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Collective petition about fozziesov

First post First post First post
Author
Mostlyharmlesss
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#41 - 2015-07-31 22:48:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Mostlyharmlesss
Welcome to 2 months ago, when the rest of null sec realized how bad all these points that you bring up are.

Follow me on Twitter for the latest regarding GoonSwarm Federation and our recruitment drives!

Syndic Thrass
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#42 - 2015-07-31 22:49:30 UTC
I agree with rusrus

Reguards, Iskies-mommies-toonies-corpies-goonies 0707 m8m8m8

Syndic Thrass
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#43 - 2015-07-31 22:50:54 UTC
Also one stupid mechanic that should be fixed is the ability to buzz out of entosis range and make your link cut off so you can warp away. Much like cloaks show the secondary timer that runs back counter-clockwise to note your recloaking timer, entosis links should have the same thing, although this would be fixed by adding a speed penalty which is exactly what should be done.

Reguards, Iskies-mommies-toonies-corpies-goonies 0707 m8m8m8

Zihao
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#44 - 2015-07-31 22:51:19 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
"A BLOO BLOO MY RENTAL INCOME!"
Buhhdust Princess
Mind Games.
Suddenly Spaceships.
#45 - 2015-07-31 23:03:37 UTC
Slight alteration:

Make entosis link reduce speed to under 100m/s for ALL ships.

Make ships available to be repaired by logistics ships, or other means.

You will pull more people in to grid, and provoke more fighting!

As attackers of xxdeath's space, I will say that we have done a lot to just harass them, and its worked nicely, but it has been too easy.
-Signed
Johan Civire
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#46 - 2015-07-31 23:12:55 UTC
Redwyne Vyruk wrote:
I, as BOT manager and XWX manager, completely agree on this thread and i hope CCP will hear our voice.


You think CCP will listen? Think again. The have already change to game to iphone mode. That interface. Please do not let me started with the rest...
Dradis Aulmais
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2015-07-31 23:13:43 UTC
1 5 and 7 maybe some tweaks but over all I support fozzie sov

Not signed

Dradis Aulmais, Federal Attorney Number 54896

Free The Scope Three

Tappits
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#48 - 2015-07-31 23:16:49 UTC
Eli Stan wrote:
UAxDEATH wrote:
Alliances signed petition



I'd like to propose some questions to the above alliances:

What type of systems have you been defending? How many pilots are typically active in them, what do they do in those systems, and how far do they have to travel in order to mount a defense? Why do you want to retain those systems?

What type of systems have you been attacking? What made you want to have Sov in those systems?

Your goal should be preventing anything from being reinforced in the first place. If you cannot do that, you do not effectively hold Sov of that system and you deserve to lose it, or get burned out trying to win the capture events. You should stop fighting over those systems you can't hold on to. Getting burned out is your punishment for trying to operate in the Dominion Sov paradigm.

Interceptors are perfectly suited for effecting Aegis Sov - because the only Sov they can challenge for is unoccupied Sov, and unoccupied Sov isn't sovereignty at all. If you want to hold on to a system but can't be bothered to have pilots in it during its vulnerability window, you don't deserve to hold Sov there.

In NPC null, chasing off a lone Interceptor is incredibly easy. We simply undock. They never stay within 25km, the range of a T1 Entosis. If a hostile Interceptor is Entosing your Outpost, undock. Blap them if they stick around, enjoy the view of the stars for a little bit if fly off and ruin their Entosis cycle. If they're after a TCU or I-hub, simply warp a Navy Vex or Caracal or whatever to it. If this happens in an empty system four jumps away from anybody, you shouldn't have Sov there and it's your own fault you're burning yourself out. You need to adapt. That burnout is Aegis Sov working as intended.

And if that Interceptor is bait for a 100-pilot T3 gang on the other side of a wormhole - there's your large fleet fight you're looking for.

I do agree that there should be a sort of passive regen of defense index, so that simply going after hostile ships without bothering with your own Entosis ships is a valid defense tactic. That way defenders can put all their pilots into mobile offensive ships if they so desire. This passive regen should not happen if there is even a single node being Entosed by an attacker, so that it does not extend the time of an active attack effort.


Yep...
We are still cleaning up after domi sov… thousands of unused systems all over eve that had sov the day fozisov kicked in that needs purging of sov as there’s no other way of doing it now.
People are trying to defend these unused systems for some random resign..
There are no real wars going on. No one is actively trying to take over some one else’s space so they can live there. All that’s going on at the moment is a clean-up of dead systems and trolling to try and make people fight.

