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Collective petition about fozziesov

First post First post First post
Author
Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#141 - 2015-08-01 22:28:18 UTC
Silvia Heart wrote:


So my alliance should hold one constellation and carebear the **** out of it until we die of bordem?

We aren't going to get more fights that way, it promotes PVE to an extreme extent.

This change is toxic to eve, we get no fights, we get no fun and we spend stupid amounts of time orbiting a structure because one guy can spent 10min of his time to waste almost 2 hours of our time and we have to turn up to every single one because some moron thought it would be great to make it stay that way forever because defenders should turn up and waste massive amounts of time, even if the "attacker" (rolls eyes) has no intention of turning up because why? Because **** anyone trying to hold more then 1 system per 100 players?

Come down here and try holding sov you piece of **** and see how you like watching the guys you play the game with get less and less active and probably quit the game given enough time, all because some moron in CCP had a "good idea".

We didn't like dominion sov, but we ******* hate this coward carebear piece of **** that replaced it.

Use your space, and only have a three hour window of vulnerability where attackers have to entosis for almost an hour, or run around putting out sov fires for 18 hours a day while an attacker can just take ten minutes to F*** your s*** up, your choice.

It seems to me that you have gone with THIS third option.

"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka 

Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#142 - 2015-08-01 22:48:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Steve Ronuken
Falin Whalen wrote:
Silvia Heart wrote:


So my alliance should hold one constellation and carebear the **** out of it until we die of bordem?

We aren't going to get more fights that way, it promotes PVE to an extreme extent.

This change is toxic to eve, we get no fights, we get no fun and we spend stupid amounts of time orbiting a structure because one guy can spent 10min of his time to waste almost 2 hours of our time and we have to turn up to every single one because some moron thought it would be great to make it stay that way forever because defenders should turn up and waste massive amounts of time, even if the "attacker" (rolls eyes) has no intention of turning up because why? Because **** anyone trying to hold more then 1 system per 100 players?

Come down here and try holding sov you piece of **** and see how you like watching the guys you play the game with get less and less active and probably quit the game given enough time, all because some moron in CCP had a "good idea".

We didn't like dominion sov, but we ******* hate this coward carebear piece of **** that replaced it.

Use your space, and only have a three hour window of vulnerability where attackers have to entosis for almost an hour, or run around putting out sov fires for 18 hours a day while an attacker can just take ten minutes to F*** your s*** up, your choice.

It seems to me that you have gone with THIS third option.


Then there's the recruitment option. Where you recruit people to handle the carebearing for you, leaving you to defend your space, and attack other space.


(The system's not perfect. It needs work. but some of the complaints I'm seeing are a touch inane)

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter

Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#143 - 2015-08-01 22:52:24 UTC
Primary This Rifter wrote:
I don't care if you halve capital ship DPS and tank, give them a damn role already.



Caps aren't in the world best position right now. I don't think anyone is disagreeing there.

Exactly what role they should have, that's the interesting question. If you have any thoughts, I'd certainly like to hear them Smile

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter

Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#144 - 2015-08-01 23:04:27 UTC
Steve Ronuken wrote:

Then there's the recruitment option. Where you recruit people to handle the carebearing for you, leaving you to defend your space, and attack other space.

SHH! Don't tell them, I want them crying because they have to crab to get the indexes up. TwistedTwisted delicious tears.

Steve Ronuken wrote:
(The system's not perfect. It needs work. but some of the complaints I'm seeing are a touch inane)

Truth!

"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka 

Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#145 - 2015-08-01 23:10:27 UTC
Borascus wrote:

Are targets going to be belt-ratting in unoccupied systems? At least there is something to engage in sov, and the owning alliance gets a mail to say 'turn up for fight'.

If the launcher explains that there are 20-40k players online any given time, and picturing that people log in / out every minute, it makes more sense for people online for more than an hour to own more systems than 1:100players, so they can co-ordinate fights.

Log-in, sit in system, wait for ratter. On the other side of the coin is 'log-in, wait to defend'. This is the reason interceptor entosis is not enjoyable, there is no fight, it's literally 'turn up here to see an interceptor'. The aggressing alliance should already have enough sov for their 1:100 pilot ratio, 14k pilots gives 140 systems? 828 empty systems? What about hi-sec/low-sec/wh players?

Null-sec sov holders want to own more sov than they can manage to have an abundance of possible fights.

600bil isk is 50 years of subscription if you aren't losing ships. Last I saw CCP had an e-mail address for plex purchases over 300.

Your issue here is that you are equating sov with fights.
The two are only tangentially related, not a direct correlation.

