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Recent CODE Kill - Tactic Question
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Yong Shin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2015-09-14 17:49:56 UTC
Hello again folks,

First off, sorry if this post is bad and doesn't belong here. I just figured you folks would know best Pirate

On the most recent minerbumping.com entry, there is a kill of a Mach belonging to "rush Ormand". A relatively blinged-out, omni-tanked Mach. Not to mention the pilot's full set of high-grade Crystals and other hardwiring implants.

The killmail shows that the Enyo did 2k damage.

I am so baffled by how this was pulled off. Can anyone please shed some light? What can an Enyo have done to a Mach, that led to his death by mission NPCs? The curiosity is killing me.

Thank you! And congrats to somebody for an epic killmail.
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#2 - 2015-09-14 17:59:32 UTC
The Mach pilot might've been using polarized weapons, which reduces all ship resistances to zero (haven't looked at the KM yet, just wanted to be the first to reply)

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Paranoid Loyd
#3 - 2015-09-14 18:05:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Paranoid Loyd
Amarr ships will nuet, he ran out of cap and the NPCs kept shooting him as well as the Enyo. If your tank turns off in a room full of battleships, the Enyo won't do much damage in comparison.

Rush has quite the KB. Shocked

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Yong Shin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2015-09-14 18:24:00 UTC
Sorry, I would link the killmail but I remember reading somewhere I'm not allowed to do that.

Definitely wasn't using polarized weapons, though.

And biggest damage came from Imperial Bataivah. Bumblefck above mentions neuts, and that makes a lot of sense. But I assume that poor fellow would have succeeded in the mission if the Enyo wasn't there, so what could the Enyo have done that ruined him? Unless he was utterly incompetent, I would think he'd kill the neuters or do whatever needs to be done, instead of trying to hit a Enyo with AC's.

And yes thank you Bumblefck I did check out his KB after you mentioned it. Quite a sight!
Paranoid Loyd
#5 - 2015-09-14 18:29:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Paranoid Loyd
Flying a mach requires somewhat careful piloting to ensure you keep your transversal up, adding the wildcard of PVP into your normal PVE routine can be enough to make you fly foolishly enough to take heavy damage. The enyo also could have been nuet or vamp fit which pushed his cap beyond what is usually stable under normal PVE circumstances.

The single NPC ship damage shown is all of the damage done by all the NPCs in the current session, meaning a lot of that damage was most likely done before the enyo even got there.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Leto Thule
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6 - 2015-09-14 18:30:16 UTC
Yong Shin wrote:
Sorry, I would link the killmail but I remember reading somewhere I'm not allowed to do that.

Definitely wasn't using polarized weapons, though.

And biggest damage came from Imperial Bataivah. Bumblefck above mentions neuts, and that makes a lot of sense. But I assume that poor fellow would have succeeded in the mission if the Enyo wasn't there, so what could the Enyo have done that ruined him? Unless he was utterly incompetent, I would think he'd kill the neuters or do whatever needs to be done, instead of trying to hit a Enyo with AC's.

And yes thank you Bumblefck I did check out his KB after you mentioned it. Quite a sight!


Assault frigates are terrible to battleships. If the mach agressed him, all the enyo needed to do was hold him there, since the mach likely won't ever land a hit. If he was passive tanked its just a matter of time. If it's active tanked, he may have been nueted, run out of cap boosters, or simply mismanaged his cap use.

Thunderdome ringmaster, Community Leader and Lord Inquisitor to the Court of Crime and Punishment
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#7 - 2015-09-14 19:28:13 UTC
hahaha, sounds like someone got their battleship flipped.

Essentially you take a tanky assault frigate and add armour boosts and halo implants making its Sig radius the size of a small drone
Which makes the frigate an absolute nightmare for anything bigger than a cruiser to even hurt, Let alone kill.

From there you just go suspect and scan down mission runners and **** with them till one of them takes a swipe at you.

