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Is it possible for the Empires to come to a truce?

Author
Tyrel Toov
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#21 - 2015-08-26 18:50:24 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
We Amarrians are a peace-loving people, but unfortunately the Republic is run by a bunch of psychopaths who revel in death and destruction.

Bullshit. Before I became a capsuleer I was a combat engineer. I watched your "peace loving" people glass entire towns, I saw slavers shoot women, children, and the elderly for trying to flee, and watched as my people were taken in chains and beaten even when they didn't resist. If this is your "peace" I'd prefer to have war.

I want to paint my ship Periwinkle.

Skyweir Kinnison
Doomheim
#22 - 2015-08-26 18:52:08 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Skyweir Kinnison wrote:
Anything is possible.

2. Amarr already has a declared ally in the Caldari State. Why aren't they helping, since the mechanisms are already in place? It appears that they haven't been asked.


The Alliance between the State and Empire refers to the state of affairs between the Empire, Federation, Republic and The State. It did not give the Empress carte blanche to drag us into any war she felt like starting without consulting us first. Any decision by The State to get involved at this point would follow the steps below:

1. Formal request by the Empire
2. CEP weighs up the costs and benefits of involvement
3. Decision to get involved or not announced
4. Outcome


Exactly what I thought.

So if Amarr wanted help, they have the mechanisms in place to approach the State with such a request - far more easily than approaching the Federation, and an order of magnitude easier than having to scrape to the Republic.

They don't appear to want help. Yet.

Humanity has won its battle. Liberty now has a country.

Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#23 - 2015-08-26 18:52:30 UTC
Tyrel Toov wrote:
Rodj Blake wrote:
We Amarrians are a peace-loving people, but unfortunately the Republic is run by a bunch of psychopaths who revel in death and destruction.

Bullshit. Before I became a capsuleer I was a combat engineer. I watched your "peace loving" people glass entire towns, I saw slavers shoot women, children, and the elderly for trying to flee, and watched as my people were taken in chains and beaten even when they didn't resist. If this is your "peace" I'd prefer to have war.


I hardly think that the Aidonis committee would have honoured Emperor Heideran VII if what you say is true.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori

Ayallah
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2015-08-26 18:54:00 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
Peace between the empires existed for over a century. And that peace would still be surviving until today had it not been for the insane actions of Shakor and his self-styled Elders.

Even after they attacked Amarr, Empress Jamyl took the brave step of releasing an unprecedented number of slaves. Many of us hoped that this peace overture would have some effect on the Minmatars. But did the Shakorites even consider making overtures of their own? They did not.

Is a truce possible?

We Amarrians are a peace-loving people, but unfortunately the Republic is run by a bunch of psychopaths who revel in death and destruction.



Peace existed nine hundred and ninety eight years ago when a peace loving people brutally enslaved and worked to destroy another people who offended their idea that they alone were of god.

Says the abuser to who they abuse:
"You make me do this to you."

Goddess of the IGS

As strength goes.

Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#25 - 2015-08-26 18:54:13 UTC
Skyweir Kinnison wrote:
They don't appear to want help. Yet.

For the moment it does seem kind of personal. Killing the Empress probably guaranteed that in the short run.

Which, again, may have been the Drifters being clever.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#26 - 2015-08-26 19:00:12 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
I hardly think that the Aidonis committee would have honoured Emperor Heideran VII if what you say is true.


Quote:

Their only gripe is with the Amarrian society itself, such as practices of slavery and other breaches of human rights.


Slavers raiding Republic space might not be officially working for the Empire, but we all know that it isn't the Angels who have the largest slave markets. And that doesn't address raids into the Thukker territories in Great Wildlands.

So really, humanitarian awards for peace between the empires... they're wonderful and high-minded and we're all very sure they impress the mega-wealthy... but the oppressed would just as likely tell you where you can shove them.
Skyweir Kinnison
Doomheim
#27 - 2015-08-26 19:07:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Skyweir Kinnison
Aria Jenneth wrote:
Skyweir Kinnison wrote:
They don't appear to want help. Yet.

For the moment it does seem kind of personal. Killing the Empress probably guaranteed that in the short run.

Which, again, may have been the Drifters being clever.


