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[Hydrostatic] Reward for the return of Empress Jamyl I's body

Author
Goldfinch
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2015-08-24 20:20:29 UTC

Ashterothi wrote:
due diligence

Makoto Priano wrote:
And you are saying, if we are presented biomass as the Empress's, we should not perform due diligence and verify, at the very least, that it is indeed the Empress before presenting it to the chamberlain?


Again, with all due respect neither of you are Amarr, and not of the Faith. We generally respect your opinions, but in the matter of the Amarr Empress, we don't think Gallentean and State interest parties should have the first and absolute say in what is invasive and isn't.

It is troubling to see no reverence or mutual respect for our beliefs. We would never personally insist on doing the same to you or your head of state in a similar situation. It is undiplomatic and disrespectful to insist on inspecting the Empress's remains. That your motives are benevolent is not the point. You are not her family. You are not a representative of the theocratic government of Amarr.

We are surprised there is no ethical tenet for privacy within the bounds of your scientific operation. Do you not consider privacy to be a part of your ethical obligations? Does your "due diligence" require you to roll roughshod over any concerns of privacy and personal sanctity?

\J/

veiled and bound

my origin story (on eve-backstage)

Ashterothi
The Order of Thelemic Ascension
The Invited
#22 - 2015-08-24 20:30:10 UTC
Claudia Osyn wrote:
Makoto Priano wrote:
You all know my opinion of the madwoman. Please don't feed the troll.

But the way she nibbles the bait is so cute.....


On topic, I'm not sure what you would learn from the body aside from the fact that it was in an explosion then subsequently exposed to the vacuum of space.



If SoCT is interested in her, so am I.

In all reality, we have already seen counterfeit bodies appear. Proper identification of the body is important before we can return it.
Phyridean
Derp Shipping Co.
#23 - 2015-08-24 20:36:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Phyridean
Goldfinch, with all due respect in return, I am Ni Kunni and have followed the faith throughout my journeys through Caldari and Gallente space. I want to see the Empress's remains treated with respect as much as you do. If we can successfully find the capsuleer who retrieved her body, I would be happy to directly contact the Sarum family to secure their cooperation. I believe that they, like us, will want her identity verified.

A simple scan of her body and a non-invasive retrieval of her capsuleer implant telemetry data could be vital in countering the Drifter threat, which I believe everyone here, and especially those living in the Empire, will agree is in the Cluster's best interest, but I am willing to concede that point if necessary.
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
#24 - 2015-08-24 20:38:17 UTC
I and my corporation support your request and will add to the reward. We assume that should you acquire this information that you will share it with the capsuleer community. There are enough questions regarding her person that need to be answered that even stealing the shell that was once Jamyl Sarum should be considered. But out of respect for her person and her people, the non-invasive scan should be the most that is performed upon her.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.

Amalla Galltera
Slightly Damaged Goods
#25 - 2015-08-24 20:40:06 UTC
Whoever has it's corpse should dispose of it immediately, in the most brutal way possible. Preferably by giving it to the Circadian Sleepers to have fun experimenting on the evil *****.
Goldfinch
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2015-08-24 20:46:26 UTC

Your Empress, Phyridean, did not want herself scanned when she was alive. Please respect her word and see to your duty as Amarr not to take it upon yourself to violate her privacy, as Matshi Raish did.

Can you give us your guarantee that no scans will be made without explicit approval from her family and the Chamberlain? There is an unmistakable element of deception, as employed by the SoCT, that haunts your hunt for knowledge in this matter. See the responses of your own colleagues. Would you please dispel these concerns by agreeing to operate strictly under the auspices of Amarr Law?

\J/

veiled and bound

my origin story (on eve-backstage)

Makoto Priano
Kirkinen-Arataka Transhuman Zenith Consulting Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#27 - 2015-08-24 20:52:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Makoto Priano
To be frank, I'll admit to thinking Goldfinch's demand that we do not so much as verify the identity of the corpse is extreme and unreasonable.

However, to Ashterothi and Phyridian both, I advise this: you must dispense with any notion of scientific inquiry in this case. Our objective must be recovery of her remains, verification that the remains are the Empress's, and then return of those remains to the Empire for interment.

The likelihood that her remains will teach us anything new about the Drifter threat is so low as to be nonexistent, and the insult to the faithful would be considerable.

Frankly, it's not worth doing anything more than verifying that, indeed, the Empress's remains have been recovered.

Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries: exploring the edge of the known, advancing the state of the art. Would you like to know more?

