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Crime & Punishment

 
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How was it possible? Bug, exploit or works as intended?
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Sam Moneymaker
Zdrang
#1 - 2015-10-19 10:45:12 UTC
Hi everybody,

Browsing kill mails I found an interesting fact:

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=30913919
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=30914219
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=30908281
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=30908565

and so on.

Noticed that was no wardec in place and none of the two attackers have been concorded. In some of the case aparrently was a rookie ship agressing the freighter.

Spoke to one of the pilots he has no clue what happened...for sure he didn't accept any duel invitation. Didn't find out yet if he logged off when seeing he is agressed.

The question is: if attacking the ship of a logged off player in hi sec one is not raising any criminal flag? No concorde response?

Those 2-3 guys killed quite a good number of freighters that day with this tactic. My guess is that is an exploit...am I right?
Revis Owen
Krigmakt Elite
Safety.
#2 - 2015-10-19 12:29:34 UTC
It was . . . Magic!

Agent of the New Order http://www.minerbumping.com/p/the-code.html If you do not have a current Mining Permit, please contact me for issuance.
Black Pedro
Mine.
#3 - 2015-10-19 13:20:34 UTC
Definitely magic.

But here is a clue to help you figure out the magic trick. Killboards, while very complete, are not using data provided directly from CCP and only show kills and losses from players that have provided their API.

The 8 Golden Rules of Eve

Why Do They Gank?
Sam Moneymaker
Zdrang
#4 - 2015-10-19 13:49:31 UTC
Black Pedro wrote:
Definitely magic.

But here is a clue to help you figure out the magic trick. Killboards, while very complete, are not using data provided directly from CCP and only show kills and losses from players that have provided their API.


Really??? Look at dmg given dmg taken...they kinda balance. Magic!

Better read my post again and see what was in fact the issue! Not even bother to give you another 4-5 reasons that your so called explanation is null.
Black Pedro
Mine.
#5 - 2015-10-19 14:06:26 UTC
Sam Moneymaker wrote:
Black Pedro wrote:
Definitely magic.

But here is a clue to help you figure out the magic trick. Killboards, while very complete, are not using data provided directly from CCP and only show kills and losses from players that have provided their API.


Really??? Look at dmg given dmg taken...they kinda balance. Magic!

Better read my post again and see what was in fact the issue! Not even bother to give you another 4-5 reasons that your so called explanation is null.

Ok, another clue for you since you seem to be a bit of a dim student. A killmail shows all the damage received by a target during the encounter for each pilot involved. If a pilot were to say reship after losing their stealth bomber, they would still appear only once on a killmail, not multiple times for each ship they were piloting. Class, let's look at a classic example of such a killmail from an innovator in the field of highsec ganking, Globby:

https://zkillboard.com/kill/44457228/

Notice how Globby and his companion have destroyed this freighter using just two catalysts, each putting out 40-60k damage? Have you figured this out yet, or do you need some more remedial lessons?

The 8 Golden Rules of Eve

Why Do They Gank?
Benson en Efnyssen
ATHANOR AQUISISTIONS
Domain Research and Mining Inst.
#6 - 2015-10-19 14:27:12 UTC
He noticed the number one topic on the first page of the C&P forum, the same as this post. .

The jig is up!
Sam Moneymaker
Zdrang
#7 - 2015-10-19 14:32:58 UTC
Black Pedro wrote:
Sam Moneymaker wrote:
Black Pedro wrote:
Definitely magic.

But here is a clue to help you figure out the magic trick. Killboards, while very complete, are not using data provided directly from CCP and only show kills and losses from players that have provided their API.


Really??? Look at dmg given dmg taken...they kinda balance. Magic!

Better read my post again and see what was in fact the issue! Not even bother to give you another 4-5 reasons that your so called explanation is null.

Ok, another clue for you since you seem to be a bit of a dim student. A killmail shows all the damage received by a target during the encounter for each pilot involved. If a pilot were to say reship after losing their stealth bomber, they would still appear only once on a killmail, not multiple times for each ship they were piloting. Class, let's look at a classic example of such a killmail from an innovator in the field of highsec ganking, Globby:

https://zkillboard.com/kill/44457228/

Notice how Globby and his companion have destroyed this freighter using just two catalysts, each putting out 40-60k damage? Have you figured this out yet, or do you need some more remedial lessons?


Ganker 1 dmg + Ganker 2 dmg = Freighter taken dmg...Look at those killmails.Why the heck you come up with stupid calculations from hyperdunking type ganking?

Those 2-3 pilots gave the full damage to those freighters. Full stop. My question was how it was possible without wardec and concord intervention? Can you make and effort and resume your answer to this? If you can give any answer at all.

And ofc some hyperdunkers will use expensive SBs not lousy cheap destroyers....
Benson en Efnyssen
ATHANOR AQUISISTIONS
Domain Research and Mining Inst.
#8 - 2015-10-19 14:41:45 UTC
Sam Moneymaker wrote:
Black Pedro wrote:
Sam Moneymaker wrote:
Black Pedro wrote:
Definitely magic.

But here is a clue to help you figure out the magic trick. Killboards, while very complete, are not using data provided directly from CCP and only show kills and losses from players that have provided their API.


Really??? Look at dmg given dmg taken...they kinda balance. Magic!

Better read my post again and see what was in fact the issue! Not even bother to give you another 4-5 reasons that your so called explanation is null.

Ok, another clue for you since you seem to be a bit of a dim student. A killmail shows all the damage received by a target during the encounter for each pilot involved. If a pilot were to say reship after losing their stealth bomber, they would still appear only once on a killmail, not multiple times for each ship they were piloting. Class, let's look at a classic example of such a killmail from an innovator in the field of highsec ganking, Globby:

https://zkillboard.com/kill/44457228/

Notice how Globby and his companion have destroyed this freighter using just two catalysts, each putting out 40-60k damage? Have you figured this out yet, or do you need some more remedial lessons?


