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People fight because fighting is fun. And the ones who don't fight just for fun will fight because some other guy is hanging around in their space and they want to kick them out. Most of the people who are in null are there because they want pvp -- if they really wanted nothing but pve why not stay in empire. Many supposed "nullbears" are actually weekend warriors.


Totaling up all the members of the alliances listed on dotlan holding at least 1 system equals 143,811 characters. Obviously that's a lot more than players or even active players. But the top 50 sov-holding alliances outnumber the members of the top 50 everyone-else alliances by almost exactly 2 to 1. The evidence says lots of people live in null.

But what's your point? The reason for increased density in nullsec isn't just to allow more people to live there in total. Even if not a single new person moves to null after this change, it's still a good thing. Increased density makes nullsec more interesting even if it means people clump up and more systems are completely empty. Clumps means you have targets on the map, and clumps mean ratters can switch to defenders easily.

While they have teased agents in null (not NPC) stations it does present some issues. The main thing would be it requires a complete refactoring of LP rewards and ISK payouts for the missions themselves. Not a horrible task but not trivial either.

there is also a bunch of technical debt that prevents them from easily adding new mission agents, iirc it is a 100% manual process and with outposts being droppable by anyone at any time i don't think they wanna pay an intern to sit and F5 dotlan to put in agents in every new outpost

I would rather see a mix. What we have today and adding agents. Perhaps a limit per region or const.

Gimme Guristas agents in VFK thanks.

Why do I get the feeling you have no idea how exploration looks like? How those new upgrades will work? How high will be the spawning bonus? They double it, but what is the base stat? What will happen if corp spawn all of them at max level all around one constellation? For example in Omist? Do they suck up all sites from region? What is the max spawn bonus?

If corp will suck up to a bubbled constellation it will be binary situation. Null corp will win here. I don't want to be in-game content to some sov null corp, I won't stand a chance with prepared players (they have ships in place i have to jump +30 systems to go there).
You are focused at: "they hold sov, they should get the rewards". Exploration are not growing potatos or planting apples. It about finding the sites actively not growing them.


You are ignorat when it comes to the value of the loot. More sites spawned above the regional pool means the more loot is injected into the market. Which means they will be worth less. It will be like right after odyssey. You want that?


I will survive, there are plenty of space to explore for me, lot's of ways to earn money. I hope you are not some dev or csm alt, no hope then.


Point is how many players we can expect to be there.


Easiest thing: security agents in null. Unlimited players in system.

I'm kinda dissapointed with CCP proposals. I was hoping for agents in null. It would be mirroring hisec for pve content. Either there are some obstacles in the game code or devs lack imagination. Now they will waste resources on ESS...

Such defeatism.

They're not that prepared, they want to rat.

Yes, as I said several times before the nullsec alliance wins here. That is why CCP Fozzie released these devblog as part of sweeping changes to nullsec to make it more vibrant, active and fun. Part of that is making players want to live there and this is a reward to make players want to live in null.

Let me show you the man behind the curtain: all PvE, and I mean all, is in the game so you make yourself "in-game content" in your words. PvE rewards are the carrot that induces you to expose yourself to other players as a target. Exploration is no different. It is not there to allow you to earn ISK at no risk to yourself. It is there so you decide to make yourself "content" for other players in exchange for a reward. That is the social compact of Eve: you get a reward if you make yourself a target.

As an aside, this is why the current state of highsec incursions is so insidious - it is all reward with no player-driven risk (or any risk at all really), and thus provides only marginal content to the game. They should be nerfed/changed/eliminated immediately just like ISboxing was for the greater good.

But back to exploration, you stand a chance against them - embrace your inner ninja. If you don't want that risk, there are plenty of exploration sites in NPC null, low and wormholes which will provide you with an income. Don't let your selfishness make the game as a whole worse - we have enough of that already in these forums.


I don't care. This is exactly how rewards should work, determined by the player-driven market. If exploration is too easy/common loot prices will drop and less people will do them. People will then do something else for an income. If it gets people living and fighting in null, that is good for the game. If CCP thinks it is a problem they can always nerf drop rates for certain items to increase their value.

This also is why ratting and incursions should reward primarily LP not mainly ISK so that there is a feedback regulating the impact of these activities on the greater economy.

If there's tons of isk then prices of everything else goes up, which makes the ratting less worthwhile in terms of things you can buy...

Well if only it went far enough that people in nullsec would mine rather than rat but it seems you'd need a lot of inflation to push that, so start 'flatin'

Mmmm, Interesting change list.
Lot of good stuff like the Incursion changes. More Anoms also increases population density nicely.

For the people talking rubbish about 100 people living in a single system, seriously, go to null, try and have 100 people farm a single system at once currently. Hell, try and have 10 people farm a single system at once now. If this turns active density from 10 to 15 in a system, that's progress, but it is certainly not the be all & end all.

As for Data/Relic sites & loot becoming cheaper. So it becomes cheaper..... Just move more volume, you will get the same income overall right? It's what you always tell miners. It will also actually become used loot if it is cheaper, and used loot is good. It increases destruction of said loot which provides a counterbalance to said production. High turnover is good for EVE, it means things are happening, low turn over is bad even if it's high value as it means things are quiet.