Market Discussions

Monthly Report - 01/09/2015

August Breakdown

I was away for half of this month on holiday so data presented may be unrepresentative of my potential profitability.

I had a few hiccups this month after changing my spreadsheets and the way I conducted my trading.
This lead to a few mistakes on sell order prices and resulted in about 900m in losses.

I expect the net profit to be much larger next month.

Trades (Includes Items that haven't sold yet)
-250,816,610,319.87

Trading Profits
12,348,649,561.00

TAX (Includes broker fees for Items that haven't sold yet)
-4,309,202,013.34

Hauler Costs (Includes the costs for items that haven't sold yet and items currently in transit)
-3,340,037,018.00

Interest Paid (Estimate)
-954,378,134.00


Net Profit 1.49%
3,745,032,395.66

I use a mix of EVEHQ, eve Mogul and evernus.

I then use the relevant information to get a rough outcome for the month.

:)

II

Yes, it says 'Contract Reward Deposited' when you are looking through expenditures.

II

Is this still open to new accounts?

Deposited isk but accidently sent to Illegal Clone 001 - can you transfer and open the account?

Thanks!

Just a quick post to let everyone know that I'm changing how you view your account. I'm going to be publishing it as a webpage and not sharing the documents anymore.

You'll be able to open this ingame and view it just as you were able to before.

Hmmmm,

Illegal you need to be careful of making to many changes at once, particularly to current/existing products.

At this point I am of the opinion that I have a interest-bearing account that pays out x% per day. Not shares that pay out a dividend thus I am at this stage not happy to go ahead with another change.

Anyway in relation to the proposed change
You need to show us a real example as in

July profit = x isk
invested funds = y isk
dividend payable per z isk = p

makes it a lot easier to see the impact of the change.

Some questions;

1. How often do you plan to calculate the profit/loss?
2. What happens when a loss occurs (you wear it, investors wear it)?
3. When can investors request withdrawals.

To summarise this idea almost requires a new thread.

The example illustrates the concept.

However, I would like to see a list of active accounts showing amount invested. This would give each investor/depositor an idea of where we stand regarding their individual amount invested and total invested. This can be blind with no listing of depositor names by the amount invested.

Showing this with an estimate of actual earnings would allow us to evaluate the return based on the amount invested.

ok, after much discussion and number crunching we're going to see how September does in regards to profit.


The numbers all suggest that the Hedge fund setup would pay more to investors than the current bank setup so once September is done we're going to test this again with a full months data and then make some decisions.


II

1.) Now that would mean that investors do not only have to trust your integrity, but also your skills and abilities to re-invest the ISK in game.
However, I think its an interesting concept. The only thing that I would really want is a fixed amount of shares that are being initially issued at a fixed price, but are freely tradeable (preferably via the in-game system, that would also make paying out dividends easier. It can be done with a separate corp to prevent it from being abused).
That would keep the spirit of the free market alive since, based on your performance and the current capital of illegal investments, theses shares will be traded at free market prices.

So say you have 50b of capital yourself (Net-Worth of Illegal investments - liabilities). Say you think you can easily trade with up to 200b. You then go ahead and issue ... say 200,000 shares @1mil each and you keep 50,000 of then (that represents your own capital). You then sell 150,000 shares here for 150b. These should come with at least partial voting rights regarding important stuff (like re-issuing shares, adding another business branch etc. but also voting right in regards to dividends paid).
How say after 1 months Illegal investments is worth 250b, a 25% increase. Each share would now represent 1,25mil. If theres a dividend, lets say, 1%, then everyone gets 12,500 ISK per share but each share would now only represent 1,237,500 ISK.

However, since the shares are freely tradeable this doesnt have to be the price on the market. The market price would be affected by supply and demand, trust in the II (Illegal Investments) leadership, but also past and potential future dividends and price increases.
Because of that, people would talk about it, especially here in MD, maybe opensing WTB/WTS order threads etc. This in term would give II a lot of publicity, which leads to 2.)

2.) This share thing can be used IN ADDITION to the current interest-bearing account. While the shares represent a part of II and are a sure thing in regards to capitalization (II doesn't have to buy them back, it can plan ahead with the capital a lot better), they also represent a long-term liability to II. If not all capital can be invested due to whatever reason, this might be running at a loss.
The interest-bearing accounts can be used to quickly gain capitalization (ppl depositing) and to quickly get rid of liabilities (paying then out) at a predetermined rate. This might proof to be a very important part of II especially when diving into new branches.
This would also show that II really thought about what amount it can profitably invest and what is too much. The amount that can be profitably invested can be gained through the sale of shares and everything that comes up later can be covered by these interest-bearing accounts.
That doesn't exclude re-issuing some shares if shareholders agree.

3.) Whats in it for II?
With the current model, it's pretty obvious. Investors get a certain amount per day depending on their investment and II gets to keep all the money in excess.
With a share model, that wouldn't apply anymore. Others would get the same dividend and value appreciation per share as II itself, but with less effort than II.
Thats where this comes in:



Depending on what "taking a cut" is, I think thats a very good idea. Now the important thing is that, if a share represents a certain percentage of II, then not paying out all profit is not "taking a cut". It's still a value appreciation for the investor. 5% dividend and 3% value appreciation (through a net-asset increase in II) is still a 8%profit. Same for 1% dividend and 7% value appreciation. Not paying out too much is important in order to scale (and in order to maybe buy back some interest-bearing account liabilities).

"Taking a cut" would be an either flat payout to the guy running II (to his personal Account), or a percentage based on the profit made that month, or, what I think is best, a combination of both. A flat payout that has to be agreed upon by all shareholders, plus a percentage of the profit (also to be agreed upon).
That would add motivation, since a good months earns more, but it would also provide a sure income each month (even if II operates at a loss that month for whatever reason).
He he wanted, he would then buy II-shares on the free market with that payout :D


Just my 2 ISK. You asked for opinions :)