Ganker 1 dmg + Ganker 2 dmg = Freighter taken dmg...Look at those killmails.Why the heck you come up with stupid calculations from hyperdunking type ganking?

Those 2-3 pilots gave the full damage to those freighters. Full stop. My question was how it was possible without wardec and concord intervention? Can you make and effort and resume your answer to this? If you can give any answer at all.

And ofc some hyperdunkers will use expensive SBs not lousy cheap destroyers....


I retract my previous statement.
Black Pedro
Mine.
#9 - 2015-10-19 14:53:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Black Pedro
Sam Moneymaker wrote:

Ganker 1 dmg + Ganker 2 dmg = Freighter taken dmg...Look at those killmails.Why the heck you come up with stupid calculations from hyperdunking type ganking?

Those 2-3 pilots gave the full damage to those freighters. Full stop. My question was how it was possible without wardec and concord intervention? Can you make and effort and resume your answer to this? If you can give any answer at all.

And ofc some hyperdunkers will use expensive SBs not lousy cheap destroyers....
Ok, you fail. You get an F.

There correct answer was: Hyperdunk. That's right class, a hyperdunk.

Those pilots did indeed do all the damage. The killmail lists all the damage per pilot so even though CONCORD blew their ship up many times during that PvP encounter, the killmail lists only the total damage. There are no CONCORD losses listed on the killboards because the hyperdunkers have not provided their APIs to the killboards. They are off-the-grid so to speak so even though they lost many stealth bombers during the hyperdunk, they are not recorded on the killboards leaving no evidence of CONCORD intervention.

The Stealth Bomber is the preferred (or at least an alternate) choice for hyperdunking in a 1.0 system as it has a very high alpha damage because of the large size of the target. CONCORD responds so quickly, that getting one or a few shots off provides more overall damage than using something like a Catalyst, which has high DPS, but less alpha damage than a Stealth Bomber so suffers when CONCORD show up so quickly.

Again, if you look at Globby, who has linked his API to the killboards, you can see evidence of this preference to hyperdunk with stealth bombers in high security status systems.

I am a little disappointed in you class. I recommend you spend some more time reviewing the classic ganking texts, and more time reading www.minerbumping.com to improve your performance.

The 8 Golden Rules of Eve

Why Do They Gank?
Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#10 - 2015-10-19 17:28:18 UTC
I have reviewed this class and found it wanting. I have reviewed the instructors involved and found them satisfactory, nay, excellent. The fault here is in the student.

You even used the word Hyperdunking and then immediately dismissed it. This indicates that you knew the word but not it's meaning. Your failing grade stands.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
Z'krooh
Doomheim
#11 - 2015-10-19 18:02:19 UTC
Let's assume that freighter is escorted. Can the escorting ships help this freighter under attack in some way?
Herbie Hancock
Exploded In
#12 - 2015-10-19 18:15:30 UTC
Z'krooh wrote:
Let's assume that freighter is escorted. Can the escorting ships help this freighter under attack in some way?


remote reps
Arec Bardwin
#13 - 2015-10-19 19:03:35 UTC
The strange part is that the freighter pilot failed to slip away, as he had a web buddy.
Paranoid Loyd
#14 - 2015-10-19 19:29:59 UTC
Arec Bardwin wrote:
The strange part is that the freighter pilot failed to slip away, as he had a web buddy.

Probably tried after the fact, or screwed up.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#15 - 2015-10-19 19:42:43 UTC
Jesus Sam, if you're the Mon(k)eymaker in your household, you must be pretty goddamned poor.

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#16 - 2015-10-19 20:18:16 UTC
Z'krooh wrote:
Let's assume that freighter is escorted. Can the escorting ships help this freighter under attack in some way?

Very easily yes. You can either counter bump to help the freighter get away (which is very low risk), remote rep the target (a single dude can keep the freighter up for a long time as the gankers have lots of down time between runs). In addition you can bring a single insta locking ship and keep trying to blap pods or the stealth bombers to make their lives more difficult.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
John E Normus
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#17 - 2015-10-19 20:42:55 UTC
Posting a Tengu Grib Domination™ thread.

feels good

Between Ignorance and Wisdom
Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#18 - 2015-10-19 20:59:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Tengu Grib
Honestly countering Hyperdunking is so easy that I didn't even bother getting my out of corp haulers set blue to Code (Which I'm sure Loyalanon would have if I had asked cause he's a cool bro). Since Globby popularized Hyperdunking our freighters had bumpers land on grid with them at least a half dozen times, but we have as of yet not lost a single freighter (ever).

The fact that CCP is nerfing Hyperdunking, to me, comes off as pandering to lazy whiners who can't be bothered to protect themselves. Seriously, you can call out in local for assistance, there are plenty of people who would gladly come get some easy killmails and save your freighter doing it (and not all of them are even hostile to Code).

You don't even need to have friends.

But whatever, one more step towards the Theme Park and the end of risk in High Sec.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
Kandu Harr
Doomheim
#19 - 2015-10-20 07:23:16 UTC
Posting in a 'stealth' hyperdunking thread.
Roll
Spruillo
Lord Narg Corporation
#20 - 2015-10-20 07:31:35 UTC
POSTING INA THREAD ABOUT EVE IS 2 EASY WHEN YOU CALCULATE GETTING EXPLODED EVERYTIME U UNDOCK I AM PROPERLY ASHAMED OCD CANT HELP IT

PLAYIN SPACE TRUCKS VROOM VROOM
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