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EVE Alliance Tournament Discussion

 
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AT XIII the terrible camera man

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Edible Douche
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#1 - 2015-08-23 14:28:34 UTC
Can you tell us why the camera man is so terrible at this AT?
Lanfear Eris
Bulgarian Experienced Crackers
#2 - 2015-08-23 14:34:16 UTC
CCP should make some app so that every person could watch the battle from each possible angle.
Boson Dubstep
Dixon Cox Butte Preservation Society
#3 - 2015-08-23 18:50:21 UTC
They could at least get someone link dirtydan or consta or Joachim Weiss to do stream.
Shivaja
CHON
THE R0NIN
#4 - 2015-08-26 11:51:32 UTC
Ok here are my two cents on this guys. The core of the problem is not necessary in how good or bad the camera guy is but in the number of camera guys, in this case eve is very similar to some RL sports. That require not one, two or three cameras but rather multiple cameras strategically positioned around the location of the event. That is what we need for the tournament to be more attractive for the audience, more camera guys so that the director's booth got more footage to cut to the live stream. Ideal state would be one camera guy for each ship on the battlefield or at least some camera bot that would follow each ship in some predefined pattern, plus 2 or 3 cameras shoot the whole battlefield from different angles and distances.
CCP Darwin
C C P
C C P Alliance
#5 - 2015-08-26 17:12:35 UTC
Since the OP didn't offer that much about what he'd like to see done differently, I can't offer specifics, but I will admit to being one of the two people operating a camera for the AT this year.

The director has three video feeds: A whole-arena overview with the tactical overlay on and two cameras that set ships as focuses that get views of the action. When it goes perfectly, the two ship-focused cameras trade off, each finding a new view of the action while the other is on stream. Also, in an ideal world, the view from the ship-focused cameras would both convey the action of what's going on and a wider view of the spatial relationships between the ships on grid. Of course, since everyone's doing all of this in real time, a match every 20 minutes for seven hours straight in a day, it rarely goes perfectly.

This year, both of us operating cameras for the first CCP weekend were doing so for the first time, so we were learning on the job. Also, this was the first year that we could focus on a ship exploding without having to switch away, since up to the Galatea release, when the camera was focused on a ship that died, the camera would immediately pop back to the cloaked camera ship, rather than showing the explosion. In previous years, camera operators would have to switch to a ship that were near one about to die to watch the explosion, and this may in fact have provided a more pleasing experience.

Anyway, I'm out of town for this weekend, and will be replaced by one of the more experienced previous-year camera operators. If you aren't happy with how things have been going this year and liked the results better in previous years, it may help.

I do suggest that if you liked what you were seeing in previous years more than this year, please be specific about what you liked more before or what bothers you this year. It may well be possible to improve things on the second weekend based on your feedback.

CCP Darwin  •  Senior Software Engineer, Art & Graphics, EVE Online  •  @mark_wilkins
CCP Darwin
C C P
C C P Alliance
#6 - 2015-08-26 23:06:01 UTC
One small additional detail: I personally almost always erred on the side of getting in too far on the ship. The reason is that we often get feedback from EVE-inexperienced viewers who find the AT broadcast on Twitch saying "What's going on here, it's just a bunch of little dots??" Of course, experienced EVE players would much rather see where ships are in relation to each other in space than what the fancy missile effects look like. I feel like I personally got better over the course of the weekend at striking a balance there, but it's very hard to do both.

CCP Darwin  •  Senior Software Engineer, Art & Graphics, EVE Online  •  @mark_wilkins
Max Kolonko
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#7 - 2015-08-27 15:47:26 UTC
CCP Darwin wrote:
One small additional detail: I personally almost always erred on the side of getting in too far on the ship. The reason is that we often get feedback from EVE-inexperienced viewers who find the AT broadcast on Twitch saying "What's going on here, it's just a bunch of little dots??" Of course, experienced EVE players would much rather see where ships are in relation to each other in space than what the fancy missile effects look like. I feel like I personally got better over the course of the weekend at striking a balance there, but it's very hard to do both.