Try doing other things to get fights.
Also, who cares if there are empty systems? That's systems you then don't have to waste time with if you are searching for a large scale fight against another null alliance. Just go direct to their active systems with a Battleship fleet, wait for them to escalate, then drop your own cyno's. Hey presto, massive fight.
Or just jump a titan in with said BS fleet, and watch the server go crazy.

If you want a big cap fight, look at the actual reasons big cap fights have happened. Nothing to do with nibbling away at unimportant sov and troll roams. Those happened under the old sov mechanics as well, cloaky roams almost never escalated to titan fights. It was form ups over critical hub systems, or a tackled titan (who may have pressed jump not bridge) that made the big fights. So use those reasons, not sov for the sake of sov.
Marech Bhayanaka
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#146 - 2015-08-01 23:28:56 UTC
Ransu Asanari wrote:
Entosis is designed to influence the type of ships brought to contest nodes as little as possible. There may be some extreme cases that need to be dealt with, but there are viable counters you can bring to most of these situations. A 12km/s Vagabond orbiting the beacon at 250km? Park a T1 frigate with a T1 Entosis module on the beacon and pause their progress. Or hunt down their links ship and kill it instead. Right now a 1M ISK Griffin can jam out that ship and force them to go through the warmup cycle again; or a Maulus can damp down the Vagabond to lose its lock at that range, and force it to come in closer.


This. If you are spending hours repairing the damage done when you didn't bother to defend your system in the first place then you have yourself to blame.

Marech.
Morgan A'doulende
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#147 - 2015-08-01 23:29:44 UTC
That's rich. The alliance I'm in rents from Tri and they seem to be ok with hassle free income from us renters.
Lucius Kalari
Mass Collapse
It Must Be Jelly Cause Jam Don't Shake
#148 - 2015-08-01 23:37:09 UTC
If people aren't liking fozziesov, I heard that wormhole space has plenty of unoccupied systems for people to take Big smile
Icycle
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#149 - 2015-08-01 23:51:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Icycle
I disagree with the limitations suggested on entosing.
Based on my observations is the majority of this large alliances althought they are very powerfull they all have the same issue.
The issue is vast amount of unused space. Every second system its empty. As a result large amount of jumps have to be perfomed. This is specially true in the Drone region, CFC space and Catch. The drone region been the worst where only 3 out of 10 systems are actually in use. I think its time they adjust the amount of sov systems the occupy from the ones they dont really occupy. If you drop those unused space you dont have to defend it. Why keep sov if you dont use it?

We see this all the time with the CFC. We got people coming from all the corners of the globe for a 20 man fleet and they show up in 80+ minimum. They even bring supers and carriers. The amount of jumps they are doing is too much and all because they want to keep vast amount of empty space which they clearly are having difficulty defending. Drop sov systems and get your numbers into the core system. If you look at the systems that are been attacked, the vast majority are insignificant systems cos no one lives in them aka empty.

I believe the worst idea is to give zero m/s speed to entosis ships. Why would anybody bother entosing if all you have to do is jump a titan and snipe it. After all CFC has tried to do this many times already.

I can tell you this with all sincerity. We have been waiting for this changes forever. Now that they are here we are trully enjoying it. We finally can actually herass a larger entity and pick a fight when we want and disapear into the jungle when we dont want to fight them. I think now gorilla warfare has a great future in eve at the momment. We have forced the CFC to reevalute their possition and hire lots of renters to keep the indexes of their systems up. This is what a 1000 man alliance has been able to archive vs a 50k coalition of alliances.

I only ask CCP to look at the sov systems and see how many are actually have presence or used effectively. The truth is right there! You are keeping systems you can not defend and expanded way too much and therefore you spend most of the night jumping way too much.
Marech Bhayanaka
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#150 - 2015-08-02 00:01:51 UTC
TiMeZeRo225 wrote:

CCP has to understand 1 simple thing - people come to 0.0 for blob warfare, so the only thing they have to change is to create something worthy to fight for.

You need to understand that people in all parts of space are there for a variety of reasons. I live in null, have never been part of a blob, and am happy about that.

Marech.
Whisperen
This is Serious Mum
The Initiative.
#151 - 2015-08-02 00:02:02 UTC
Those are not problems they are features.
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#152 - 2015-08-02 00:22:52 UTC

Games should be fun, not a love hate relationship. If games stop being fun they become something we try to get detached from and relax: REALITY. Reality with the daily mundane grind and eventual cubicle romance decorated with post-it sentimental reminders to buy toilet paper on the way back home.
And so it goes Eve online seems more and more like a failing marriage. A lot of effort put into it but... ya know. Yeah I know Eve is real but... ya know.
Alt tabbing to play another game while playing a game is... ya know... adultery. CCP better not ask what other people are playing while alt tabbing, might find out they're being cheated with Farmville... ya know...

