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Was I acting prudently?

Author
The Larold
This is an anagram of itself.
#1 - 2015-07-05 20:52:30 UTC
Today, while in high-sec and warping into the last (main) pocket of AE, I noticed 5-6 SoE scan probes within 5 AU of my location. This didn't feel right. (I've got a Golem with low-cost mods, but I realize I'm still shiny gank-bait.)

There were 40-50 people in local. It's a weekend, and 1 system away is a heavy mission-system with 140+ in local.

I decided to immediately dock and finish the mission at a later time. (I have plenty of other eve-things to get done.)

On a scale of 0 to 10, with 0 being "not at all" and 10 being "insanely", how paranoid was I being? Is 5 AU generally close enough for me to say to myself, "Yeah - that's not some random person being probed - that's most likely ME being probed..."

Thanks!
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#2 - 2015-07-05 21:12:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
You were prudent IMHO, there was a good chance you were the target of the probing.

AE is gated so if they were looking to engage in shenanigans with you then they would have to come through the preceding pockets to get to you, you can set DScan to pick up the gate into a previous pocket and see anyone entering it when you scan.

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uhnboy ghost
retard hills
#3 - 2015-07-05 21:16:09 UTC
hehe maybe a 5
its always good to be careful when u are in a high pop area in a "bling" ship u dont want to loose
but 5 au isent that close if u are not in the middle of nowhere whit no ppl/drones/mtuĀ“s on scan then its maybe time to start to align

but if it was normal probes and not combat probes then its a big 10 :-) but i guess it was combat probes

//uhnboy 84K probe scans in 2014 http://i.imgur.com/Uaid5iu.png

Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2015-07-05 21:35:30 UTC
It was more likely a mission baiters than gankers. Now if you see a bunch of flashies in local and things named Catalyst or Thrasher showing up in large numbers on dscan, it's time to bail. Watch out for attack battlecruisers like Tornados or Talos off station and gates too.
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2015-07-06 00:34:02 UTC
Gratz for staying alert and being cautious.

Nowadays the only way to stay safe is to fly smart.



DMC
Daerrol
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2015-07-06 02:03:38 UTC
We can't judge if you were prudent or not. I would not have docked up, I would ahve laughed and waited to see what shows up to pop me and probably tried to fight it with. But I am not you. If you were concerned and docking up made those concerns go away and you didn't feel you lost much ISK/Time from your life, then you most def made a good choice.
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#7 - 2015-07-06 06:30:32 UTC
angels extra involves sitting in one place for way too long. I never run it, plus I get bored of shooting that many NPCs in one go.

I say if you are going to run it, at least use a mach, so when you see them warp in you can hit the MWD and be probably safe.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
#8 - 2015-07-06 06:57:39 UTC
You were careful. A little more than most are, though many are not nearly as cautious as they ought to be, so I'd say you were appropriately prudent. That sort of range that close to a Marauder, given their bloated probe size, means you were likely what someone was scanning. Now, whether your were in any real appreciable danger is anyone's guess. Your "budy" might just have been looking for an unattended MTU for some free loot, since people like to pick them off when you leave them out for too long. He may have been someone looking to turn your Golem into his next mark. You chose to take matters into your own hands sooner than many rather than leave that up to chance. Complacency kills, and you've proven to be a more difficult target of opportunity than most of us here.

tl:dr

You did fine. Good on you.

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"----in' A, right?"

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"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."

Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
#9 - 2015-07-06 14:35:35 UTC
If you thought it was time to get out then it was, nobody else can answer the question of when yo get out but you.

You say sisters probes if they were of the core variety then you were massively paranoid.
On the other hand if they were combats as I suspect they were then see above.

Another tip. mission in an out of the way system, as long as the sec status is the same the payouts for the missions are identical and the less traveled and less active systems are not as frequently visited by gankers.
Estella Osoka
Perkone
Caldari State
#10 - 2015-07-06 14:44:49 UTC
What I would have done is changed my d-scan range to 1AU and kept checking it every 5-10 secs. You were in the last pocket of a mission with 5 gates, and even if he scans you down, he has to go through each gate. 1 AU d-scan will tell you if he is in one of the previous rooms. And I would have immediately stopped bastion mode and aligned out.
The Larold
This is an anagram of itself.
#11 - 2015-07-06 20:41:56 UTC
Sobaan Tali wrote:
You were careful. A little more than most are, though many are not nearly as cautious as they ought to be, so I'd say you were appropriately prudent. That sort of range that close to a Marauder, given their bloated probe size, means you were likely what someone was scanning. Now, whether your were in any real appreciable danger is anyone's guess. Your "budy" might just have been looking for an unattended MTU for some free loot, since people like to pick them off when you leave them out for too long. He may have been someone looking to turn your Golem into his next mark. You chose to take matters into your own hands sooner than many rather than leave that up to chance. Complacency kills, and you've proven to be a more difficult target of opportunity than most of us here.

tl:dr

You did fine. Good on you.


