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Should High sec go away?
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Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#281 - 2015-08-16 23:13:15 UTC
Gotta say, I don't think "viable fit" when I hear "polarized guns and no mid slots".

That absolutely does not count as "relatively easy".

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#282 - 2015-08-16 23:20:02 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Gotta say, I don't think "viable fit" when I hear "polarized guns and no mid slots".

That absolutely does not count as "relatively easy".

…nor is it a PvE fit using T1-weapons.
Leonardo Adami
Doomheim
#283 - 2015-08-16 23:55:15 UTC
High sec must go, make all of New Eden low/null. Perhaps keep a small newbie area for characters 30days and younger. And by small I mean 3-10 systems.
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#284 - 2015-08-17 00:06:49 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Gotta say, I don't think "viable fit" when I hear "polarized guns and no mid slots".

That absolutely does not count as "relatively easy".

…nor is it a PvE fit using T1-weapons.



I was under the impression you were asking him for a 1000dps T1 cruiser gank fit.

If that wasn't the case, my apologies

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#285 - 2015-08-17 00:14:32 UTC
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
I was under the impression you were asking him for a 1000dps T1 cruiser gank fit.

If that wasn't the case, my apologies

Nah, it all started with the claim along the lines of “gank dessies do about the same damage as a newbie-fit PvE cruiser”, in response to a claim that they did BS-level damage, which spawned the counter-claim that such a cruiser would also do BS-level (1k+) damage.

Also, even if it were for ganking, one of the design goals of polarized weapons is that they aren't really viable in ganking due to the drawbacks and costs. If that thing was used anywhere near sentry guns, for instance, it would almost insta-pop and would have to rely on alpha damage — not a strong suit for blasters, even in their polarized form. Blink
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#286 - 2015-08-17 01:10:10 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
I was under the impression you were asking him for a 1000dps T1 cruiser gank fit.

If that wasn't the case, my apologies

Nah, it all started with the claim along the lines of “gank dessies do about the same damage as a newbie-fit PvE cruiser”, in response to a claim that they did BS-level damage, which spawned the counter-claim that such a cruiser would also do BS-level (1k+) damage.

Also, even if it were for ganking, one of the design goals of polarized weapons is that they aren't really viable in ganking due to the drawbacks and costs. If that thing was used anywhere near sentry guns, for instance, it would almost insta-pop and would have to rely on alpha damage — not a strong suit for blasters, even in their polarized form. Blink



Ah I see. I didn't follow the quote chain far enough back.

Yeah, I didn't say it was a good fit, just was saying it hit 1000dps with ease.

I disagree with his premise that ganking is "easier", it isn't, there are more tools available now than before but the mechanics were necessarily made harder in the same time. So somewhat easier, somewhat harder.

But anyways, no idea where this thread is going anymore, so I am going to bow out. See ya in the next one Tipp

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#287 - 2015-08-17 01:30:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Tippia wrote:
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
I was under the impression you were asking him for a 1000dps T1 cruiser gank fit.

If that wasn't the case, my apologies

Nah, it all started with the claim along the lines of “gank dessies do about the same damage as a newbie-fit PvE cruiser”, in response to a claim that they did BS-level damage, which spawned the counter-claim that such a cruiser would also do BS-level (1k+) damage.

Also, even if it were for ganking, one of the design goals of polarized weapons is that they aren't really viable in ganking due to the drawbacks and costs. If that thing was used anywhere near sentry guns, for instance, it would almost insta-pop and would have to rely on alpha damage — not a strong suit for blasters, even in their polarized form. Blink
The PvE cruiser fit in question by the way, used regularly to run anoms and escalations; I never said newbie-fit or especially cheap though.

[Vexor] 600 (unheated and paper) DPS with my alts skills, CN antimatter and the Gecko+2x Hammers

Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Medium Armor Repairer II
Rat Specific Hardener II

Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Script
Omnidirectional Tracking Link I, Tracking Speed Script
Drone Navigation Computer I
10MN Afterburner II / 50MN Microwarpdrive II

200mm 'Scout' Accelerator Cannon
200mm 'Scout' Accelerator Cannon
200mm 'Scout' Accelerator Cannon
200mm 'Scout' Accelerator Cannon

Medium Anti-Explosive Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I

Hobgoblin II x4
Hammerhead II x2
Gecko x1
Hobgoblin II x1
Hammerhead II x3

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#288 - 2015-08-17 01:33:53 UTC
Christ man, the Gecko costs more than twice as much as the rest of the fit combined. ;)
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#289 - 2015-08-17 01:41:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Christ man, the Gecko costs more than twice as much as the rest of the fit combined. ;)

I bought a shedload of them when they were new, I've made my money back a couple of times over and still have around 20 left.

The Gecko only comes out if I'm taking down BC and BS NPCs, the Hobs are often more than enough for everything else. It certainly plays to Vexors strengths though, it noms on NPCs like nobody's business when that bad boy is let loose.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#290 - 2015-08-17 01:41:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Kinete Jenius
Tippia wrote:
*irrelevant nonsense*.


[Vigilant, DPS]
Damage Control II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Tracking Enhancer II

Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Tracking Computer II

Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M

Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I

Hammerhead II x5


IT's a variation of a shield based fit for Vanguards. It's a t1 cruiser and it does +1000 dps without heat and with NO implants.



So since I answered your question how about you answer one of mine?

When was the time period where you were able to buy platinum insurance that would then pay out enough to cover the cost of the insurance, BS hull, and modules?

I really would like to know as the only thing I remember is the hull and part of the modules being covered. I know if ganking had been completely free through insurance that we would of ganked every day all day as isk was the only limiter for us.
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#291 - 2015-08-17 01:49:30 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Christ man, the Gecko costs more than twice as much as the rest of the fit combined. ;)

I bought a shedload of them when they were new, I've made my money back a couple of times over and still have around 20 left.

