EVE General Discussion

I just told you we use alts for day to day ganking, they don't leave highsec. We only bring our mains in once or twice a year if at all, you came to the exact opposite conclusion of what I said.

Good idea, this way the guns don't scare them

People seem to dislike missioning and general highsec income generation because it's antisocial. Apparently you can run L4s solo perfectly comfortably.

Personally, I don't like the idea of trying to make sub-L5 PVE content require cooperation because:

1) People will just run the stuff with alts, defeating the purpose.

2) I think solo players shouldn't be punished more than they already are.

It's an MMO, sure, but I don't think that should mean teamwork is a requirement in all things. Certainly those who bother working together should receive greater rewards than those who don't, and this is already the case. But if this is over-emphasized, at some point the game becomes unattractive to people who like to kick back and grind some ISK on their own after a while of fleet stuff.


There are maybe some ways you could make it so that solo missioning is not strictly solo, and two players are generating fun for each other outside the normal context of interaction in EVE. They would probably require a lot of work, though. For example, let players work as 'mission masters' who fulfill a sort of dungeon master-ish role in L4s and above. Plug into this terminal at a pirate station in nullsec and you can control the mission rats RTS-style and try to kill the guy(s) running the mission, then maybe the pirates pay you money or LP proportional to your performance.

Maybe this isn't the best example, but I think there are inventive ways you could spruce up highsec and make missions less one-dimensional.

Null politics and that entire sphere aside, the biggest issue remains risk aversion. Many people don't want to leave high-sec, but there are legitimate ******* reasons. You guys sitting on billions of ISK and passive revenue streams to rival small African countries might not remember what it's like for someone in their first few months; it's grueling, slow, and often tedious work.

Solo HS Income in T1 ships is really not that great, and saving up for a T1 cruiser and modules takes a few hours unless you get lucky with faction loot anoms. You insure that ship by paying 1/3 to 1/2 of the price you paid for it. In turn, the inevitable loss of that ship pays out less than the price of the hull alone. Going into low or null is very often fatal, especially for new players, and Eve has a very strong "HTFU, git gud, you were asking for it" culture (for better or worse, it's neither here nor there), which reinforces the "holy ****, I better stay out of there until I'm better prepared" mentality into players that haven't even left their home system yet.

When it takes you the better part of your playtime on any one day to grab a ship that is by all accounts disposable, then yeah, people are naturally going to avoid losing it as much as possible. Alter insurance from the joke it is now to something that actually helps; lower the price, increase the payout, make it indefinite- whatever, just change it.


Another issue is huge alliances crushing any hope for competition or newer players joining the political landscape. I don't even know how to tackle this (and I'm happy in my small, active corp- lucky for us, it's generally smaller corps nearby too). Seeing larger alliances rot from the inside out due to their own success and dominance is really great though, so we at least have that.

Can't orchestrate a high value gank against the guy when he's playing KotOR, short-sighted noob.

Expend a modicum of mental effort in a manner that'd result in not losing a potential target please.

SOME L4 missions are alright. Most of them are a waste of time you blitz through hoping to get the handful of desirable ones.

With L4 missions being randomly assigned, the overall value of their payouts compared to the "i pick exactly what I want via specific anomalies here in my null-sec system", the disparity is actual.

There is not much in code.
There are no more codies in ALLIANCE then there in an average nullsec CORP.
However, codie players in average have for more alts than the average in eve.



If code leaves New Eden, absolutely nothing will happen, as said, they are a bored minor entity.
With lots of alts there is not much they do, to add to the game.
They are so bored, they come from C&P to GD.

Most ppl might be in hisec, but they are not codies.

@OP
also, i do not think, that you can speak only for yourself and not your alliance, as this is code propaganda what you are doing.

tl;dr:
Guy from razor posts codepropaganda, there is not reason for fear.

EDIT:
lets flag this thread.

There are a few big things about hisec wars and such:
Most people living here don't want every run for ammo to be a huge logistical challenge (scouts, freighters, fuel, etc), or a second job. We already have those IRL, most of us. For most of us, one job is chore enough.

What this also means is anyone who goes wardeccing in hisec doesn't have to deal with the logistics of actually running a war machine. It's even a bad idea to wardec when you have serious assets sitting in space where your war targets and/or their mercs can shoot them. Better to just buy everything you need at the hub (a station trader is just as good as an indy corp in hisec).

Dealing with the constant threat of spies and thieves also becomes a chore. There are plenty of ignorant people flying around to scam and AWOX, but some know it's going to happen and simply don't want to mess with it. Maybe some NPE missions playing both sides of this kind of thing would help.

I know there's a big aversion to paywalls in this game, but there's a really big one: the utility of alts, and the near-necessity of having them "solo" PvPing. A scout is the difference between seeing that gatecamp and losing your ship to it, and it's way easier to start a second client than to find someone willing to look.

So where does that leave me?
I personally won't hand out a full API key to anybody. Ever. partly because I've how creative people get when they want to harass someone in another game, and exactly how nasty they can be. This account has all my characters on it, and handing over a full API key is pretty much a prerequisite for a lot of null corps. I know I'm not the only one who's learned to be careful what to expose to other players.

tl;dr

Eve is a victim of it's own success, code is merely a symptom. CCP: either go full HTFU or cater for WoW players. There is no middle ground.

I thought Drifters are going to make the thing harder

This. CODE is a bit like the Westboro Church.

Few people seem to realize this, but the Westboro Church, as a registered organisation, only has about 40 registered members. Fun fact, eh?

This is absolutely tiny and disproportionate to the scale of media attention and collective outrage they inspire as a result of actually very tiny groups of members picketing whatever occassional events. Hundreds of millions of people know about them, even though there is only some 40ish +nonregistered members, and all they've really done is hold placards considered offensive by most, nearby sensitive events.

Im largely ok with CODE, but I do recognise it has a very unusual player base that comprises some of the greatest trolls/social manipulators etc the game has to offer, from all sectors and demographics of EVE (alongside a deal of sycophants too).

Its tear farming, par excellence.
Minerbumping site content is excellent, and alone already justifies this format of meta and enrichens the game community environment.
And thats fine.

---

My suggestion of an increased sec status malus from illegal acts in HS is not intended to "nerf" HS ganking, nor directed at CODE.

Its intended just to rationalize the lasting repercussions of them, beyond just the ship destruction, by a small margin.
Hopefully to the end that it will result in more reds in HS, as more PvP content, as well as hopefully adding some content to LS in particular, when gankers return there to recoup their sec status.

Furthermore, its difficult to pre-emptively counter-aggress the non-affiliated CODE agents in particular, as they operate under the same security umbrella as their targets, in a loose/informal corp structure. Its quite ingenius really, but to me, illustrates a slight flaw in HS mechanics.

You would think that there would be Anti-CODE ingame organisations/corps, whos fun is in counter-ganking this corp, but for obvious reasons, this isnt really practically doable nor applicable.

The only indirect way around this that I can think of, that doesnt directly really impair anyone in any crippling or unfair fashion, on either side, is the increase in sec standing malus for illegal acts. So that these characters are flagged red, earlier, and thereafter are open PvP content (note:character. the important distinction here is that CONCORD will always blap the actual ship involves in a criminal act). The purpose of my proposal, is to more readily increase player PvP vs these characters, rather than the entire system merely balancing against CONCORD as essentially PvE.

See what I mean?