Crime & Punishment

I know, that's why I still try discussing these thing :). As for my general views of ganking, this guy said it perfectly so I'll just link his post.

Any chance you'd care to make a list of all the groups you've known and list what's toxic about each one? No? It's ok, you posted it on an internet forum so it must be true.



Of course it would. If you're drowning in the middle of the ocean you'll grab at any chance to live. People always want to see bad things happen to the successful, no matter how small.

This must have happened a long time ago? When I joined the chanel as a known ganker there was some disscusion about ganking with folks there, I got banned (for being a ganker), convoed Jennifer and promised I'd not gank while in AG :) and got back. I've yet to see someone being kicked for suggesting using webs (while talking in a civilised manner, usually not the type of manner used by your alts), providing fits, talk about ganking the gankers (done that, got only credit for it in channel) etc.


If someone has made RL threats, why don't you just petition him. We don't need such folks in eve.
I'm gonna guess you're loyalannon's alt? Why are you not posting on main?

Antagonize? This whole game is based on conflict. CCP has engineered the game so that we a forced to fight, antagonize and harm each other. Blowing up a miner or hauler is intended behaviour - the whole point of Eve is to antagonize each other in this way. The New Order has made botters and bot-aspirants their enemy so of course they are going to antagonize them.

That is what we are suppose to do - fight each other.
The CODE. Alliance are gankers and everything I posted applies to them as well. Perhaps they have added the extortion element and are more ideologically motivated than other highsec pirates, but they are playing the game within the rules. You are simply demonizing these players because you don't like them. You are telling other players they are "griefers" and trolls who exploit game mechanics rather than just other players, not much different than anyone else, who are playing as space villains as CCP intended to game to be played. That is not healthy for the game.

You can hate the Code and its villains - that is sort of the point of CCP enabling criminals to operate in highsec - but when your major narrative is how bad as real people they are, you are stoking the stream of bad behaviour that ends up too often on minerbumping. Gankers are suppose to exist. Even the Code as emergent gameplay is suppose to exist. Players need to be made aware of this and not told they are just victims of "griefers" like is the standard response in AG, but that this is how the game is suppose to work and taught how to avoid them. Vilifying a subset of other players and tolerating threats and personal insults against them is what is toxic.

But I will take one of your points which is that this anti-AG discussion is off-topic. We probably should get back the usual 'Grr... Code" posts about now.

I find it funny. I don't see why you would not laugh really, unless you took the game so seriously that an Orca loss actually meant anything significant. I mean, it's not a 10 billion isk ship is it?

So he only lost an Orca, wow, no big loss eh? But still, an Orca is serious business so kick him out. This doesn't really make sense!

It was a guess, not an accusation, guess based on you saying that you are an alliance director and mentioning of RL threats (something loyal likes to do). Guess I was wrong.

I liked those bits the best! But as for the spin on the other stuff I did not find it that credible if I am honest, especially since the other reasons were not really discussed in any great amount of detail.

So he didn't do well in the wars? He had a few kills before the Orca loss in that same hub. Checking his killboard out before those indicates he was inactive for some months before joining CODE. Maybe he was a bit rusty?

Also the guy was barely in the corp long enough to make a real impression apart from the Orca loss. Is this really surprising stuff though? If this is a big deal too then good luck recruiting new players to PvP in the future is all I can say, if there are such great expectations upon new recruits to perform well, and quickly.

But maybe there was some other major reason I missed?

Shame, shame, shame. xD

You were certainly not banned because of that. On which toon was that and when? There is no entry for "admiral root" in the blocklist of the channel, there never was. Your former alliance SMA was banned from the channel - as were many other CFC alliances - for mass-invading and mass-trolling it in the early days of the channel. When your corp dropped out of SMA, your corp was banned as you had many gankers in your ranks. You specifically have never been personally banned.


That was certainly not the reason why they were banned. Feel free to mail me character names so I can look up why they were really banned. I should still have most of the channel logs back to when it was started (at least during my online hours).

If he did it in the channel and a mod had seen it, he'd have at least received a warning from us or depending on what and how he said it, an immediate ban. If he said it elsewhere, write a ticket and let CCP handle it. As far as I can tell, nobody contacted us about this.

See above. I made a lengthy reply to your boss on Gorila's blog about a year ago about this. Its still online here: It's still online here. You know how often we have been contacted about "RL death threats" by any of you? Not once.

In fact we advise channel members to stay far away from RL comparisons or references of any kind.

It's also worth noting that your original ban list was nuked when the New Order staged a coup and temporarily took control of the anti-ganking channel, so I'm not surprised that there's currently no entry for this toon.

On a related note, the number of RL death threats and the general level of hate speech was far lower for those few hours. Coincidence? I think not.