Tappits
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#49 - 2015-07-31 23:20:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Tappits
Fafer wrote:

and its been on Duality, where some of the people mentioned won the sov competition


We won by dropping titans on everyone making 70% of the people doing it quit in the 1st week and then NAPing the other 30%
we took 95% of the systems totally uncontested. so i would hardly call it a real test of the sov.... we did fix loads of problems tho so you all should be happy about that.

Not one single alliance in this game has any really proof of anything other than wield speculation on what might happen, as not one single active alliance has done anything of note with the new system to come up with any sort of evidence showing anything… when a few alliances have had a few wars and real fights over systems then maybe we can start coming up with what the problems are… the only problems any one knows about so far is everyone hates 4k/s+ entotsis Interceptors and it’s a point in the ass to do the nodes in systems you don’t even live in. that’s it that’s all any one really knows as that’s as far as any one has really got with the system… no one has tried to actively take anything people use from any one yet.

UAxDEATH wrote:
Solution: reduction of beacons (nodes) , to about 1-3 per system, which are located next to a contested structure.


The whole point of the changes was to stop someone dropping 1000 people into one system or in to very few grids and try to fight. The point was to make every one split up hence nodes all over and you needing 10 of them to win so you cannot just sit 500 people on one grid and 500 on another and win.
Just having 1-3 nodes that you have to get is just going back to slowcat fleet on node 1 all supers sat on node 2 and all your blues sat on node 3 and never having to move or do anything
Yes having 10 nodes you have to defend is hard if you live 10jumps away but it’s not hard if you live in the constellation and were able to stop them RFing your stuff in your own prime time before it even gets to the nodes. Most of the time even if they do entosis your stuff there is no real rush to do the nodes if the attackers don’t come back.. you can just continue using the systems and slowly do a few nodes per hour on alts.

Also CCP don’t like the big fights as it kills there servers
tekmin
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#50 - 2015-07-31 23:51:56 UTC
UAxDEATH wrote:
Introduction


Problem: structure that exits reinforce timer, doesn’t regenerate back, which in the old game mechanics served as a defensive mechanism against sov trolling. Attacked systems spam node beacons, which can last forever, which is discrimination against sovereignty owners - they must defend their space despite the fact that no one will show up to contest it.
Solution: a new type of status - defended. If the nodes are not being captured by any attackers during contested campaign for a period of time dependent of defence index, then structures change from contested to defended.




see bold.

no1 shows up to defend but you want to keep it?

if no1 shows up to defend it means you dont want it bad enough...
Tappits
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#51 - 2015-07-31 23:56:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Tappits
tekmin wrote:
UAxDEATH wrote:
Introduction


Problem: structure that exits reinforce timer, doesn’t regenerate back, which in the old game mechanics served as a defensive mechanism against sov trolling. Attacked systems spam node beacons, which can last forever, which is discrimination against sovereignty owners - they must defend their space despite the fact that no one will show up to contest it.
Solution: a new type of status - defended. If the nodes are not being captured by any attackers during contested campaign for a period of time dependent of defence index, then structures change from contested to defended.




see bold.

no1 shows up to defend but you want to keep it?

if no1 shows up to defend it means you dont want it bad enough...


And if a whole alliance cannot muster up 5 alts in there semi prime time to afk 2 nodes each at 12mins per node (i.e 24mins per afk alt) they don't deserve sov.

If you drop the nodes down to 3 or something dumb your all going to be screeming when us and NC dot drop out super fleets on 2 of them and then you loose anyway. at-least with 10 you have a bit of a chance of defending.

You could also make entosis mods only fit on BS's but then you will cry when people drop carriers or dreads on them...

All that's going to happen by making pretty big changes at this point is when a real big coalition war comes along you will all be crying that nothing has changed and they the system is crap.
Kalen Pavle
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#52 - 2015-08-01 00:06:27 UTC
The fundamental problem of fozziesov is as follows:

It's not fun. It's not fun to attack a 1x system. It's not fun to attack a 6x system. It's not fun to defend any system.

This is a game. It should be fun. Instead I spend my time doing sov related stuff playing other games. Do you really want a game where the primary nullsec experience is alt-tabbing and playing another game?
Tappits
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#53 - 2015-08-01 00:20:40 UTC
Kalen Pavle wrote:
The fundamental problem of fozziesov is as follows:

It's not fun. It's not fun to attack a 1x system. It's not fun to attack a 6x system. It's not fun to defend any system.

