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New Ewar resistances question
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Poranius Fisc
State War Academy
Caldari State
#21 - 2015-11-09 20:49:02 UTC
Amarisen Gream wrote:
Feather Storm wrote:
you do realize you are complaining about your chance to jam something that was unaffected by e-war before the proposed changes


I echo this point.


And if one of the DEV's say "that is curently how we want it to work for capitols", I would leave it at that.

But they haven't yet.
Poranius Fisc
State War Academy
Caldari State
#22 - 2015-11-09 20:59:12 UTC
Felsusguy wrote:
Poranius Fisc wrote:
Felsusguy wrote:
The change shouldn't affect ECM the most strongly. In fact, ECM might be better off after the changes.

ECM isn't affected by stacking penalties. Sensor dampeners, tracking disruptors, et cetera, are. The added resistance of capital ships means you'll need more modules targeting them for the same effect, thus stacking penalties become even more relevant. ECM will be able to make up for the increased resistance by doubling the amount of ECM used. Other forms of e-war will not.


Most of the time I am out in a jamming ship, I have a rainbow fit. If your in a roam, you probably wont have time to swap out to one type of jammer. In home defense, this obviously is not an issue. However: I gave an example of the middling sensor strengths on a dread.

An Archon's sensor strength is 72. Before compensation. That's roughly a 11% chance to jam.

With 6.. at best, you can get it to 66%. WHich is junk for jamming. before upcomming capitol ewar resistace

Which doesn't change the fact that ECM is not being any more affected than other forms of e-war.


Actualy, when your ewar will actually work, just be less effective as opposed to "miss". it is a different outcome.

If you can still damp down the range enough with sensor damps, it isnt going to change the fact that with 5 specific jammers, you still have a 5.5% per to basically not work.

your argueing apples and oranges.. unless all ewar becomes chance based.
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#23 - 2015-11-10 00:51:53 UTC
Poranius Fisc wrote:
By adding this resistance in game, is this going to be removing the sensor strength increases, or is ECM going to be double penalized?

Sensor strength only effects ECM, and any pilot can train this, so in a way, they increase their "resistance" to being jammed.

It wasn't mentioned before. This also may only effect caps.. but with sensor integrity bonuses, sensor strengths at 41+, this makes ECM very weak against them.


The new ewar resistances will have an equal effect on all forms of ewar. You cannot currently jam, web, sensor damp, turret disrupt, etc. a Supercapital at all. After this change goes through, you will be able to do so, but not as easily as you could to a subcapital ship. Not that hard to understand.

And, finally, since you can have everyone and their dog drop EC- drones on a hostile Supercapital, and everyone and their dog trying to jam said Supercapital, with no penalties for how many people are rolling the dice, I suspect it will really suck to be a Supercapital pilot in a large fleet fight. If the enemy brings a FYF with 20 Blackbirds, each of them may only have a small chance of landing a jam, but each time they do, that Supercapital will not be targeting or repairing anything for twenty seconds.

That's way better than what a Celestis will be able to do, since after the 4th or 5th sensor dampener, you are not doing much of anything to that Supercapital. Of course, good FYF's will also be sensor dampening said Supercapital once it is no longer jammed, with nasty results.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

Poranius Fisc
State War Academy
Caldari State
#24 - 2015-11-10 01:44:40 UTC
FT Diomedes wrote:
Poranius Fisc wrote:
By adding this resistance in game, is this going to be removing the sensor strength increases, or is ECM going to be double penalized?

Sensor strength only effects ECM, and any pilot can train this, so in a way, they increase their "resistance" to being jammed.

It wasn't mentioned before. This also may only effect caps.. but with sensor integrity bonuses, sensor strengths at 41+, this makes ECM very weak against them.


The new ewar resistances will have an equal effect on all forms of ewar. You cannot currently jam, web, sensor damp, turret disrupt, etc. a Supercapital at all. After this change goes through, you will be able to do so, but not as easily as you could to a subcapital ship. Not that hard to understand.

And, finally, since you can have everyone and their dog drop EC- drones on a hostile Supercapital, and everyone and their dog trying to jam said Supercapital, with no penalties for how many people are rolling the dice, I suspect it will really suck to be a Supercapital pilot in a large fleet fight. If the enemy brings a FYF with 20 Blackbirds, each of them may only have a small chance of landing a jam, but each time they do, that Supercapital will not be targeting or repairing anything for twenty seconds.

That's way better than what a Celestis will be able to do, since after the 4th or 5th sensor dampener, you are not doing much of anything to that Supercapital. Of course, good FYF's will also be sensor dampening said Supercapital once it is no longer jammed, with nasty results.


Soo much for the death of blobs than.
Xe'Cara'eos
A Big Enough Lever
#25 - 2015-11-10 21:41:35 UTC
I thought the new ewar resistances were for things OTHER than ECM?

For posting an idea into F&I: come up with idea, try and think how people could abuse this, try to fix your idea - loop the process until you can't see how it could be abused, then post to the forums to let us figure out how to abuse it..... If your idea can be abused, it [u]WILL[/u] be.
Poranius Fisc
State War Academy
Caldari State
#26 - 2015-11-10 22:08:43 UTC
Xe'Cara'eos wrote:
I thought the new ewar resistances were for things OTHER than ECM?

What was put out is that it will effect before the jam chance.

Here is the Evenews24 coverage.

"ECM / Tracking Disruptions / Sensor Dampeners / Target Painters: We’re introducing a new attribute ‘Electronic Warfare Resistance’. If your ship has 50% Electronic Warfare Resistance, any electronic warfare modules will be 50% less effective on the target. In the specific case of ECM, this takes effect before the roll against Sensor Strength is done. So it is possible to Jam / Disrupt / Damp a Titan…but for best results you should use bonused ships. Force Auxiliaries going into Triage and Dreadnoughts going into Siege could have their Electronic Warfare Resistance attribute set very high, but they won’t be un-counterable."
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2015-11-12 20:42:26 UTC
Hopefully capital ships will not be able to fit an ECCM module, or will have a capital version. Perhaps we could also have a capital jammer that can be fit to battleships and is ideal for jamming capital ships, or could jam ECCM'd subcaps albeit at a high cost of powergrid, capacitor, and a longer cycle time.


Capital ECCM I
50,000 MW, 80 CPU
+50% sensor strength
500 Gj activation cost, 20s duration



Capital Racial ECM Jammer I
1500 MW, 40 CPU
racial jam strength: 9
off-type jam strength: 3
Optimal: 36,000m
Falloff: 40,000m
480 Gj activation cost, 40s duration
Jam time: 20 seconds


The ECCM would be easy to fit to a capital ship but would have costs high enough for them to feel. Also, the sensor strength bonus is reduced due to them already having such a high amount.

The ECM jammer can be fit to any battleship and will be more powerful without bonuses than a max skill Rook or Falcon's jammers, but they are expensive to run and they have a cycle time of 40 seconds, while they only jam for 20 seconds. This is good against capital ships which may spend over 10s trying to reacquire a target, but subcaps will be more resistant due to being able to re-target so much faster. I put the powergrid cost at 1500MW so that Scorpions can fit a lot of these, but they will come at a high powergrid cost, which makes it unable to deck out with lots of other high powergrid cost modules such as cruise launchers, neutralizers, or smartbombs. These have a 50% range bonus which, when coupled with the Scorpion's bonuses, makes them extremely potent and very capable of attacking capital ships after the re-balance. They cost 5x the capacitor over time, and so a Scorpion trying to run a lot of these for an extended time will need capacitor support.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
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