Ashterothi
The Order of Thelemic Ascension
The Invited
#28 - 2015-08-24 20:59:57 UTC
Goldfinch wrote:

Ashterothi wrote:
due diligence

Makoto Priano wrote:
And you are saying, if we are presented biomass as the Empress's, we should not perform due diligence and verify, at the very least, that it is indeed the Empress before presenting it to the chamberlain?


Again, with all due respect neither of you are Amarr, and not of the Faith. We generally respect your opinions, but in the matter of the Amarr Empress, we don't think Gallentean and State interest parties should have the first and absolute say in what is invasive and isn't.

It is troubling to see no reverence or mutual respect for our beliefs. We would never personally insist on doing the same to you or your head of state in a similar situation. It is undiplomatic and disrespectful to insist on inspecting the Empress's remains. That your motives are benevolent is not the point. You are not her family. You are not a representative of the theocratic government of Amarr.

We are surprised there is no ethical tenet for privacy within the bounds of your scientific operation. Do you not consider privacy to be a part of your ethical obligations? Does your "due diligence" require you to roll roughshod over any concerns of privacy and personal sanctity?



So that you are aware I grew up True Amarr loyal to the Theology Council. I attended the Empress' funeral and paid my respect to the late Empress.

While I may not hold the faith anymore, the gravity of the situation is far from lost on me.

My college Phyridian is Ni Kunni. He and I have discussed this matter at length and are very interested in preserving the dignity of the situation as much as possible. Ultimately we believe this to be the best of a bad situation. I am sorry if you disagree. If you offer an alternative I would be happy to entertain it.

While I understand this is a very stressful and emotional time for us all, please do not descend into libel.

Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#29 - 2015-08-24 21:01:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Claudia Osyn
Ashterothi wrote:
Claudia Osyn wrote:
Makoto Priano wrote:
You all know my opinion of the madwoman. Please don't feed the troll.

But the way she nibbles the bait is so cute.....


On topic, I'm not sure what you would learn from the body aside from the fact that it was in an explosion then subsequently exposed to the vacuum of space.



If SoCT is interested in her, so am I.

In all reality, we have already seen counterfeit bodies appear. Proper identification of the body is important before we can return it.

Wasn't the SoCT scanning the ship for data? We should be after the wreck of the titan.......... Did anyone think to pop an Entosis link on the thing?

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.

Ashterothi
The Order of Thelemic Ascension
The Invited
#30 - 2015-08-24 21:01:20 UTC
Amalla Galltera wrote:
Whoever has it's corpse should dispose of it immediately, in the most brutal way possible. Preferably by giving it to the Circadian Sleepers to have fun experimenting on the evil *****.



This kind of sentiment is why we feel that securing her remains quickly, verifying the identity, and handing her off to the faithful is our highest priority.
Phyridean
Derp Shipping Co.
#31 - 2015-08-24 21:04:22 UTC
In respect for those Amarr who are worried, I have sent the following message to Chamberlain Haromi:

Quote:
Chamberlain Haromi,

I hope this message finds you as well as possible, during this time of great strife for the Amarr empire and its people.

I wanted to alert you to an initiative started by my organization, Hydrostatic, to raise a monetary reward for the return of the Empress's remains to the Amarr empire. While I very much wish to have the Empress interred as befits her station, I would be lying if I said I didn't hope that whoever retrieved her remains, or her remains themselves, can tell us something about the Drifter threat, which I am sure is also an issue of interest to you.

I would seek your guidance on what the Empire would like done, should we come into possession of those remains.

Yours in Faith,
Phyridean, Producer and Director, Hydrostatic
Amber Falls
Transit Umbra Lux Permanet
#32 - 2015-08-24 22:22:01 UTC
This is horrifying.

Within the span of a single conversation, the discord and confusion over your, supposedly, shared goals has become clear. How can I not interrupt my mourning for this?

The net is tightening as we speak. Do you think our people blind?

Her sacred person will be returned, and no harbour, door, or hull will prevent that.

Makoto Priano
Kirkinen-Arataka Transhuman Zenith Consulting Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#33 - 2015-08-24 22:25:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Makoto Priano
With all due respect, Falls, you're overstating the situation. Some amount of disagreement in acceptable methods should be expected. The desire of the associated parties is not, however, a source of disagreement.

What's more-- net? Tightening? Are you honestly trying to threaten a group seeking to return the Empress's remains to the Empire?

Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries: exploring the edge of the known, advancing the state of the art. Would you like to know more?

