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Share your experiences with Fozziesov!

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Author
Xan Auditore
Doomheim
#801 - 2015-08-18 11:45:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Xan Auditore
MoA has now successfully captured 3 systems from the imps. Last night we successfully defended one system from goon invaders.

The Mittiani's article : https://www.themittani.com/news/new-sov-collected-feedback states explicitly that pvp in the fozzie sov is limited mostly to interceptors. This is an outright lie.

We have had more kills in the last couple weeks than we've ever had. A few days ago our alliance reached #2 on zKillboard. Look at our killboard! It is a lot more than just interceptors both wins and losses.

The fact is with the new system the goon tactic of "blue balling" just doesn't work. For the first time in a long time they are being forced to undock and defend their systems and too much H1Z1 has made them rusty. This is why they are the loudest to cry about it.

For the goons this is a crisis.

Personally I think Fozzie Sov has been a huge success in generating content.
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#802 - 2015-08-18 12:15:20 UTC
Falin Whalen wrote:
"You can have sov, or you can have fun" -Fozzie 2015

Wasn't that a misquote by some karma-w**ring redditor?
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#803 - 2015-08-18 12:17:16 UTC  |  Edited by: afkalt
Barrogh Habalu wrote:
Falin Whalen wrote:
"You can have sov, or you can have fun" -Fozzie 2015

Wasn't that a misquote by some karma-w**ring redditor?



Yes.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/3guqam/csm10_people_of_reddit_you_are_being_lied_to_endie/


Quote:

[snip]

Let me deal with the first thing first. Someone malicious or stupid claimed that Fozzie said You can have sov or you can have fun. One of my fellow Goons, notorious shitposter Kcolor, promptly posted this to Reddit in search of easy upvotes. This naturally caused an uproar and whoever sells pitchforks and torches at the base of Castle CCP made an absolute killing. And quite right, too: how much disdain this shows for the playerbase! Something must be done! Who will pay for this outrage?!?
Except that this never happened. My hunt for this shocking expression of disdain led me to listen to the whole two hours for a second time. Not only does Fozzie not say this, but he doesnt say anything that sounds a bit like it. Not once.

[/snip]
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#804 - 2015-08-18 12:49:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
Xan Auditore wrote:
MoA has now successfully captured 3 systems from the imps. Last night we successfully defended one system from goon invaders.
You know you won't actually keep those systems, right? All you've done is come in while systems are being transferred between TnT and Goons and swiped a couple of systems when they were vulnerable. You don't seriously think you have a hope of holding them when the Imperium actually come to take them, right? There's a reason you live in NPC space and don't hold and utilize sov. Most of that is down to what you laughably call your leadership and the fact that your alliance requires donations to survive.

Xan Auditore wrote:
The fact is with the new system the goon tactic of "blue balling" just doesn't work.
Of course it does. The actual mechanics to change system ownership have changed, but battle mechanics haven't. If anything it's now easier to blueball, since it requires less ships to threaten sov, whereas before you had to make it look like you were going to send a fleet. The only reason bluebllaing is happening less is that nobody can be bothered to have a serious fight over sov now that the mechanics suck even more than structure shooting.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Harry Saq
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#805 - 2015-08-18 13:17:34 UTC
Seth Kanan wrote:
What i have seen so far the only thing trolling are some big coalitions on the forums and on reddit. The interceptors are no problem at all and easily manageable. From my experience the sovspace is changing a lot in a good way and fighting for sov got thousand times more interesting.

This ^^, particularly in this thread...hate to sound like a broken record, but the point is to think smaller...
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5963555#post5963555
Xan Auditore
Doomheim
#806 - 2015-08-18 13:46:54 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Xan Auditore wrote:
MoA has now successfully captured 3 systems from the imps. Last night we successfully defended one system from goon invaders.
You know you won't actually keep those systems, right? All you've done is come in while systems are being transferred between TnT and Goons and swiped a couple of systems when they were vulnerable. You don't seriously think you have a hope of holding them when the Imperium actually come to take them, right? There's a reason you live in NPC space and don't hold and utilize sov. Most of that is down to what you laughably call your leadership and the fact that your alliance requires donations to survive.


Ha ha, tell that to the goon fleet we slaughtered when they arrived to finish their "transfer".

Yes we do get donations, and recruits too, all thanks to the wonderful reputation you goons have made for yourselves. Eve is like a small town. Do you really think you can get away with the crap you do? I know it might work for you guys in real life... (i.e. the eve monument) ... but there are people in game willing to do whatever is needed to watch your self proclaimed "imperium" wither away and die like so much space dust. Is there anyone more fun to shoot than a goon? I doubt it.

