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Station fitting service fix?
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Brutus Le'montac
#1 - 2015-07-03 15:25:41 UTC
hello,

I'm sure by now most of you have been toying around with the new entosis link module.
well i came across a small problem a few days ago when someone knocked a fitting service offline from station i was in.
and i have a solution/proposed fix for it.

Right now, when the fitting service is kicked offline, you can not open the fitting service window when docked.

my proposition would be to change this so you can open the window in station to look at your fit, but without the abbility to change modules.

Reason behind this is as follows:

I have multiple ships of the same type, with a small difference in fit ( often because of fleet docterines using the same ship hull with 3 possible fits) right now i need to undock to see which of my 7 vexors is the one that does have a medium neut instead of a small, when a fleet is called no one has the time to undock their ships to see wich one is the right ship.

also sometimes when camped inside a station undocking to check your fits is a not a smart idea anyways.
ofcourse you can always remember it by naming the ship different, but when someone does have multiple ships inside a station remembering a fit by name is difficult.

naming your vexor "armor/neuBlas vex" is a good idea to get blown up quickly

Linking a fit needs to be done form fitting window aswell, which again, cant be done right now with the fitting service offline.

With my solution knocking the fitting service offline still prevents people from fitting ships as designed, but it removes the annoyance of having to undock to quickly check a ships fit.

What is everyone idea about this?

Thought is dangerous; lack of thought, deadly!
Iain Cariaba
#2 - 2015-07-03 15:35:06 UTC
Or, you could grab an entosis link and fix your station's fitting service, then you woukd have access to everything. You know, actually solve thus easily solved problem yourself rather than ask CCP to fix it for you.
Brutus Le'montac
#3 - 2015-07-03 15:43:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Brutus Le'montac
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Or, you could grab an entosis link and fix your station's fitting service, then you woukd have access to everything. You know, actually solve thus easily solved problem yourself rather than ask CCP to fix it for you.


in theory yes, however if you do not own the station you can not use the entosis link to repair it.
freeports, "renters" and oanyone else who does not hold the station in name is basicly screwed over.

also i'm not asking ccp to fix a fitting service that is offline, thats fine with me, its game mechanics that, i'm only asking ccp to make the ship fitting screen that also dubbles as a ship overview tab useable again, if they withhold the actually abbility to fit stuff fine by me, thats what it is ment to do, but now i cant even see what is on my ship.

also fitting service means fitting modules, the screen you cant open right now is used for more then jus fitting.

Thought is dangerous; lack of thought, deadly!
Iain Cariaba
#4 - 2015-07-03 15:46:31 UTC
Brutus Le'montac wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Or, you could grab an entosis link and fix your station's fitting service, then you woukd have access to everything. You know, actually solve thus easily solved problem yourself rather than ask CCP to fix it for you.


in theory yes, however if you do not own the station you can not use the entosis link to repair it.
freeports, "renters" and oanyone else who does not hold the station in name is basicly screwed over.

also i'm not asking ccp to fix a fitting service that is offline, thats fine with me, its game mechanics that, i'm only asking ccp to make the ship fitting screen that also dubbles as a ship overview tab useable again, if they withhold the actually abbility to fit stuff fine by me, thats what it is ment to do, but now i cant even see what is on my ship.

also fitting service means fitting modules, the screen you cant open right now is used for more then jus fitting.

Still sounds like it's working as intended.
Brutus Le'montac
#5 - 2015-07-03 15:48:58 UTC
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Brutus Le'montac wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Or, you could grab an entosis link and fix your station's fitting service, then you woukd have access to everything. You know, actually solve thus easily solved problem yourself rather than ask CCP to fix it for you.


in theory yes, however if you do not own the station you can not use the entosis link to repair it.
freeports, "renters" and oanyone else who does not hold the station in name is basicly screwed over.

also i'm not asking ccp to fix a fitting service that is offline, thats fine with me, its game mechanics that, i'm only asking ccp to make the ship fitting screen that also dubbles as a ship overview tab useable again, if they withhold the actually abbility to fit stuff fine by me, thats what it is ment to do, but now i cant even see what is on my ship.

also fitting service means fitting modules, the screen you cant open right now is used for more then jus fitting.