[I've got a quick question at the end]

Thanks - I appreciate feedback like this! While I'm a relatively high SP player, I'm still a total carebear. I assumed that, most likely, it was someone looking to bait me into doing something stupid. But in case it was one or more genuinely hostile players, I have virtually zero PvP experience and do not trust my knowledge or judgement.

I think my effective HP is something like 50+k and I have been 1-shotting NPC dessies, cruisers, and I think BCs. (They are the mid-sized red icon with the underline, correct?) But I read a blog where some guy got ganked by 16 Catalysts, and that just does not sound like something my Golem could keep up with. Sure, I might pop 3 or 4, but 16? Even in bastion mode...

I'm happy doing L4 missions in high-sec for now, and if my ISK/hour rate takes a little hit now and then, I'm totally fine with it.

In a busy mission hub system, what's a reasonable frequency to be scanning for probes? I over-estimated my diligence; I've only been checking about once every 30-60 seconds.
Tarojan
Tarojan Corporation
#12 - 2015-07-06 21:26:46 UTC
I'll be frank: the fact you use D scan sets you apart from the majority. I would normally say "if in doubt warp out" and just leave it at that, but your asking for solid info. Yes the gankers if they come will kill you. No you won't be able to fend them off if your in a PVE golem. Dont try. Abandon tractor units and if nessercary drones, don't engage anyone just get out of there. Your time between scans should consider how many gates they have to transit to get to you. I believe the wormhole rule is every 15 secs, but if your behind a gate you have more time. Once a min was probably very safe.

Again I want to stress this, you did good and you should keep doing exactly what your doing. This is eve. There is no such thing as "too cautious" or "too paranoid".

Will gank for food

Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#13 - 2015-07-06 22:05:37 UTC
if it involves wasting time and being inefficient then it is too cautious and paranoid. IMO warping out for 5 probes at mid range is both of those.

especially in the last room of a mission. I'd say hit the MJD and finish it. at 100km you have a lot of buffer room, if they bring a MJD brutix fleet, just laugh at the loss as they spent way too much time on you and gained next to nothing for their effort, probably a net isk loss for them (you did say it was a cheap fit right?). If they didn't bring an MJD brutix fleet, you can easily warp off. even if they did bring a MJD brutix fleet you have a decent amount of time to warp off, as you see them coming then spooling up the mjds and then they need to lock/point you.

personally I never watch d-scan, and rely on being fast in missions to not be sat still where they have time to probe me. If they want to get me the best place would be a gate, and in that case my fit really isn't all that shiny and let them, I have a good sense of humor.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2015-07-06 22:30:57 UTC
if they were combat probes, good for you. Probably saved yourself.

If they were just core scanner probes, they can't probe mission runners.
Captain TNT
Alt Union Club
#15 - 2015-07-07 05:58:43 UTC
It could be me probing for abandoned drones ,of course many others do the same thing Blink
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#16 - 2015-07-07 06:23:12 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
if they were combat probes, good for you. Probably saved yourself.

Oh rubbish. The only thing that will successfully suicide a golem is a lot of ships. If the mission is gated then they would appear on dscan long before they were a threat. OP over reacted.

If it was someone targeting him, it could also have been a ninja looter. In that case the only reason he would have been at risk is if he aggressed the guy.

If a single ship warps into your mission and starts looting your wrecks the best way to get rid of them is to abandon all the wrecks. It is very frustrating :)

Btw, Golems are very easy to scan down. If he didn't have you at 5 AU then he would have had you on the next scan.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.

Kalel Nimrott
Caldari Provisions
#17 - 2015-07-07 14:09:13 UTC
If they where combats, then maybe. Sometimes people forget to bookmark their mobile tractors!

Bob Artis, you will be missed.

O7

Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2015-07-08 21:45:21 UTC
The Larold wrote:
Sobaan Tali wrote:
You were careful. A little more than most are, though many are not nearly as cautious as they ought to be, so I'd say you were appropriately prudent. That sort of range that close to a Marauder, given their bloated probe size, means you were likely what someone was scanning. Now, whether your were in any real appreciable danger is anyone's guess. Your "budy" might just have been looking for an unattended MTU for some free loot, since people like to pick them off when you leave them out for too long. He may have been someone looking to turn your Golem into his next mark. You chose to take matters into your own hands sooner than many rather than leave that up to chance. Complacency kills, and you've proven to be a more difficult target of opportunity than most of us here.

tl:dr

You did fine. Good on you.


[I've got a quick question at the end]

Thanks - I appreciate feedback like this! While I'm a relatively high SP player, I'm still a total carebear. I assumed that, most likely, it was someone looking to bait me into doing something stupid. But in case it was one or more genuinely hostile players, I have virtually zero PvP experience and do not trust my knowledge or judgement.

I think my effective HP is something like 50+k and I have been 1-shotting NPC dessies, cruisers, and I think BCs. (They are the mid-sized red icon with the underline, correct?) But I read a blog where some guy got ganked by 16 Catalysts, and that just does not sound like something my Golem could keep up with. Sure, I might pop 3 or 4, but 16? Even in bastion mode...

I'm happy doing L4 missions in high-sec for now, and if my ISK/hour rate takes a little hit now and then, I'm totally fine with it.