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#153 - 2015-08-02 00:29:49 UTC
Icycle wrote:
I disagree with the limitations suggested on entosing.
Based on my observations is the majority of this large alliances althought they are very powerfull they all have the same issue.
The issue is vast amount of unused space. Every second system its empty. As a result large amount of jumps have to be perfomed. This is specially true in the Drone region, CFC space and Catch. The drone region been the worst where only 3 out of 10 systems are actually in use. I think its time they adjust the amount of sov systems the occupy from the ones they dont really occupy. If you drop those unused space you dont have to defend it. Why keep sov if you dont use it?

We see this all the time with the CFC. We got people coming from all the corners of the globe for a 20 man fleet and they show up in 80+ minimum. They even bring supers and carriers. The amount of jumps they are doing is too much and all because they want to keep vast amount of empty space which they clearly are having difficulty defending. Drop sov systems and get your numbers into the core system. If you look at the systems that are been attacked, the vast majority are insignificant systems cos no one lives in them aka empty.

I believe the worst idea is to give zero m/s speed to entosis ships. Why would anybody bother entosing if all you have to do is jump a titan and snipe it. After all CFC has tried to do this many times already.

I can tell you this with all sincerity. We have been waiting for this changes forever. Now that they are here we are trully enjoying it. We finally can actually herass a larger entity and pick a fight when we want and disapear into the jungle when we dont want to fight them. I think now gorilla warfare has a great future in eve at the momment. We have forced the CFC to reevalute their possition and hire lots of renters to keep the indexes of their systems up. This is what a 1000 man alliance has been able to archive vs a 50k coalition of alliances.

I only ask CCP to look at the sov systems and see how many are actually have presence or used effectively. The truth is right there! You are keeping systems you can not defend and expanded way too much and therefore you spend most of the night jumping way too much.


The "CFC" actually has one of the highest player per system densities in sov null.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Icycle
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#154 - 2015-08-02 00:42:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Icycle
Malcanis wrote:
Icycle wrote:
I disagree with the limitations suggested on entosing.
Based on my observations is the majority of this large alliances althought they are very powerfull they all have the same issue.
The issue is vast amount of unused space. Every second system its empty. As a result large amount of jumps have to be perfomed. This is specially true in the Drone region, CFC space and Catch. The drone region been the worst where only 3 out of 10 systems are actually in use. I think its time they adjust the amount of sov systems the occupy from the ones they dont really occupy. If you drop those unused space you dont have to defend it. Why keep sov if you dont use it?

We see this all the time with the CFC. We got people coming from all the corners of the globe for a 20 man fleet and they show up in 80+ minimum. They even bring supers and carriers. The amount of jumps they are doing is too much and all because they want to keep vast amount of empty space which they clearly are having difficulty defending. Drop sov systems and get your numbers into the core system. If you look at the systems that are been attacked, the vast majority are insignificant systems cos no one lives in them aka empty.

I believe the worst idea is to give zero m/s speed to entosis ships. Why would anybody bother entosing if all you have to do is jump a titan and snipe it. After all CFC has tried to do this many times already.

I can tell you this with all sincerity. We have been waiting for this changes forever. Now that they are here we are trully enjoying it. We finally can actually herass a larger entity and pick a fight when we want and disapear into the jungle when we dont want to fight them. I think now gorilla warfare has a great future in eve at the momment. We have forced the CFC to reevalute their possition and hire lots of renters to keep the indexes of their systems up. This is what a 1000 man alliance has been able to archive vs a 50k coalition of alliances.

I only ask CCP to look at the sov systems and see how many are actually have presence or used effectively. The truth is right there! You are keeping systems you can not defend and expanded way too much and therefore you spend most of the night jumping way too much.


The "CFC" actually has one of the highest player per system densities in sov null.


I beg to differ. Go into pure blind and see. You will be hard pressed to find many CFC's. Fade , Tribute has also alot of systems as well as space around Venal. A lot of unused systems or has very little people in system. The only real region that get alot of use is Deklein and Branch. Also its in the ratting statistics! Which also prove my point. I know where I live after all I kill in it every day and do several roams.
Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#155 - 2015-08-02 03:01:17 UTC
Icycle wrote:
Malcanis wrote:

The "CFC" actually has one of the highest player per system densities in sov null.


I beg to differ. Go into pure blind and see. You will be hard pressed to find many CFC's. Fade , Tribute has also alot of systems as well as space around Venal. A lot of unused systems or has very little people in system. The only real region that get alot of use is Deklein and Branch. Also its in the ratting statistics! Which also prove my point. I know where I live after all I kill in it every day and do several roams.