Unfortunetly You are hoping to get more out-of-eve audience when it is eve-specific event. sooo.....

Read and support: Don't mess with OUR WH's What is Your stance on WH stuff?
Davis TetrisKing
The Vendunari
End of Life
#8 - 2015-08-28 00:55:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Davis TetrisKing
CCP Darwin wrote:
One small additional detail: I personally almost always erred on the side of getting in too far on the ship. The reason is that we often get feedback from EVE-inexperienced viewers who find the AT broadcast on Twitch saying "What's going on here, it's just a bunch of little dots??" Of course, experienced EVE players would much rather see where ships are in relation to each other in space than what the fancy missile effects look like. I feel like I personally got better over the course of the weekend at striking a balance there, but it's very hard to do both.


Firstly, thanks heaps for all the work you guys put in broadcasting the tournament. It is awesome to be able to watch live directed and commentated fights in Eve. I HUGELY appreciate the work you guys do running the AT (even if I have to get up at 2am for it).

On the issue of being too close or too far I definitely fall in the category of preferring it being more zoomed out to see the ships positioning. I can understand wanting to show the ships up close too though. Would a reasonable compromise be to occasionally swap between the two? One or two matches I remember fairly long periods where the camera was showing just 1 ship up close.

But in all honesty I think it's a small bit of criticism to what I think is an overall great broadcast. Again thank you to the whole team at CCP (and the guest casters) who are involved in broadcasting the AT.
EVE-Lotteries
EVE-Lotteries Corporation
#9 - 2015-08-28 15:54:51 UTC
Actualy I'm not against "quick" loot at/zoom on ships to help non-EVE players understand what's going on.
But most of the audience is EVE players. And what EVE Player wants is to see the whole things. When we just see a zoomed ship, you can only expect what's going on by look at the health bars...

So if you could try to let us view the whole thing time to time, that could be realy great ^^

Thanks :)

You miss blink ? Come and play with us at EVE-Lotteries.com !
DHB WildCat
Out of Focus
Odin's Call
#10 - 2015-08-28 16:13:35 UTC
So a few questions for the camera guys.

1) Can you see a UI like we can?

2) Do you get fed information about who is tackled and who is taking damage?




If no then yeah nothing you can really do, however if yes......

1) Dont zoom in so much that all you can see is the ship focused on. Unless its pre-match or for a quick second or two to show flagships or uniques that many people may have never seen before.

2) Try to focus on ships that are tackled or taking damage. Use an angle that shows the primaried ship in the foreground with (and its easy this year because of missiles) all the damage incoming to it.

3) Zoom out a little. If an onieros per say, is being tackled by a sentinel or svipul. I want to see the onieros and the tacklers in the same frame. I want to see the neut effects, the orbiting or fail flying by the tacklers.

4) Early in the matches it is super key to not be focused on a ship..... give us the tactical overlay to see the teams positioning. Dont go in close until the fight begins. Nothing I hate more than being zoomed in when nothing is happening and then the fight begins and I have no idea how they got there.

5) Also if you are REALLY good. You can focus on a missile as it leaves the ship and follow it to its target. Or at least you used to be able too. However that takes camera mastery rank 5.



lol, if you can take anything from my ramblings, it would be dont zoom in so much and if you do..... zoom in on a ship that is actively engaged in the fight.
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#11 - 2015-08-29 21:28:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Mr Epeen
People watch the big screen? How odd.

I can't remember ever looking at anything but the bottom third of the screen. That's where the excitement is.

Pretty pictures or information? I'll take the graph every time. And they do that graph just right. I wouldn't change a thing about it.

Mr Epeen Cool
Miss Masquerade
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2015-08-29 22:29:10 UTC
So when is this AT blah blah over with anyway?