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Summit Day 3 Quick Report

First post
Author
simukz
#21 - 2011-12-10 15:18:02 UTC
thx for info

<<< read before you respond >>>

Il Feytid
State War Academy
Caldari State
#22 - 2011-12-10 19:03:52 UTC
Anything on bots? I am in high sec and managed to get a level 4 mission runner bot stuck in a loop. His loop is exactly 4 min and 32 seconds of checking his mission for the Damsel (which I stole) and docking, undocking, warping back to mission, not moving for a few seconds and then redocking and repeating this process. As I type this he is on loop number 22. So for over an hour he is stuck in his bot loop. lol

Funny, but I would love to see more action and much faster to crush these bot users who ruin this game.
Max Kolonko
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#23 - 2011-12-10 22:28:18 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
Anything on bots? I am in high sec and managed to get a level 4 mission runner bot stuck in a loop. His loop is exactly 4 min and 32 seconds of checking his mission for the Damsel (which I stole) and docking, undocking, warping back to mission, not moving for a few seconds and then redocking and repeating this process. As I type this he is on loop number 22. So for over an hour he is stuck in his bot loop. lol

Funny, but I would love to see more action and much faster to crush these bot users who ruin this game.


did you reported him as bot?
Rex Glendower
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#24 - 2011-12-10 23:22:58 UTC
im sure for the most part the evolution of the game will be geared towards a better player experiences, many things could be improved on, null sec indexing for one, all ppl want change then when change happens they decide they like it the way it was. the nex was a blatant attempt to generate revenue from thin air via virtual goods if you fall for that it enforces the mentality that scams work not only in jita local:P new players will always have it hard the shear scope of the game will always ensure that and the more you add the harder it will be. lets face it it takes a certain intellectual conception to grasp eve-online and not all ppl are blessed with the lvl of intelligence needed. null space will it ever be that a 1 to 5 man corp can maintain a system and hold sovereignty that is doubtful . short of locking jump gates nothing will stop the mighty blob. one problem is the shear over population of the known galaxy. space simply shouldn't be this crowded distance and time maybe the only and best defense a space faring people can have perhaps a new galaxy should be discovered. the pilgrimage would be epic the resources would be limited "dreaming" probably. wh space needs more expansion i think more wh's within wh's that can not be accessed with anything other than sub caps and are so deep that a large fleet would not be enticed to fly in and attempt to pos bash. i can see a 20 deep wh only ever changing static tunnel would that not be awesome. ship ships more shiny ships .. why not fix the problems with the current ships caldari ships good only for missions missiles were so nerfed that they effectively killed any pvp viability other than tanking the damage so others can engage and kill the enemy . i am ranting and could go on and on..

dead space pockets work for high sec pirates why can't they work for small corps in sovereignty space a everlasting thorn in the side of your enemy
Il Feytid
State War Academy
Caldari State
#25 - 2011-12-11 06:28:45 UTC
Max Kolonko wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
Anything on bots? I am in high sec and managed to get a level 4 mission runner bot stuck in a loop. His loop is exactly 4 min and 32 seconds of checking his mission for the Damsel (which I stole) and docking, undocking, warping back to mission, not moving for a few seconds and then redocking and repeating this process. As I type this he is on loop number 22. So for over an hour he is stuck in his bot loop. lol

Funny, but I would love to see more action and much faster to crush these bot users who ruin this game.


did you reported him as bot?


Yup. He is still there. Botting his face off as I type this.

I added him to my address book. Will be interesting to see if he is ever kicked/logs in/etc.
Trebor Daehdoow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2011-12-11 10:15:26 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
Yup. He is still there. Botting his face off as I type this.

I added him to my address book. Will be interesting to see if he is ever kicked/logs in/etc.


Make a video of his antics, I'm sure it would be riveting watching.

Private Citizen • CSM in recovery

Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#27 - 2011-12-12 18:51:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Hans Jagerblitzen
I hope anime missile effects means they're finding a way to implement an Itano circus for all the Caldari pilots without bringing Tranquility to its knees...