This is a game. It should be fun. Instead I spend my time doing sov related stuff playing other games. Do you really want a game where the primary nullsec experience is alt-tabbing and playing another game?


that will not happen if you stop attacking empty space.

even a 6x system is now quicker to take than in domi sov... its just your trying to use domi sov tactics and ships to do it.
xxLATVIANxx
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#54 - 2015-08-01 00:26:05 UTC
I was looking forward to fozzie sov, but last 2 weeks been most boring in 7 years playing eve.
Kalen Pavle
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#55 - 2015-08-01 00:27:05 UTC
Tappits wrote:
Kalen Pavle wrote:
The fundamental problem of fozziesov is as follows:

It's not fun. It's not fun to attack a 1x system. It's not fun to attack a 6x system. It's not fun to defend any system.

This is a game. It should be fun. Instead I spend my time doing sov related stuff playing other games. Do you really want a game where the primary nullsec experience is alt-tabbing and playing another game?


that will not happen if you stop attacking empty space.

even a 6x system is now quicker to take than in domi sov... its just your trying to use domi sov tactics and ships to do it.


Except we're not. Orbiting nodes on alts is not fun. Orbiting them on mains is less fun. It's only quicker when you consider the additional timer. Actual time commitments are immensely longer than in dominion sov.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#56 - 2015-08-01 00:28:06 UTC
Kalen Pavle wrote:
The fundamental problem of fozziesov is as follows:

It's not fun. It's not fun to attack a 1x system. It's not fun to attack a 6x system. It's not fun to defend any system.

This is a game. It should be fun. Instead I spend my time doing sov related stuff playing other games. Do you really want a game where the primary nullsec experience is alt-tabbing and playing another game?


Isn't that what it already was?

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Kalen Pavle
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#57 - 2015-08-01 00:44:52 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Kalen Pavle wrote:
The fundamental problem of fozziesov is as follows:

It's not fun. It's not fun to attack a 1x system. It's not fun to attack a 6x system. It's not fun to defend any system.

This is a game. It should be fun. Instead I spend my time doing sov related stuff playing other games. Do you really want a game where the primary nullsec experience is alt-tabbing and playing another game?


Isn't that what it already was?


Previously through judicious use of capital ships you could reduce the boredom to mere minutes. Now the boredom is a predetermined amount of orbiting nodes playing world of warships.
Tappits
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#58 - 2015-08-01 00:47:43 UTC
Kalen Pavle wrote:

Except we're not. Orbiting nodes on alts is not fun. Orbiting them on mains is less fun. It's only quicker when you consider the additional timer. Actual time commitments are immensely longer than in dominion sov.


I would ask how many systems are you taking to live in? tri has 1400 people in 22 corps. so how much space do you need?
if you are taking more than you need i would have to ask why?
the whole sov system is designed to make it a bit easier to carve out your own home.. but much much harder to take and hold more than you need so why are you trying to take more than you could possibly need even if you were 2x the size?
Kalen Pavle
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#59 - 2015-08-01 00:52:19 UTC
Tappits wrote:
Kalen Pavle wrote:

Except we're not. Orbiting nodes on alts is not fun. Orbiting them on mains is less fun. It's only quicker when you consider the additional timer. Actual time commitments are immensely longer than in dominion sov.


I would ask how many systems are you taking to live in? tri has 1400 people in 22 corps. so how much space do you need?
if you are taking more than you need i would have to ask why?
the whole sov system is designed to make it a bit easier to carve out your own home.. but much much harder to take and hold more than you need so why are you trying to take more than you could possibly need even if you were 2x the size?


It's not about the sovereignty, or holding the sov, it's about getting people to fight. As it is now, the most effective way to get your opponent to go away is not to fight them, it's to force them to afk on nodes with alts while the rest of the fleet says '**** this, i'm going back to [insert staging system here].'

Defense now is about stationary objects in space, which don't shoot back, which use boredom as their primary tool of dissuading the enemy from engaging.
Nituspar
Shiva
Northern Coalition.
#60 - 2015-08-01 00:53:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Nituspar
As an FC that's currently abusing all of these mechanics to our advantage, I fully agree with the need for all these changes and points that Uaxdeath brings up.

Being able to set entire regions on fire and making defenders have to deal with thousands of nodes due to 20-50 trollceptors sent from several regions away, without any intention or commitment to taking the sov we're attacking, is horrible gameplay for everyone involved. It just happens to be 5-10 times more horrible for the defender than it is for the attacker.

The system is currently extremely broken, and the current consensus between a lot of groups seems to be that the best way to deal with Fozziesov in its current state is to not care about it at all.