Indeed. Any in many ways, I admire and applaud the Empire for its stance. If it proves possible for Amarr to defend herself from this threat, it is far preferable for them to do so. It would play well at home, and restore their sense of faith. Not so wonderful for the rest of us, as arrogant Amarrians high on victory are not noted for flexibility, but any government would want to avenge the murder of their leader themselves. Look at how crazy the Republic went when Midular was assasinated.

In addition, none of the stable and experienced governments will want to make the task of asking for help any harder. We all know how stiff-necked Amarr can be, and there should be no hint of making them beg should they be forced to seek aid.

Because if they get to that stage, we'll all know there is a very serious threat.

Humanity has won its battle. Liberty now has a country.

Tyrel Toov
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#28 - 2015-08-26 19:20:47 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
Tyrel Toov wrote:
Rodj Blake wrote:
We Amarrians are a peace-loving people, but unfortunately the Republic is run by a bunch of psychopaths who revel in death and destruction.

Bullshit. Before I became a capsuleer I was a combat engineer. I watched your "peace loving" people glass entire towns, I saw slavers shoot women, children, and the elderly for trying to flee, and watched as my people were taken in chains and beaten even when they didn't resist. If this is your "peace" I'd prefer to have war.


I hardly think that the Aidonis committee would have honoured Emperor Heideran VII if what you say is true.

And yet, it is. And to this day it happens. Just because someone received an accolade doesn't mean that they deserve it.

I want to paint my ship Periwinkle.

Cain Aloga
SoE Roughriders
Electus Matari
#29 - 2015-08-26 19:45:52 UTC
I believe that the Tribal Council's position on the drifters is that they do not represent a current threat to the Republic. No doubt they will continue to monitor the situation and adjust their position as changes.

With this in mind, I do not forsee the Republic coming to aide the Great Enemy, even should they request it.

While our warriors fight for our people's freedom, we in turn should fight for our people's prosperity.

Ahman Nahrid
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#30 - 2015-08-26 20:18:32 UTC
Though I have but passing knowledge of the subject, I was made aware of the possible connection between the Drifters and the Sleepers, and that the Drifters have struck against the Empress and the Empire due to the perceived ransacking of Sleeper installations by Imperial agents. However, such was performed by Federal, State, Republic and independent parties as well - in time leading to the Tech 3 series of cruisers.

Under the assumption that there is indeed a direct relation between the Drifters and Sleepers, and that the Drifter aggression is a determined act of aggressive defense - or retribution - against further salvaging of Sleeper components, it is highly likely the Drifters ultimately intend to strike at Empire, Kingdom, Mandate, Federation, State and Republic alike.

As such, one must consider that it lies within the Drifters' strategy to isolate and eliminate major opposition one by one, by exploiting inherent vulnerabilities within and between each individual faction. The Empress was a figure of leadership that Greater Amarr ralied around, and her death now hampers overall defense why the succession is being conducted. Likewise, if acting upon the intended strategy of divide-and-conquer, the drifters shall indeed avoid profiling themselves as a threat to the Republic to further deter its involvement - and likely seek to exploit tribal divisions to their own advantage. Apply these methods to the Federation (whose President provides a public leader to the Gallente as the Empress did Greater Amarr) and the Caldari (whose megacorporations are by nature as competitive for limited resources as the Minmatar tribes).

A unified New Eden would present the Drifters with a force that is flexible and adaptive, bringing strengths and combat doctrines to the field that can compensate for the weaknesses of others. Yet isolated, the drifters are able to adapt and eliminate each faction piecemeal. Unlike us, the Drifters are unlikely to be internally divided.

Thus one must now weigh the cost of building and fighting within a Great Alliance at the risk the threat was only ever to Amarr, or the cost of passively observing at the risk the Drifters are indeed set on establishing dominance across the entire cluster - and to be eliminated one by one.
Avio Yaken
Stay Frosty.
A Band Apart.
#31 - 2015-08-26 21:34:58 UTC
I'm looking at a dream aren't i? While the bitter relationship between both the Minmatar and Amarr is understandable..

If the Drifters really are the sleepers are planning to launch a attack on another Empire then the leaders of theses nations should in my opinion consider forming a temp alliance in order to combat the Drifters....While they have many disagrements and bad blood, none of that is gonna matter IF the Drifters are really here to wipe out everyone and not just the Empire...

IF we combine our forces and brightest minds we could become a force that could cause some serious damage to the Drifters...