The Gecko only comes out if I'm taking down BC and BS NPCs, the Hobs are often more than enough for everything else.

Good man. Wish I'd have had the foresight to get in on those things when they were like 12-15m each.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#292 - 2015-08-17 02:10:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Kinete Jenius wrote:
[Vigilant, DPS]

So not actually a T1-weapon T1 cruiser, then. It also seems to have a six-slot tank, rather than the promised one.

Quote:
When was the time period where you were able to buy platinum insurance that would then pay out enough to cover the cost of the insurance, BS hull, and modules?
Roughly between Quantum Rise and Tyrannis, but with the trend starting at the release of Revelations and really taking off around the release of Dominion.
Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#293 - 2015-08-17 02:14:50 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Kinete Jenius wrote:
[Vigilant, DPS]

So not actually a T1-weapon T1 cruiser, then. It also seems to have a six-slot tank, rather than the promised one.

Quote:
When was the time period where you were able to buy platinum insurance that would then pay out enough to cover the cost of the insurance, BS hull, and modules?
Roughly between Quantum Rise and Tyrannis, but with the trend starting at the release of Revelations.

So your response is to move the goal posts. So when you're proven wrong you just keep come back changing the parameters of the discussion or distorting what was stated. I really figured that you could at least be intellectually honest about this one thing...


That is a wide spread of time that included the time when I was ganking on my original characters. I was not getting my insurance, hull and modules covered by insurance then.

Specific dates would be more helpful. As something like that would be severely broken and exploited heavily quickly.
Painkill3r
Perkone
Caldari State
#294 - 2015-08-17 02:18:56 UTC
Kinete Jenius wrote:
As something like that would be severely broken and exploited heavily quickly.


Yes, it was profitable and widely exploited.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#295 - 2015-08-17 02:24:38 UTC
Kinete Jenius wrote:
So your response is to move the goal posts.
You're confusing me with you.
It was a T1 cruiser with T1 weapons from the very start, you know… hence why I suggested that you should look up the price limitation that you had missed. Maybe now you understand why your claim was dismissed as ridiculous?

Quote:
That is a wide spread of time that included the time when I was ganking on my original characters. I was not getting my insurance, hull and modules covered by insurance then.
Yes you were, unless you were overpaying for your ships.

Quote:
Specific dates would be more helpful. As something like that would be severely broken and exploited heavily quickly.
It was. First hit on google was this, before the mineral prices had dropped even further — at that point, the profit was in an empty ship. Tyrannis put an end to it by making insurance based on market prices rather than mineral basket rarity.
Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#296 - 2015-08-17 02:27:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Kinete Jenius
Tippia wrote:
Kinete Jenius wrote:
So your response is to move the goal posts.
You're confusing me with you.
It was a T1 cruiser with T1 weapons from the very start, you know… hence why I suggested that you should look up the price limitation that you had missed. Maybe now you understand why your claim was dismissed as ridiculous?
It was t1 cruiser with no mention of anything else module or implants.

[Vigilant, DPS copy 1]
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Imperial Navy Medium Armor Repairer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer

[empty med slot]
[empty med slot]
[empty med slot]
[empty med slot]

Federation Navy Heavy Neutron Blaster, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
Federation Navy Heavy Neutron Blaster, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
Federation Navy Heavy Neutron Blaster, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
Federation Navy Heavy Neutron Blaster, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
Federation Navy Heavy Neutron Blaster, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M

Medium Hybrid Collision Accelerator I

'Augmented' Hammerhead x5


Here toss some implants and that's +1000 dps without heat all t1 with one tank module. Can do 2s easily and could do most 3s if you actually used the mid slots for a prop mod and stuff.


EDIT : Hell the example provided by the person that made the original t1 cruiser comment has... t2 modules...
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#297 - 2015-08-17 02:30:48 UTC
Kinete Jenius wrote:
t was t1 cruiser with no mention of anything else module or implants.
…other than the T1 weapons.

So …
Quote:
[Vigilant, DPS copy 1]
Federation Navy Heavy Neutron Blaster, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
…disqualified on two counts.
Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#298 - 2015-08-17 02:33:48 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Kinete Jenius wrote:
t was t1 cruiser with no mention of anything else module or implants.
…other than the T1 weapons.

So …
Quote:
[Vigilant, DPS copy 1]
Federation Navy Heavy Neutron Blaster, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
…disqualified on two counts.

Thanks for confirming that you have no interest in a real conversation on this subject. Your only intent is to play stupid long enough to get me to give up.
Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#299 - 2015-08-17 02:36:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Kinete Jenius
Painkill3r wrote:
Kinete Jenius wrote:
As something like that would be severely broken and exploited heavily quickly.


Yes, it was profitable and widely exploited.

Yeah but that post is an empty hull without rigs or modules. I already said I recalled the empty hull being covered and some of my modules.

I don't recall that fraud being allowed to last for long. Especially after people started posting on the subject.

So that means for a brief moment in the history of eve ganking was cheaper thanks to CCP. Now ganking is free thanks to CODE's supporters.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#300 - 2015-08-17 02:41:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Kinete Jenius wrote:
Thanks for confirming that you have no interest in a real conversation on this subject. Your only intent is to play stupid long enough to get me to give up.

No. My intent now is for you to deliver what you promised or, more likely, just admit you were vastly inflating this as well.

Fyi, Meta-8 is not T1 — we'll just add that one to the list of things you're not familiar with.

Quote:
So that means for a brief moment in the history of eve ganking was cheaper thanks to CCP. Now ganking is free thanks to CODE's supporters.
It's still not free — it's being paid for. We've been through this.