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary

Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#28 - 2011-12-12 18:51:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Hans Jagerblitzen
I hope anime missile effects means they're finding a way to implement an Itano circus for all the Caldari pilots without bringing Tranquility to its knees...

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2011-12-13 09:23:10 UTC
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
Yup. He is still there. Botting his face off as I type this.

I added him to my address book. Will be interesting to see if he is ever kicked/logs in/etc.


Make a video of his antics, I'm sure it would be riveting watching.

Make sure to add a benny hill theme to it.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Vile rat
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#30 - 2011-12-13 12:48:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Vile rat
We've been called out for not being more vocal about what happens at summits and being vague with details, this is
valid somewhat. For me at least it's the terror of breaking NDA by accident but this is no excuse. Here's my initial
feelings about this summit, I hope you find it useful.

This summit felt different. There was a different vibe, and we weren't being sold ideas anymore, we were being sold
a complete change in how CCP does business. The death of the Jesus feature is actually a big one, as they've signaled
a desire to move away from choosing one big game changing feature and throwing all assets at that, to working on smaller more game impacting things that just need doing. It's refreshing and the Crucible expansion is a good example of this.
Who knows if this represents real change at CCP, I'll take some time to explain why I think it might.

Meetings during the last summit were very one way. They'd come in, explain a feature they were working on, then
they'd use us as a sounding board. Now? There were actual debates between Devs during summit meetings showing
they weren't just throwing us a product to look at, we were actually involved in the design part of this product and our
ideas were taken and debated by the Dev's present. This was a huge departure from the past and floored me when I saw
it. Another major change is the vibe and mannerisms by the Devs we met. Last time when discussing NeX and Incarna
we got a lot of people giving us the brave face and company line when confronted with us saying "You know walking
around one room isn't a feature right?" "You understand people aren't going to be thrilled about paying real money
to dress up dollies and the best hope you have is to set up a system that doesn't **** them off TOO much right?".
This time? No brave faces, no guarded company lines. Nobody trying to sell the upsides to something they know is
going to flop like a fish, just a bunch of people being open and realtalking about how they screwed up as an
organization, what they are doing to fix it, and how their design philosophy is going to move forward from this
point on. It was refreshing and makes me hopeful.

As I said this felt like a company that gets it. Pushing big features nobody wants isn't going to make the game
better, fixing stuff that has been lounging in the dustbin for ages is going to make the game better. Old abandoned
features are being revisited and there's a huge change where they want to update and repair the game we have now
instead of dreaming of a game that could be and not being able to deliver. For example you think the Incarna we got
was the Incarna that they dreamt of? No, that was just one in a long series of examples of a Jesus feature that they
had high hopes for but due to deadlines were only able to bring a small taste of. Nobody wanted to play sitting on a
sofa simulator, not the Devs, not the players, not Hilmar, that's just what we ended up getting because their
processes were broken and they couldn't operate in 2011 the same way they could in 2007 and be successful.
We did get to see some cool new features and a bit of neat 'shiny stuff' that made for great eye candy but really at
the end of it the gruntwork and change in company perspective were the biggest wins of this summit. You're not going
to see some grand new feature, you're going to see stuff like faction warfare and mining worked on. You're going to
see less Incarna, and more 'hey this feature over here has been broken since inception maybe we should just fix that
before we bring in some new thing that'll dazzle for a few weeks then be abandoned shortly after".

There's a lot of stuff that still needs work, they need to show they can take this shift in direction and maintain
it. They need to find some way to get their Devs behind a client playing the game for real instead of half assing it
and saying that since they flew a rifter out to cloud ring once last week this means they are in tune with how
mechanics really work. They need to prove that the health of the game that we have now is more important than the
possibility of throwing a hail mary pass and creating success by doing something crazy and flashy. What they showed
us is they get all this, but one update doesn't mean much.

