new structures and capital rebalance is definitely a step in the right direction.

erg cz
Federal Jegerouns
#35 - 2015-11-05 08:45:35 UTC
Justin Cody wrote:

What would make you leave high sec in general (without feeling the urge to quit EVE)?

I have ideas but I am honestly curious to hear from the perpetual high sec player.


I am exactly that kind of player. And you know what - I do PvE when I do not feel to run into PvP. Making ISKor even simply traveling in low / null sec is PvP even if you do not want it. But I do PvP when I feel like and go to low sec for this. Null is empty or blobed. FW is way how to get at least some chance to fight with match making, where you cn warp out from the blob entering your PLEX or laugh at T3 destroyer when you sitting in novice plex. You can not be surprised by recon in small plex etc... You see where I am going? You want more PvP in null? Put at least some match making mechanics in there. Fair fights is all we need. Or we do not - it is a sandbox. Eve is unique exactly because of the blob friendly approach.

1. Let me PvE in null without PvP, when I do not want PvP. Sort of anomalies with collapsing entrance once you passed in would do. Something with unique sights would drag in PvE oriented players even if ISK income will not be that high.
2. Let me solo PvP with at least some chance to get fair fight when I am ready and want PvP. Null arena with drifters as judge or whatever.
3. Make more high sec / null sec gates. You want ppl in null - you should give them access to it. One ever camped gate per region is simply not enough.
4. Make more NPC null regions. People do play solo for family / time / social / historical reasons. You want solo players in null - let them dock.
erg cz
Federal Jegerouns
#36 - 2015-11-05 08:52:09 UTC
Do Little wrote:
If 70% of subscribers play in highsec - it isn't broken! You aren't going to push people to low or null by nerfing high - you will simply push them to some other game.

Very much true

Do Little wrote:

If you want more players in other regions - they need to offer enjoyable gameplay. Risk vs reward isn't just about ISK.

This is so true, you can not even imagine. I believe many players still play that game, cause thay are sci-fi fans. It is A SPACE. And you can explore it. But what can you explore in null, what you will not find in high / low sec as well? I mean - what new landmarks? Different NPC (sleepers are good example of what we need, IMHO) ?
roberts dragon
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#37 - 2015-11-05 09:09:50 UTC
would say when you first play the game all the missions are pve in fact most of the gameplay is pve , pvp is only when you kill other players ships/pods .

If you want more players to do pvp here are a few suggestions ,also would say make a poll so very player has to vote on number of choices and see what the out come is .

Then make a place/arena where like minded pvp players can have instant pvp battles 2v2 6v6 etc , so they wont have to waste time trying to find battles for those who have limited time .

And do rookie ships only with civilian modules , so new players get used to pvp and learn how to fit ships & modules from the start with the rookies should make it a mission go to arena instant warp to wherever you are and kill 3 rookie ships make it a mission .

And make pvp missions where go to null area and low sec kill a number of certain ships . so this would hopefully have players going to all over the universe , of course the rewards must be fitting .

would suggest a trial of these type of missions .

many thanks fly safe
Daniela Doran
Doomheim
#38 - 2015-11-05 09:17:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Daniela Doran
Justin Cody wrote:
Oh and move all level 4 missions to low sec - no high sec Level 4's at all. Increase payouts 25% in isk and LP. Also introduce low sec pirate missions that can get turned in at pirate citadels \o/


Marauders would go totally unused if this happened so it's not happening. If anything I'd like CCP to make Level 5's available in Hi-Sec.

Hi-Sec is the only place in Eve that allows for casual gameplay. Without any casual gameplay, you'd be very surprised how empty New Eden would be.
LordInvisible
Nova Ardour
#39 - 2015-11-05 10:16:47 UTC
Biggest problem for me not visiting null is hard time to get there with instalocking camps and bubbles.

If I manage to get into null, I stay there for a bit, but the sole thought of getting through choke points and being killed by static camps is turning me against such journey.

And even once I'm in null, constant fear of being bloped (or hotdroped) while engaging any kind of enemy is keeping me from pvping in null.

Thats why I stick with high sec, where probability of getting blobed is lower if you use an alt. There is no magical jumping 10+ fleet onto me from 5 jumps away..

Also, with HS you can filter how many persons can attack you at the same time via wars or suspect timer manipulation and theoretical help from 3rd persons in case of neut RR is also a good addition to more "fair" pvp.

Thats it if you are a bit loner and prefer smaller engagements. But for those who like blobfare, by all means, go to low and null and follow FC's order on pressing that godly F1..

Then there is FW, which is half as bloby as the res of PvPPPPPP outside of HS..
Otso Bakarti
Doomheim
#40 - 2015-11-05 10:57:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Otso Bakarti
CCP doesn't necessarily want "more people" to play in low and null. They do, however, seem to want to see a certain kind of play in these areas, that utilizes more of the features built into the game. For instance, with Fizzle SoV™ the feature of developing a system to increase it's toughness and make it difficult to conquer utilizes elements that have been in the game forever, but have long been overlooked, or shoved aside.

CCP, like all corporations, is interested in keeping the customer satisfied, rather than making the customer feel inadequate, if you catch my drift. And, the "either/or" premise of your post fails to encompass the complexity of the subject you deign to address, as is usually the case in over-simplifications intended to flatter a particular point of view - pejorative.

There just isn't anything that can be said!