So now we have fozzie sov, which gives power to alliances that are active as opposed to just wealthy, large, and vastly inactive.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#807 - 2015-08-18 14:13:04 UTC
Xan Auditore wrote:
Ha ha, tell that to the goon fleet we slaughtered when they arrived to finish their "transfer".
I very much doubt it was a "fleet". Tell me this. do you honestly expect to hold that sov for a significant length of time? It's a simple question.

Xan Auditore wrote:
Yes we do get donations, and recruits too, all thanks to the wonderful reputation you goons have made for yourselves. Eve is like a small town. Do you really think you can get away with the crap you do? I know it might work for you guys in real life... (i.e. the eve monument) ... but there are people in game willing to do whatever is needed to watch your self proclaimed "imperium" wither away and die like so much space dust. Is there anyone more fun to shoot than a goon? I doubt it.
Lol, and what exactly is that "crap" we do? You mean playing a video game for entertainment? I know you have this idea that we're some evil dudes hell bent on wrecking eve, but that's just you sucking up propaganda. Most of the changes that have been damaging to us we have actively pushed for, including these sov changes. We're here to have fun in a game which some of you seem to take as seriously as a career. If you're plan is to make that "wither away", you might want to give that up before you waste your life like your boss does.

As for the monument, that was a couple of idiots, not the entire group. Are you saying if some douche you don't even know in MOA decides to go out mugging people then we should just label you all as muggers?

The problem is these sov changes don't actually make it harder to hold space for groups like ours and are dull to play with from all sides. You like it right now because you still believe gen eve and gevlon when they tell you that you're destroying the "ebil goons", but eventually you'll realise that you're making less of an impact now than you did before the changes.

Xan Auditore wrote:
So now we have fozzie sov, which gives power to alliances that are active as opposed to just wealthy, large, and vastly inactive.
What about groups like us, wealthy, large and vastly active?

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Sonya Corvinus
Grant Village
#808 - 2015-08-18 14:34:43 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Of course we can, that's why we're not losing our systems. Defending is easy, it's boring, but it's easy. And every alliance has systems they don't constantly inhabit, they're called pipe systems and they generally suck.


Asking yet another time.

How many systems do you have with less than five active daily PvP pilots?

Salvos Rhoska
#809 - 2015-08-18 14:47:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Salvos Rhoska
Lucas Kell wrote:
Xan Auditore wrote:
So now we have fozzie sov, which gives power to alliances that are active as opposed to just wealthy, large, and vastly inactive.
What about groups like us, wealthy, large and vastly active?

The rest of your post is granted.

Yes, no coherent exstant force in the EVE universe can defend against a full "Imperium" retaliation.
Yes, the changes are merely an inconvenience, and dont threaten the "Imperium" at all.

Hence, lack of "gudfights", cos no one else can compare or compete.

But I think this segment above of your post hit upon the truth.

EVE development, as a sandbox, allowed for but never really considered the possibility of such a coherent, organised and structured force.. There was precedenct before in terms of BoB, but that was disassembled ultimately from within, not without.
EVE systems did not develop congruently fast enough to allow for competition.

Since then, this has immunized the community to any such revolutionary AWOX ever happening again, as well as forcing null mechanics into a stalemate between such a hegemony, its antagonists and CCPs direction for the game.

You've won the null sandbox.
You are its king, and responsible for the bread and circus of its populace.

Any and all good improvements will, de facto, hurt you more than anyone else
There is no way around that.

The key argument of "when will a coalition organise and rise up to us" is a misdirection and fallacy.
All change from CCP and all action from player base, happens now in respect of and relation to your hegemony.

CCP will not upset yout status quo.
Player potential is impaired by your successful programs to assimilate aggressor players as renters and F1 monkeys.
Well done. This deserves due credit.

But.

You are your own worst enemy.
Your success is your own defeat.
This is a fitting crown, and all the more bitter for it.

I think you, I, and everyone else, acknowledges the futility of aggressing the "Imperium".

Barring one caveat, which is revolutionary change by CCP.
But that wont happen, because you hold them firmly economically by the balls in terms of subs/PLEX, alongside enormous whining and threatening to leave the game.

Sov, and NS by extension, is a foregone situation.
No real competition will ever arise, nor will CCP be able to make significant changes when even the paltry extant model of a single trollceptor results in 20%+ aggregate whine in a feedback thread, even though they are not even realistically infringing or capturing your space. This is before considering the unthinkable and unparalleled force you COULD bring down on any aggressing entity.

Youd have done better remaining silent, and letting CCP and antagonists make their case without gishing it.
You did yourself a huge diservice, because you refuted so vociferously even such a pittance of a change, as to make the expected result from a more serious change unthinkable from a community reaction perspective, and a CCP popularity of change concern.

Its your sandbox now.
You did this.
You block even the most superficial changes.