I wouldn't have imagined in July they'd change like this though. I never would have imagined there'd be a sea change
like this.
Red Templar
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#31 - 2011-12-13 13:17:40 UTC
Nice write up!

[b]For Love. For Peace. For Honor.

For None of the Above.

For Pony![/b]

KFenn
Hail Britannia
#32 - 2011-12-13 13:29:11 UTC
Thanks for the write-up Vile.

One thing I will say that if you're that worried about breaching NDA then the NDA needs to be more clear in its scope. Considering the importance of such a document I'd have though it would have been very clearly defined.

Commanding Officer of the Treacle Tart Brigade

Vile rat
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#33 - 2011-12-13 13:34:25 UTC
KFenn wrote:
Thanks for the write-up Vile.

One thing I will say that if you're that worried about breaching NDA then the NDA needs to be more clear in its scope. Considering the importance of such a document I'd have though it would have been very clearly defined.



The problem is that the conversations tend to be freely roaming without somebody raising a flag saying "hey this is NDA" so it's difficult to really get a firm grasp on what is and isn't.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#34 - 2011-12-13 13:38:33 UTC
Thanks, Vile Rat.

Now I understand that WiS is officially the half-cooked feature that will be broken for the next 5 years. Frigganwesome. Roll

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

Vile rat
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#35 - 2011-12-13 13:51:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Vile rat
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Thanks, Vile Rat.

Now I understand that WiS is officially the half-cooked feature that will be broken for the next 5 years. Frigganwesome. Roll



Well they got this idea right? When things aren't going on and we're all hanging out in station we can walk around, interact, hell we could maybe even see the ships outside! (windows exist you know...) and maybe we can open up businesses and actually have a working sims like economy it would be a fun immersion aspect!

Only there's deadlines. Things don't go exactly as planned, features slip, the quality isn't what they expected from a CCP product. They bust their ass trying to make this all work but this deadline is approaching and Incarna has been hyped up like WHOAH cause it's a game changer.

What? We might be able to get exactly one small captains quarters done? We hyped the hell out of this great idea to only be able to deliver this?

Incarna.

There's nobody trying to make excuses, they know what went wrong and it's systemic. I'd say that's the real theme of the Crucible expansion. They've found the rot and are actively working to make the company right so they can get back to making the product right. I don't want to blow sunshine up your asses and say everything is great and oh man nothing but awesomeness from here on out, but there's a strong sense that it's going to take real work on the core game to win us back and they're going to do it.
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#36 - 2011-12-13 14:11:06 UTC
I can just say that I was one of the nullsec guys who were getting pretty close to quitting out of disgust with the direction CCP was heading, and CCP making gaffe after gaffe didn't help. Then Hilmar made the apology letter, crucible came out with (I believe) 300+ lines of changes vs 40-50 of the past few expansions for a few months' work, and I'm starting to get hopeful they've got their old awesome back.

I'm withholding the final judgement until they release the next expansion, but this writeup seems to indicate that I might be pleasantly surprised. If they keep up what they've done for crucible, only bigger and better (because they have more time and less ~panic~), then chances are I'll at least be a happy camper.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#37 - 2011-12-13 14:43:24 UTC
Vile rat wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Thanks, Vile Rat.

Now I understand that WiS is officially the half-cooked feature that will be broken for the next 5 years. Frigganwesome. Roll



Well they got this idea right? When things aren't going on and we're all hanging out in station we can walk around, interact, hell we could maybe even see the ships outside! (windows exist you know...) and maybe we can open up businesses and actually have a working sims like economy it would be a fun immersion aspect!

Only there's deadlines. Things don't go exactly as planned, features slip, the quality isn't what they expected from a CCP product. They bust their ass trying to make this all work but this deadline is approaching and Incarna has been hyped up like WHOAH cause it's a game changer.

What? We might be able to get exactly one small captains quarters done? We hyped the hell out of this great idea to only be able to deliver this?

Incarna.