Both enyo and ishkur have a utility high slot for a small neut which is actually surprisingly potent over time

Here's some further reading on the subject courtesy of my old martini drinking CEO
http://evedarklord.blogspot.ca/2014/03/carebear-to-killer.html?m=1

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Yong Shin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2015-09-14 19:32:23 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
hahaha, sounds like someone got their battleship flipped.

Essentially you take a tanky assault frigate and add armour boosts and halo implants making its Sig radius the size of a small drone
Which makes the frigate an absolute nightmare for anything bigger than a cruiser to even hurt, Let alone kill.

From there you just go suspect and scan down mission runners and **** with them till one of them takes a swipe at you.

Both enyo and ishkur have a utility high slot for a small neut which is actually surprisingly potent over time

Here's some further reading on the subject courtesy of my old martini drinking CEO
http://evedarklord.blogspot.ca/2014/03/carebear-to-killer.html?m=1


Thanks ^^
Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2015-09-14 20:08:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Tipa Riot
Check the killboard of the player who killed the Mach for Enyo losses and you see a surprising simple fit. And he apparently flies an empty clone. Unfortunately boosters are not revealed on killmails, and the damage taken doesn't help here to know because of the repper. But with the raw HP value around 3.5k in one of the killmails I would say, no armor links.

I'm my own NPC alt.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#10 - 2015-09-14 20:14:42 UTC
Tipa Riot wrote:
Check the killboard of the player who killed the Mach for Enyo losses and you see a surprising simple fit. And he apparently flies an empty clone. Unfortunately boosters are not revealed on killmails, and the damage taken doesn't help here to know because of the repper. But with the raw HP value around 3.5k in one of the killmails I would say, no armor links.

Meh, links and implants aren't actually necessary just nice to have, hell you can make it work with just a t1 frigate as Omar tended to favour.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#11 - 2015-09-14 20:58:37 UTC
Enyo suckered him. He took the bait. Enyo scrammed. Rats nueted him. He died.
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#12 - 2015-09-14 23:54:28 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Tipa Riot wrote:
Check the killboard of the player who killed the Mach for Enyo losses and you see a surprising simple fit. And he apparently flies an empty clone. Unfortunately boosters are not revealed on killmails, and the damage taken doesn't help here to know because of the repper. But with the raw HP value around 3.5k in one of the killmails I would say, no armor links.

Meh, links and implants aren't actually necessary just nice to have, hell you can make it work with just a t1 frigate as Omar tended to favour.


Still love the Incursus for flipping, I just don't seem to get around to it much anymore. Actually, never managed to kill a battleship with one, but we've had a few folks in the past pull it off. Lately I've been using a Fed Navy Comet with some decent results... one ransomed SNI netting 150mil for 15 mins of work, and one hijacked Navy Apocalypse.
As Ralph pointed out though, a small sig radius and a high transversal coupled with a decent tank can accomplish some surprising feats.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2015-09-15 03:13:32 UTC
Looking at the killmail, the damage distribution and the NPC name, I can tell you what most likely happened..

It wasn't rats neuting. Most Amarr mission rats don't actually neut. I believe he was running a mission called "Smash the Supplier" which is one of the hardest lvl 4's available, consisting of a single room with a massive blob of 20-25 battleships in addition to several waves of frigates and cruisers. It also has a couple of unique elite battleships which hit extremely hard out to 70k. If you stop moving and the battleship blob is able to close range...I'm not sure even a marauder could tank them all for very long. Anythinf with T1 resists, even with a cap stable deadspace shield booster, is going to melt. I learned about this mission the hard way because it was the first and last mission I ran in my Navy Mega. Volleys of 6-800 through 70% resists from each of the 4 or so elite BS in addition to the incoming DPS from everything else.

The Machariel pilot was speed tanking, probably closer than he should have been to the blob. With autocannons he would need to be within 70-80k. Enyo went flashy and baited him, Mach pilot took the bait, and got webbed/scrammed infront of about two dozen Amarr BS rats. The Enyo only applied 2000 damage so that tells me that the rats melted that Mach within 2 minutes, tops.