By merging our fleets we can cover everything from ECM to Target painters...Neuts to Damps

By forming a joint science team we can work towards better understanding theses drifters, develop tactics, learn if they have a weakness and how we can exploit it


And if we overcome the Drifters we can return to our usual war...Or go back to living in peace...Thats what i see..


(.___________________________________________.)/

Anabella Rella
Gradient
Electus Matari
#32 - 2015-08-26 21:48:11 UTC
Aria Jenneth wrote:

You'll burn last. With all your kin. And there'll be no one left to help you.

Condescension thy name is Jenneth.

Since apparently foreseeing the future is among your varied skillset how about telling us all who the next emperor/empress will be? I have some spare isk laying around and I'd love to bet on a sure thing.

You and the others spouting this rhetoric have no damned hard evidence that the Drifters have anything else in mind beyond revenge on the imperials for some unstated grievance. None. Produce some credible evidence that these beings aren't specifically targeting the slavers and plan to attack the rest of us and I'll listen. Until then you're simply opining and attempting to scare people into aiding your ally.

No pilot, this is an Amarrian problem that should be left to the Amarr to sort out on their own.

When the world is running down, you make the best of what's still around.

Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#33 - 2015-08-26 22:00:39 UTC
There was already a ridiculous attempt of making a truce, a parody on a peace conference, which even decided to not listen to Caldari position.

As for possibility for truce, it really isn't hard to accomplish. As soon as Federals will admit their war crimes, submit all those who planned operation Highlander to Caldari war tribunal, cease torturing Caldari POWs in their camps, as soon as all gallente population will be removed from Caldari Prime and territory of the planet, around it, and leading to it will become Caldari territory, and all gallente occupants will leave Caldari warzone, as well as a charter that started this Federation will be annuled, only then Gallente and Caldari people will be able to live in peace.

Then we will have this truce.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Soren Tyrhanos
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#34 - 2015-08-26 22:03:01 UTC
Avio Yaken wrote:
I'm looking at a dream aren't i? While the bitter relationship between both the Minmatar and Amarr is understandable..

If the Drifters really are the sleepers are planning to launch a attack on another Empire then the leaders of theses nations should in my opinion consider forming a temp alliance in order to combat the Drifters....While they have many disagrements and bad blood, none of that is gonna matter IF the Drifters are really here to wipe out everyone and not just the Empire...

IF we combine our forces and brightest minds we could become a force that could cause some serious damage to the Drifters...

By merging our fleets we can cover everything from ECM to Target painters...Neuts to Damps

By forming a joint science team we can work towards better understanding theses drifters, develop tactics, learn if they have a weakness and how we can exploit it


And if we overcome the Drifters we can return to our usual war...Or go back to living in peace...Thats what i see..




Perhaps it is a dream but it is one worth pursuing if it means the preserving the lives of the people who inhabit the Holy Amarr Empire , both slave and citizen, and those beyond should these incursions develop into something larger than 'an Amarrian concern'.
Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#35 - 2015-08-26 22:07:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Claudia Osyn
Diana Kim wrote:
There was already a ridiculous attempt of making a truce, a parody on a peace conference, which even decided to not listen to Caldari position.

As for possibility for truce, it really isn't hard to accomplish. As soon as Federals will admit their war crimes, submit all those who planned operation Highlander to Caldari war tribunal, cease torturing Caldari POWs in their camps, as soon as all gallente population will be removed from Caldari Prime and territory of the planet, around it, and leading to it will become Caldari territory, and all gallente occupants will leave Caldari warzone, as well as a charter that started this Federation will be annuled, only then Gallente and Caldari people will be able to live in peace.

Then we will have this truce.

Whelp, you heard it here folks. The highest authority in the state has issued her demands for a truce.

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.

Avio Yaken
Stay Frosty.
A Band Apart.
#36 - 2015-08-26 22:09:20 UTC
Soren Tyrhanos wrote:
Avio Yaken wrote:
I'm looking at a dream aren't i? While the bitter relationship between both the Minmatar and Amarr is understandable..

If the Drifters really are the sleepers are planning to launch a attack on another Empire then the leaders of theses nations should in my opinion consider forming a temp alliance in order to combat the Drifters....While they have many disagrements and bad blood, none of that is gonna matter IF the Drifters are really here to wipe out everyone and not just the Empire...