There's nobody trying to make excuses, they know what went wrong and it's systemic. I'd say that's the real theme of the Crucible expansion. They've found the rot and are actively working to make the company right so they can get back to making the product right. I don't want to blow sunshine up your asses and say everything is great and oh man nothing but awesomeness from here on out, but there's a strong sense that it's going to take real work on the core game to win us back and they're going to do it.


Glad for you, but read my signature.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

Vile rat
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#38 - 2011-12-13 14:45:39 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Vile rat wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Thanks, Vile Rat.

Now I understand that WiS is officially the half-cooked feature that will be broken for the next 5 years. Frigganwesome. Roll



Well they got this idea right? When things aren't going on and we're all hanging out in station we can walk around, interact, hell we could maybe even see the ships outside! (windows exist you know...) and maybe we can open up businesses and actually have a working sims like economy it would be a fun immersion aspect!

Only there's deadlines. Things don't go exactly as planned, features slip, the quality isn't what they expected from a CCP product. They bust their ass trying to make this all work but this deadline is approaching and Incarna has been hyped up like WHOAH cause it's a game changer.

What? We might be able to get exactly one small captains quarters done? We hyped the hell out of this great idea to only be able to deliver this?

Incarna.

There's nobody trying to make excuses, they know what went wrong and it's systemic. I'd say that's the real theme of the Crucible expansion. They've found the rot and are actively working to make the company right so they can get back to making the product right. I don't want to blow sunshine up your asses and say everything is great and oh man nothing but awesomeness from here on out, but there's a strong sense that it's going to take real work on the core game to win us back and they're going to do it.


Glad for you, but read my signature.


Please don't get the impression what I've said directly addresses anything that you have in your signature, because it doesn't. I was giving overall impressions, not specific examples or anything tangible. For that you'll have to wait for the minutes.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#39 - 2011-12-13 14:54:51 UTC
Vile rat wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Vile rat wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Thanks, Vile Rat.

Now I understand that WiS is officially the half-cooked feature that will be broken for the next 5 years. Frigganwesome. Roll



Well they got this idea right? When things aren't going on and we're all hanging out in station we can walk around, interact, hell we could maybe even see the ships outside! (windows exist you know...) and maybe we can open up businesses and actually have a working sims like economy it would be a fun immersion aspect!

Only there's deadlines. Things don't go exactly as planned, features slip, the quality isn't what they expected from a CCP product. They bust their ass trying to make this all work but this deadline is approaching and Incarna has been hyped up like WHOAH cause it's a game changer.

What? We might be able to get exactly one small captains quarters done? We hyped the hell out of this great idea to only be able to deliver this?

Incarna.

There's nobody trying to make excuses, they know what went wrong and it's systemic. I'd say that's the real theme of the Crucible expansion. They've found the rot and are actively working to make the company right so they can get back to making the product right. I don't want to blow sunshine up your asses and say everything is great and oh man nothing but awesomeness from here on out, but there's a strong sense that it's going to take real work on the core game to win us back and they're going to do it.


Glad for you, but read my signature.


Please don't get the impression what I've said directly addresses anything that you have in your signature, because it doesn't. I was giving overall impressions, not specific examples or anything tangible. For that you'll have to wait for the minutes.


49 days and 1,337 posts later, still no CCP has commented on the WiS thread*, and apparently you didn't talked about the issue at the meeting neither... a deafening silence, isn't it? Roll

*here: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=244597#post244597

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

Vile rat
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#40 - 2011-12-13 15:05:05 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:

49 days and 1,337 posts later, still no CCP has commented on the WiS thread*, and apparently you didn't talked about the issue at the meeting neither... a deafening silence, isn't it? Roll

*here: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=244597#post244597



Have you been paying attention? WiS rollout wasn't their finest hour. If you're trying to build a groundswell of players who think that space dollies should take precedence over fixing all the problems with the core gameplay, good luck to you but I'm not on your side on this one.
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