Aggressing a suspect in your mission is dumb enough with the proliferation of baiters who have OGB and support alts on standby. Doing so while trying to clear one of the toughest L4's in the game is terms of incoming DPS - that's a recipe for a bad day and a funny lossmail.
Mephiztopheleze
Laphroaig Inc.
#14 - 2015-09-15 03:14:01 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Rush has quite the KB. Shocked


doesn't he just.

I especially like the ISK500m, 6% Hybrid Turret implant....

Occasional Resident Newbie Correspondent for TMC: http://themittani.com/search/site/mephiztopheleze

This is my Forum Main. My Combat Alt is sambo Inkura
Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2015-09-15 03:17:06 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Tipa Riot wrote:
Check the killboard of the player who killed the Mach for Enyo losses and you see a surprising simple fit. And he apparently flies an empty clone. Unfortunately boosters are not revealed on killmails, and the damage taken doesn't help here to know because of the repper. But with the raw HP value around 3.5k in one of the killmails I would say, no armor links.

Meh, links and implants aren't actually necessary just nice to have, hell you can make it work with just a t1 frigate as Omar tended to favour.


Still love the Incursus for flipping, I just don't seem to get around to it much anymore. Actually, never managed to kill a battleship with one, but we've had a few folks in the past pull it off. Lately I've been using a Fed Navy Comet with some decent results... one ransomed SNI netting 150mil for 15 mins of work, and one hijacked Navy Apocalypse.
As Ralph pointed out though, a small sig radius and a high transversal coupled with a decent tank can accomplish some surprising feats.


I've wanted to give the comet a try. It's pretty easy to fit neutrons + nos + t2 repper on one for a nice perma-tank, and an AB comet is significantly faster than any AF. Close to 1300 cold with no links/implants; adding those will make you tough to hit even for light drones.

That Painhaus guy has picked up a couple of shiny kills in Aunia lately. The last time I was in that system I couldn't get anyone to play ball. Wonder what he's doing differently?
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#16 - 2015-09-15 08:01:52 UTC
Comet takes some getting used to.
I do enjoy the increased speed, but it lacks both the incursus' massive bonus to reps and the ishkur/enyo's heavy duty resist profile.
On the other hand it's tracking bonus means less need to switch ammo between navy antimatter and void when it comes to dealing with drones.
It has a healthy middle ground between the t1 and t2 frigs for DPS and room for a small neut as well, BUT I've found it can suffer pretty heavily from drones due to it's weak tank.
I would not recommend for trying to flip ships that have drone bonuses, as a full flight of unbonused hob 2's coupled with anything that can actually hit you will put some serious hurt on you.

The Navy Apoc couldn't hit it, but the cruise SNI would have won the engagement if he'd had a web or a painter during the first minute or so when his drones were still alive.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2015-09-15 08:25:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Demerius Xenocratus
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Comet takes some getting used to.
I do enjoy the increased speed, but it lacks both the incursus' massive bonus to reps and the ishkur/enyo's heavy duty resist profile.
On the other hand it's tracking bonus means less need to switch ammo between navy antimatter and void when it comes to dealing with drones.
It has a healthy middle ground between the t1 and t2 frigs for DPS and room for a small neut as well, BUT I've found it can suffer pretty heavily from drones due to it's weak tank.
I would not recommend for trying to flip ships that have drone bonuses, as a full flight of unbonused hob 2's coupled with anything that can actually hit you will put some serious hurt on you.

The Navy Apoc couldn't hit it, but the cruise SNI would have won the engagement if he'd had a web or a painter during the first minute or so when his drones were still alive.


If you put dual EANMs + DCU in the lows you can get close to 70 omni-resist, with a nos repper and neutrons aswell. If you have links, it's pretty easy to get T2 resists across the board on a comet.