In a busy mission hub system, what's a reasonable frequency to be scanning for probes? I over-estimated my diligence; I've only been checking about once every 30-60 seconds.


Local tank is the best tank. Learn to pay attention to local chat /player list. Flashy yellow suspects in local generally indicates can flippers, mission baiters, or station games - some sort of mischief but not an immediate threat if you don't see them. The more active local is the more often you should check D-scan. Keep scan at max range; if you see combat probes or multiple gank ships like catalysts or attack battlecruisers, bring scan range down incrementally. Gank ships on 1 AU means it's time to be going; probes on 1 AU means you are probably going to be visited by a mission baiter. Gallente assault frigates and their T1 variant the Incursus are popular with baiters. Flashy red criminals in local will be gankers; if there's only 1-2 they're probably doing untanked miners and T1 industrials and thus not a threat. More than 2-3 reds is a serious concern and you may wish to dock up, or go to a safe. Instant docks/undocks are a must; keep all tank/resist mods active at all times - not only when in the mission but when docking/undocking and aligning off stargates. Watch for tears/smack talk in local as this is another free intel source. If someone's crying about getting ganked ask them what happened. Mining barges 'sploding aren't your problem. You can even d-scan for wrecks and watch for them off gates/stations.

Learn to glean info from local and D-scan and put that together to keep an accurate picture of what's going on around you. I frequently pull up the browser while I'm missioning and run killboard searches on suspect/criminal players in local, to see exactly what sort of bad guy they are.
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#19 - 2015-07-08 23:56:28 UTC
A word from a lazy mission runner:

In 7 years of play I have had missions invaded maybe 6 times. In all cases they were looting, or baiting. Once they got my mobile tractor before I could scoop it. Never has my ship been attacked, and I fly some fairly bling ships fitted with a smattering of deadspace and faction modules. I don't d-scan (except in W). So I'd put you at 7 or 8 on the paranoid level.

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The Larold
This is an anagram of itself.
#20 - 2015-07-09 01:15:37 UTC
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
The Larold wrote:
Sobaan Tali wrote:
You were careful. A little more than most are, though many are not nearly as cautious as they ought to be, so I'd say you were appropriately prudent. That sort of range that close to a Marauder, given their bloated probe size, means you were likely what someone was scanning. Now, whether your were in any real appreciable danger is anyone's guess. Your "budy" might just have been looking for an unattended MTU for some free loot, since people like to pick them off when you leave them out for too long. He may have been someone looking to turn your Golem into his next mark. You chose to take matters into your own hands sooner than many rather than leave that up to chance. Complacency kills, and you've proven to be a more difficult target of opportunity than most of us here.

tl:dr

You did fine. Good on you.


[I've got a quick question at the end]

Thanks - I appreciate feedback like this! While I'm a relatively high SP player, I'm still a total carebear. I assumed that, most likely, it was someone looking to bait me into doing something stupid. But in case it was one or more genuinely hostile players, I have virtually zero PvP experience and do not trust my knowledge or judgement.

I think my effective HP is something like 50+k and I have been 1-shotting NPC dessies, cruisers, and I think BCs. (They are the mid-sized red icon with the underline, correct?) But I read a blog where some guy got ganked by 16 Catalysts, and that just does not sound like something my Golem could keep up with. Sure, I might pop 3 or 4, but 16? Even in bastion mode...

I'm happy doing L4 missions in high-sec for now, and if my ISK/hour rate takes a little hit now and then, I'm totally fine with it.

In a busy mission hub system, what's a reasonable frequency to be scanning for probes? I over-estimated my diligence; I've only been checking about once every 30-60 seconds.


Local tank is the best tank. Learn to pay attention to local chat /player list. Flashy yellow suspects in local generally indicates can flippers, mission baiters, or station games - some sort of mischief but not an immediate threat if you don't see them. The more active local is the more often you should check D-scan. Keep scan at max range; if you see combat probes or multiple gank ships like catalysts or attack battlecruisers, bring scan range down incrementally. Gank ships on 1 AU means it's time to be going; probes on 1 AU means you are probably going to be visited by a mission baiter. Gallente assault frigates and their T1 variant the Incursus are popular with baiters. Flashy red criminals in local will be gankers; if there's only 1-2 they're probably doing untanked miners and T1 industrials and thus not a threat. More than 2-3 reds is a serious concern and you may wish to dock up, or go to a safe. Instant docks/undocks are a must; keep all tank/resist mods active at all times - not only when in the mission but when docking/undocking and aligning off stargates. Watch for tears/smack talk in local as this is another free intel source. If someone's crying about getting ganked ask them what happened. Mining barges 'sploding aren't your problem. You can even d-scan for wrecks and watch for them off gates/stations.

Learn to glean info from local and D-scan and put that together to keep an accurate picture of what's going on around you. I frequently pull up the browser while I'm missioning and run killboard searches on suspect/criminal players in local, to see exactly what sort of bad guy they are.


Thanks - this is awesome, detailed advice.

To confirm, players who show up flashy red in my overview will ALSO show up flashy red in local?
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