Enjoy your null empire, for what its worth.
But do not fault CCP or the rest of us for lack of change.
That is entirely on your own recognisance, for having so aggressively, and with gravitas, argueing even against such a simple change, equal to basically a few annoying mosqiutos biting an elephants bum,(and as you aknoweldge) insignificant and inoffensive change.

You were so angry about this small, insignificant change.
How about then anticipation of reaction to far more revolutionary changes?
You overplayed your position, with too much anger, to your own detriment.
Youve shown yourself as an angry, incompatible and uncompromising entity.

CCP, imo, should leave you to your NS sandbox, and instead focus on WH/LS space or perhaps even new sectors.
Instead focusing on providing other alternative content to EVE and its (and your) players, whilst you in your sandbox, fall apart to your own hubris and self-entitlement.

PS: Also, your function amounts to that of a talking head and a spin doctor. Deliberate and persitant disruption of any and all concerns against your overlords is your job, while they themselves remain silent and distant from dispute here. Everyone knows this about you and a few other posters. The general moratorium on discussion here by un-delegated Imperium members is also readily apparent (as is your strategy and awareness along these sides, as demonstrated over undue concern of a "forum CTA" that never materialized and was in all perspectives less detrimental to discussion than your own involvement). Frankly, you are terrible at your job and have only made matters worse for yourself and the powers you represent. Id fire you immediately and place you under specific non-posting restrictions, though allowing you alongside to train and inform your successor on the forum environment.
Xan Auditore
Doomheim
#810 - 2015-08-18 16:08:24 UTC
Well said. I disagree that there is nothing that can be done about the imperium however. I don't believe that they've "won eve". There are plenty of cases where small groups of rebels have overthrown larger entities. Case in point: Star Wars or The American Revolution.

There is an Eve without evil overlords, burn jitas, code, etc. I will keep fighting for that Eve. Freedom is not free and independence is a luxury. Plus shooting goons is fun.

Fozzie sov or not, the imperium will fall.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#811 - 2015-08-18 16:13:58 UTC
Sonya Corvinus wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Of course we can, that's why we're not losing our systems. Defending is easy, it's boring, but it's easy. And every alliance has systems they don't constantly inhabit, they're called pipe systems and they generally suck.
Asking yet another time.

How many systems do you have with less than five active daily PvP pilots?
First off: Ask CCP. We don't have stats like that.

Secondly, why do only PvP characters count? Using a system includes PVE.

Finally, it's irrelevant, since we're not losing systems so we obviously have enough people to defend the ones we have. You claim we can't defend them yet we obviously can otherwise we'd be hemorrhaging systems left and right.

It amuses me that you keep asking that as if you've somehow caught me out. Like the reason the mechanics are boring is because we may have pipe systems with few people in them and not because CCP made using mining lasers for structures the way to take sov.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#812 - 2015-08-18 16:20:43 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Finally, it's irrelevant, since we're not losing systems so we obviously have enough people to defend the ones we have. You claim we can't defend them yet we obviously can otherwise we'd be hemorrhaging systems left and right.

Not true, you can use a standing fleet to chase trollceptors from system to system and then complain that Aegis sov is too much hard work...

...or you can have active members in each system using your space.

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager

Seven Koskanaiken
Fancypants Inc
Pandemic Horde
#813 - 2015-08-18 16:37:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Seven Koskanaiken
For the TCU, just get rid of nodes. No one is gonna have a 4000 man dogpile over a TCU, get real. Probably for the ihub as well. Reduce nodes on station timer to like, 3-5.
Sonya Corvinus
Grant Village
#814 - 2015-08-18 16:38:57 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
First off: Ask CCP. We don't have stats like that.

Secondly, why do only PvP characters count? Using a system includes PVE.

Finally, it's irrelevant, since we're not losing systems so we obviously have enough people to defend the ones we have. You claim we can't defend them yet we obviously can otherwise we'd be hemorrhaging systems left and right.

It amuses me that you keep asking that as if you've somehow caught me out. Like the reason the mechanics are boring is because we may have pipe systems with few people in them and not because CCP made using mining lasers for structures the way to take sov.


You don't know how many pilots you have in your own alliance? wow.

Given how much you have whined about it being too hard to defend your space, you obviously don't have enough people, or have too many systems.