Amber Falls
Transit Umbra Lux Permanet
#34 - 2015-08-24 22:35:59 UTC
Makoto Priano wrote:
With all due respect, Falls, you're overstating the situation. Some amount of disagreement in acceptable methods should be expected. The desire of the associated parties is not, however, a source of disagreement.

What's more-- net? Tightening? Are you honestly trying to threaten a group seeking to return the Empress's remains to the Empire?


In something so sacred, no disagreement is acceptable. You would never have dared to dream of attempting such 'scientific' intrusions to her person in life, but now, somehow that's fine to you?

The very thought of trusting your companions fills me with disgust.

The only person who needs to feel threatened right now, Makoto, is the person who thought such sacrilege would go unnoticed.
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#35 - 2015-08-24 22:41:55 UTC
Phyridean wrote:
Goldfinch, with all due respect in return, I am Ni Kunni and have followed the faith throughout my journeys through Caldari and Gallente space. I want to see the Empress's remains treated with respect as much as you do. If we can successfully find the capsuleer who retrieved her body, I would be happy to directly contact the Sarum family to secure their cooperation. I believe that they, like us, will want her identity verified.

A simple scan of her body and a non-invasive retrieval of her capsuleer implant telemetry data could be vital in countering the Drifter threat, which I believe everyone here, and especially those living in the Empire, will agree is in the Cluster's best interest, but I am willing to concede that point if necessary.


Please excuse the question sir, but I was wondering why insisting on doing that yourselves... and not letting the proper interested do it themselves... ?

Is it a question of trust ?
Phyridean
Derp Shipping Co.
#36 - 2015-08-24 22:45:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Phyridean
I suppose it would be preferable for the currently anonymous and likely unaffiliated capsuleer to retain control of her remains? I have not seen the Empire post a reward for Her return, and money may well be the only language the capsuleer in question speaks.

It also seems unwise for the Empire to put forth a massive fleet such as might be required to invade unaffiliated capsuleer territories in null security space in order to retrieve those remains by force at the present time, but I am not well-enough connected with the Imperial Navy to be certain of that.
Phyridean
Derp Shipping Co.
#37 - 2015-08-24 22:49:06 UTC
Lyn, I simply believe that capsuleers are in a better position to negotiate with other capsuleers, as we're quite certain the Empress's remains are currently in empyrean hands. I know many of them might be hesitant to work directly with the Empire or CONCORD, given what happened with Dr. Tukoss.

So we'd like to be a neutral third party in returning the Empress to the Empire. I'm personally also hoping to secure permission for these scans, honestly, because the Drifter threat scares me.
probag Bear
Xiong Offices
#38 - 2015-08-25 00:33:46 UTC
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
You know, however much it'd be fun to have that corpse as a hood ornament on the Serial Peacemaker, and however much I find this obsession with a capsuleer's former meat puppet rather odd, I'll personally throw in a bit of dosh for this venture.

Given that I doubt it'll be of much actual worth, both in terms of scientific and spiritual matters, it won't be much but I'll throw three billion in the pot should Hydrostatic be able to verify that they are indeed being offered the genuine article.

Granted, it's pocket change, but there's too many people being irrationally obsessed with this corpsesicle as it is. Let's hope this'll succeed and people can start moving on to figuring out where the current meat puppet is and what the Empire is doing with it.


Throwing 7bil into the pot to top this off to a nice 10. PM me if this happens, because I'm not on the forums much.
Ashterothi
The Order of Thelemic Ascension
The Invited
#39 - 2015-08-25 00:56:41 UTC
probag Bear wrote:
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
You know, however much it'd be fun to have that corpse as a hood ornament on the Serial Peacemaker, and however much I find this obsession with a capsuleer's former meat puppet rather odd, I'll personally throw in a bit of dosh for this venture.

Given that I doubt it'll be of much actual worth, both in terms of scientific and spiritual matters, it won't be much but I'll throw three billion in the pot should Hydrostatic be able to verify that they are indeed being offered the genuine article.

Granted, it's pocket change, but there's too many people being irrationally obsessed with this corpsesicle as it is. Let's hope this'll succeed and people can start moving on to figuring out where the current meat puppet is and what the Empire is doing with it.


Throwing 7bil into the pot to top this off to a nice 10. PM me if this happens, because I'm not on the forums much.


Just so that everyone is aware, the pot is above 10 billion as it is, but I will add yours to the list of commitments.
Vollhov
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#40 - 2015-08-25 01:13:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Vollhov
Del.
Good luck to all. Cry

End of Time. I'm not fanatic, I'm just a servant by Her Majesty the Empress Jamyl Sarum I. It's time to leave this world to me. YC111 to YC117.12.10 20:00