IF we combine our forces and brightest minds we could become a force that could cause some serious damage to the Drifters...

By merging our fleets we can cover everything from ECM to Target painters...Neuts to Damps

By forming a joint science team we can work towards better understanding theses drifters, develop tactics, learn if they have a weakness and how we can exploit it


And if we overcome the Drifters we can return to our usual war...Or go back to living in peace...Thats what i see..




Perhaps it is a dream but it is one worth pursuing if it means the preserving the lives of the people who inhabit the Holy Amarr Empire , both slave and citizen, and those beyond should these incursions develop into something larger than 'an Amarrian concern'.


This is bigger than just the Amarr...This is for Humanity...

(.___________________________________________.)/

Tyrel Toov
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#37 - 2015-08-26 22:13:50 UTC
Avio Yaken wrote:
Soren Tyrhanos wrote:
Avio Yaken wrote:
I'm looking at a dream aren't i? While the bitter relationship between both the Minmatar and Amarr is understandable..

If the Drifters really are the sleepers are planning to launch a attack on another Empire then the leaders of theses nations should in my opinion consider forming a temp alliance in order to combat the Drifters....While they have many disagrements and bad blood, none of that is gonna matter IF the Drifters are really here to wipe out everyone and not just the Empire...

IF we combine our forces and brightest minds we could become a force that could cause some serious damage to the Drifters...

By merging our fleets we can cover everything from ECM to Target painters...Neuts to Damps

By forming a joint science team we can work towards better understanding theses drifters, develop tactics, learn if they have a weakness and how we can exploit it


And if we overcome the Drifters we can return to our usual war...Or go back to living in peace...Thats what i see..




Perhaps it is a dream but it is one worth pursuing if it means the preserving the lives of the people who inhabit the Holy Amarr Empire , both slave and citizen, and those beyond should these incursions develop into something larger than 'an Amarrian concern'.


This is bigger than just the Amarr...This is for Humanity...

Which, if I remember correctly, means just the Amarr. Because everyone else is "subhuman" in there book.

I want to paint my ship Periwinkle.

Soren Tyrhanos
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#38 - 2015-08-26 22:25:28 UTC
Tyrel Toov wrote:
Avio Yaken wrote:
Soren Tyrhanos wrote:
Avio Yaken wrote:
I'm looking at a dream aren't i? While the bitter relationship between both the Minmatar and Amarr is understandable..

If the Drifters really are the sleepers are planning to launch a attack on another Empire then the leaders of theses nations should in my opinion consider forming a temp alliance in order to combat the Drifters....While they have many disagrements and bad blood, none of that is gonna matter IF the Drifters are really here to wipe out everyone and not just the Empire...

IF we combine our forces and brightest minds we could become a force that could cause some serious damage to the Drifters...

By merging our fleets we can cover everything from ECM to Target painters...Neuts to Damps

By forming a joint science team we can work towards better understanding theses drifters, develop tactics, learn if they have a weakness and how we can exploit it


And if we overcome the Drifters we can return to our usual war...Or go back to living in peace...Thats what i see..




Perhaps it is a dream but it is one worth pursuing if it means the preserving the lives of the people who inhabit the Holy Amarr Empire , both slave and citizen, and those beyond should these incursions develop into something larger than 'an Amarrian concern'.


This is bigger than just the Amarr...This is for Humanity...

Which, if I remember correctly, means just the Amarr. Because everyone else is "subhuman" in there book.


Where have I called anyone 'subhuman'?
Tyrel Toov
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#39 - 2015-08-26 22:58:17 UTC
Soren Tyrhanos wrote:


Where have I called anyone 'subhuman'?


quote wrote:
None shall stand higher than you save the Sefrim,
Who serve Me as others shall serve you,
For all things under Me serve one higher;
So Amarr shall rule the worlds of the Heavens.

Basically this says it for you.

I want to paint my ship Periwinkle.

Markus Error
Manfios
#40 - 2015-08-26 23:25:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Markus Error
We can all agree that the Drifters are a threat to humanity (not humanity as defined by the Amarr solely) but unfortunately humanity seems astonishingly apathetic.

Although, yes, the most like course of events is either impassive staring, popcorn, or interested observation as the Amarr fight their war with the Drifters. Anyone care to place bets on the outcome?

"If it cannot be shot the #### down, it can always be blown the #### up."

-Unknown