Again, fozziesov working as intended. Your posts here are proof of that.
Seth Kanan
Exotic Dancers Union
SONS of BANE
#815 - 2015-08-18 16:41:06 UTC
So far we got a lot of good fights with the new mechanics and there are more to come. It's sad to see that some represantitves of the big coalitions are seeding so many lies. That is poor. The new mechanics are great. CCPs move towards this gameplay is visionary.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#816 - 2015-08-18 16:41:41 UTC
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Any and all good improvements will, de facto, hurt you more than anyone else
There is no way around that.
I'm in total agreement. We will and should be hurt more that others by changes to null. That said, changes should still keep in mind that:
- Sov is an alliance level and not an individual level activity
- Bringing more bros should continue to have it's benefits, and people shouldn't be punished for working together
- Above all else the mechanics should be enjoyable to interact with

Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Barring one caveat, which is revolutionary change by CCP.
But that wont happen, because you hold them firmly economically by the balls in terms of subs/PLEX, alongside enormous whining and threatening to leave the game.
In other words, they want to keep the bulk of their playerbase happy, as well they should. Don't forget we've pushed for changes ourselves that have hurt us, it's not like we sit there exploding with rage every time we take a kicking. There's been so much feedback about this one simply because the mechanics aren't fun to use and to be quite honest, while it's made people feel like they have a hope in hell of taking sov, it's only further entrenched the large null groups.

Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Also, your function amounts to that of a talking head and a spin doctor. Deliberate and persitant disruption of any and all concerns against your overlords is your job, while they themselves remain silent and distant from dispute here. Everyone knows this about you and a few other posters.
"Everyone knows" should be "Some idiots think". Those people would be wrong. Whether you'd care to believe it or not my opinions have and always will be my own, even when it's got me into trouble with diplos and threatened my membership of my alliance.

All your shitposting aside, you don't even disagree with our points of view yourself (not that the opinions of a 2 year old NPC player mean much), you've made that abundantly clear. And whether you accept it or not, from the various feedback sources it's been made clear that the general views of this change are that it needs some serious balancing to even be considered working and either way is boring to interact with. The only people in support of this mechanic as it is are "grr goons" types who think they will use it to take over null (and even some of those have since realised how bad it is).

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#817 - 2015-08-18 16:44:58 UTC
Eli Apol wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Finally, it's irrelevant, since we're not losing systems so we obviously have enough people to defend the ones we have. You claim we can't defend them yet we obviously can otherwise we'd be hemorrhaging systems left and right.

Not true, you can use a standing fleet to chase trollceptors from system to system and then complain that Aegis sov is too much hard work...

...or you can have active members in each system using your space.
Either way, someone has to make time to chase nullified, evasion fit, disposable ships out of the system every time they pop up. It's not "too much hard work", I've not once stated that it is, it's actually EASIER to defend than dominion sov, it's just insanely boring.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#818 - 2015-08-18 16:51:08 UTC
Sonya Corvinus wrote:
You don't know how many pilots you have in your own alliance? wow.
I don't know how many active pilots live in each give system my alliance holds. You weren't asking how many people are in my alliance.

Sonya Corvinus wrote:
Given how much you have whined about it being too hard to defend your space, you obviously don't have enough people, or have too many systems.
I take it by this you mean "zero" since that's exactly how many times I've claimed it's "too hard". If we had too many systems, we would be unable to defend them and they would be taken by our enemies. Since they haven't, that's conclusive evidence that we have enough people to defend our space. We have 4267 members and 41 systems, so an average of 104 characters per system. Sounds fairly reasonable.

Sonya Corvinus wrote:
Again, fozziesov working as intended. Your posts here are proof of that.
LOL, "an imperium member dislikes it, therefore it is good". I don't like drinking bleach either mate just FYI. Fozziesov intended for the system to be entertaining for both sides, it failed. What's more telling is that CCP have practically admitted this is the case. I'll be shocked if most of the suggestions I've put forward (and are listed on my blog) aren't implemented before too long.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#819 - 2015-08-18 16:57:12 UTC
Seth Kanan wrote:
So far we got a lot of good fights with the new mechanics and there are more to come. It's sad to see that some represantitves of the big coalitions are seeding so many lies. That is poor. The new mechanics are great. CCPs move towards this gameplay is visionary.
Nullsec has an approximate 11% decrease in kills between this month and last month, and a 16% decrease on June. Compared to last year this August is 11% down there too. Consider that there will also be no more big capital fights that end up in international non-gaming news sites, and it's hard to see how this is a good thing. I'm Imperium though so obviously I'm lying just to keep on making all that isk that I make trading in highsec.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Sonya Corvinus
Grant Village
#820 - 2015-08-18 17:54:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Sonya Corvinus
Lucas Kell wrote:

stuff


active PvP pilots / # of systems would do. How many xed up for the last strat op?

If it wasn't too hard (ie, already had PvP pilots in a system that is being lasered, you wouldn't be complaining in this thread. That's kinda the point.

It's my opinion that sov null is the safest and easiest way to earn ISK in the game ATM, so anything that moves us in the direction of nudging alliances to shrink is a positive. The only challenging places left to live are LS and WHs. Anything that tries to make HS or null more difficult is a positive.

You would have fights in current sov if you un-blue a few people. That's kinda the point.

You obviously disagree. Let's see how many times we can go in circles in this thread!