Before the Aegis expansion, Pure Blind was really not good space. Most of what we have of Pure Blind has really bad truesec, none of the "good" anomalies would spawn even if we ratted it up to level 5, and even then Pure Blind was not "ours" to rat in. Then six days before Aegis hits BAM! Fozzie drops that on us. Suddenly all that cruddy space no one really wanted, or could use unless it had a money moon or jump bridge, had a lot less suck attached to it. Hell, people are going to be able to actually make some money in them running the anomalies, not as great as with "good" truesec systems, but decent ISK none the less. That last minute change caught us off guard, and a few of us are trying to rectify that. Talk to a Goonswarm rental agent today. (Certain terms and conditions apply.)

"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka 

Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#156 - 2015-08-02 05:56:13 UTC
Icycle wrote:


I beg to differ. Go into pure blind and see. You will be hard pressed to find many CFC's. Fade , Tribute has also alot of systems as well as space around Venal. A lot of unused systems or has very little people in system. The only real region that get alot of use is Deklein and Branch. Also its in the ratting statistics! Which also prove my point. I know where I live after all I kill in it every day and do several roams.


I too can cherry pick data points....

Let me see,

Goonswarm: 13954/103 = 135.5 pilots/system
FCON: 4896/80 = 61.2 pilots/system
Co2: 2857/34 = 84 pilots/system
Get Off My Lawn: = 2121/53 = 40 pilots/system
EXE: 1221/14 = 87 pilots/system

Compare this too Legion of Death, Shadow of Death, Brothers of Tangra and we see vastly smaller numbers as in the teens or even single digits for Shadow of Death.

Does this mean that each and every system in Deklein will have 135.5 pilots in it? No, it's an average. Some will have more, some less. Keeping in mind that not all of them will be logged in at once either.

So now we know why some alliances are struggling with Fozziesov. I'd say working as intended (note: I'm not saying it is good or bad here, but if the intent was to free up unused systems...well, sounds like it is going to happen one way or the other....). If you insist on remaining as an "elite and exclusive alliance" and also insist on holding a large number of systems....you are going to be very busy going forward in game.

This information was presented earlier too. Roll

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#157 - 2015-08-02 07:42:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Maldiro Selkurk
PROBLEM: nullsec got all buddy-buddy, made non-aggression pacts and wouldnt fight except one staged fight per year to ensure that CCP was nullsecs b**ch, since CCP needed that one fight for advertising purposes.

SOLUTION: introduce new game mechanics so that smaller groups that are not part of the buddy-buddy system can stir up nullsec and get them to actually defend their holdings.

We can check this one off and look at nullsecs thread which should have been titled, "pout, stomp our feet and cry like a two year old", as proof of effectiveness.

PROBLEM: nullsec apparently cannot combat low skill pilots.

SOLUTION: everyone that has every been ganked by a nullsec 3 week old pilot laughs their collective asses off and decries nullsecs attitude on the subject as seriously hypocritical.

PROBLEM: Nullsec that has long held that CCP shouldnt be holding players hands suddenly wants theirs held.

SOLUTION: stand agape at the criminal levels of hypocrisy nullsec is showing on the issue, and of course laugh our asses off some more.

PROBLEM: seeming exploit allows entosing attacker to move the defense window.

SOLUTION: hotfix the issue because unlike the rest of this pout-fest this is actually a real problem that needs addressing.

PROBLEM: nullsec doesnt like being annoyed, while spending more than a decade doing this to the rest of EVE.

SOLUTION: I have to use the word hypocrisy yet again, seriously, WTF ???

PROBLEM: nullsec is so accustomed to sitting on their collective asses they cant be bothered to go collect intel on an agressor.

SOLUTION: DO NOTHING but at the same time wonder out loud why the f*** were game mecahnics in place that would allow these lazy asses to hold SOV for so long when it has become abundantly clear that they dont deserve their holdings ?

PROBLEM: Alliances want to work together in close knit cooperative groups again like the, 'Good Ol Days".

SOLUTION: Repeat oft used nullsec mantra frequently heard when highsec didnt want some change put into the game, adapt and HTFU !

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#158 - 2015-08-02 07:50:56 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
"A BLOO BLOO MY RENTAL INCOME!"



*snicker*

*snort*

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#159 - 2015-08-02 08:43:16 UTC
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Primary This Rifter wrote:
I don't care if you halve capital ship DPS and tank, give them a damn role already.



Caps aren't in the world best position right now. I don't think anyone is disagreeing there.

Exactly what role they should have, that's the interesting question. If you have any thoughts, I'd certainly like to hear them Smile




Death Star is a good start for a role.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#160 - 2015-08-02 08:54:59 UTC
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
PROBLEM: Alliances want to work together in close knit cooperative groups again like the, 'Good Ol Days".

SOLUTION: Repeat oft used nullsec mantra frequently heard when highsec didnt want some change put into the game, adapt and HTFU !

No, working together in close knit cooperative groups is the solution.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?