With that fit I once killed all 12 T2 light drones off an Algos while tanking the damage from them. You have to use a meta DCU to fit dual EANMs but from there it's a pretty basic fit. DPS will be higher than an incursus and bit lower than an AF.
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#18 - 2015-09-15 13:43:37 UTC
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
Looking at the killmail, the damage distribution and the NPC name, I can tell you what most likely happened..

It wasn't rats neuting. Most Amarr mission rats don't actually neut. I believe he was running a mission called "Smash the Supplier" which is one of the hardest lvl 4's available, consisting of a single room with a massive blob of 20-25 battleships in addition to several waves of frigates and cruisers. It also has a couple of unique elite battleships which hit extremely hard out to 70k. If you stop moving and the battleship blob is able to close range...I'm not sure even a marauder could tank them all for very long. Anythinf with T1 resists, even with a cap stable deadspace shield booster, is going to melt. I learned about this mission the hard way because it was the first and last mission I ran in my Navy Mega. Volleys of 6-800 through 70% resists from each of the 4 or so elite BS in addition to the incoming DPS from everything else.

The Machariel pilot was speed tanking, probably closer than he should have been to the blob. With autocannons he would need to be within 70-80k. Enyo went flashy and baited him, Mach pilot took the bait, and got webbed/scrammed infront of about two dozen Amarr BS rats. The Enyo only applied 2000 damage so that tells me that the rats melted that Mach within 2 minutes, tops.

Aggressing a suspect in your mission is dumb enough with the proliferation of baiters who have OGB and support alts on standby. Doing so while trying to clear one of the toughest L4's in the game is terms of incoming DPS - that's a recipe for a bad day and a funny lossmail.



Smash the Supplier is easy if you know what you are doing. All missions are easy to the point of mind-numbing if you know what you are doing.

In Smash the Supplier mission there are 4 cruisers that NOS, and 2 BS that NOS. Combine those with a small neut, and the cap stability crumbles, tank breaks, Mach goes boom.
Yong Shin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2015-09-15 17:21:10 UTC
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
Looking at the killmail, the damage distribution and the NPC name, I can tell you what most likely happened..

It wasn't rats neuting. Most Amarr mission rats don't actually neut. I believe he was running a mission called "Smash the Supplier" which is one of the hardest lvl 4's available, consisting of a single room with a massive blob of 20-25 battleships in addition to several waves of frigates and cruisers. It also has a couple of unique elite battleships which hit extremely hard out to 70k. If you stop moving and the battleship blob is able to close range...I'm not sure even a marauder could tank them all for very long. Anythinf with T1 resists, even with a cap stable deadspace shield booster, is going to melt. I learned about this mission the hard way because it was the first and last mission I ran in my Navy Mega. Volleys of 6-800 through 70% resists from each of the 4 or so elite BS in addition to the incoming DPS from everything else.

The Machariel pilot was speed tanking, probably closer than he should have been to the blob. With autocannons he would need to be within 70-80k. Enyo went flashy and baited him, Mach pilot took the bait, and got webbed/scrammed infront of about two dozen Amarr BS rats. The Enyo only applied 2000 damage so that tells me that the rats melted that Mach within 2 minutes, tops.

Aggressing a suspect in your mission is dumb enough with the proliferation of baiters who have OGB and support alts on standby. Doing so while trying to clear one of the toughest L4's in the game is terms of incoming DPS - that's a recipe for a bad day and a funny lossmail.



Yeah I remember that mission now haha. Had to warp out in a Navy Apoc, Nightmare, Vindicator, and Domi before finishing that mission. If I got webbed and scrammed I would have gotten owned~
unidenify
Deaf Armada
#20 - 2015-09-15 18:34:20 UTC
Yong Shin wrote:
Sorry, I would link the killmail but I remember reading somewhere I'm not allowed to do that.

!



you aren't allowing to post killmail anywhere in forum with exception for Crime and Punishment.

you can post killmail here.
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