Still sounds like it's working as intended.


i dont think so, working as intended should be being able to open the fitting screen but getting a pop up when you try to swap modules saying its denied. atleast then you can still see whats on your ship, thats the only problem i got with it..

Thought is dangerous; lack of thought, deadly!
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#6 - 2015-07-03 16:35:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Rivr Luzade
Brutus Le'montac wrote:
i dont think so, working as intended should be being able to open the fitting screen but getting a pop up when you try to swap modules saying its denied. atleast then you can still see whats on your ship, thats the only problem i got with it..

Which in fact should be possible to do. I noticed a couple of weeks ago that there are 2 different fitting window states now. In station with a fitting service or close to a fitting utility, the window looks normal. If you are nowhere close to fitting service/utility, the window now has a white frame around the circle similar to the white frame in user lists in chat windows, indicating that you cannot do something with the window. Hence, it should be possible to open the fitting window in station with a disabled service in the same fashion.

Actually, nevermind, it's the sun's light reflections that I saw around the circle. Whose brilliant idea was it to have sun light reflect in the fitting window on that circle? ôO

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Tina Twinkletwhat
Blitzkrieg Collection
#7 - 2015-07-03 16:58:33 UTC
I support the idea of being able to view your fitting without changing it, even while station services are disabled.

This is like undocking and opening the fitting window. I dont need a fitting service to view the fitting window when I am undocked so why do i need a fitting service to view the fitting window when I am docked?

This is akin to being able to place medical clones in stations without cloning services. If the lack of medical services has no bearing on my ability to station medical clones there, i dont see why a fitting service or a repair service would serve any purpose beyond a cosmetic one.
Brutus Le'montac
#8 - 2015-07-03 17:18:35 UTC
Tina Twinkletwhat wrote:
I support the idea of being able to view your fitting without changing it, even while station services are disabled.

This is like undocking and opening the fitting window. I dont need a fitting service to view the fitting window when I am undocked so why do i need a fitting service to view the fitting window when I am docked?

This is akin to being able to place medical clones in stations without cloning services. If the lack of medical services has no bearing on my ability to station medical clones there, i dont see why a fitting service or a repair service would serve any purpose beyond a cosmetic one.



exactly, this!

Thought is dangerous; lack of thought, deadly!
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#9 - 2015-07-03 18:11:47 UTC
Supported.

I'd also like it to allow the removal of extra modules you shouldn't be able to fit following a rebalance. I've JCed to a clone in a hostile station before, only to find I cannot undock because my old hurricane still had two utility highs filled. That was fun to deal with.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#10 - 2015-07-03 19:01:32 UTC
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Brutus Le'montac wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Or, you could grab an entosis link and fix your station's fitting service, then you woukd have access to everything. You know, actually solve thus easily solved problem yourself rather than ask CCP to fix it for you.


in theory yes, however if you do not own the station you can not use the entosis link to repair it.
freeports, "renters" and oanyone else who does not hold the station in name is basicly screwed over.

also i'm not asking ccp to fix a fitting service that is offline, thats fine with me, its game mechanics that, i'm only asking ccp to make the ship fitting screen that also dubbles as a ship overview tab useable again, if they withhold the actually abbility to fit stuff fine by me, thats what it is ment to do, but now i cant even see what is on my ship.

also fitting service means fitting modules, the screen you cant open right now is used for more then jus fitting.

Still sounds like it's working as intended.


Even without a chain block to remove/install an engine in a garage, I'm pretty sure I can still at least check if there is an engine under the hood and which type. This is all this idea is asking for.
Iain Cariaba
#11 - 2015-07-03 19:30:14 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Brutus Le'montac wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Or, you could grab an entosis link and fix your station's fitting service, then you woukd have access to everything. You know, actually solve thus easily solved problem yourself rather than ask CCP to fix it for you.


in theory yes, however if you do not own the station you can not use the entosis link to repair it.
freeports, "renters" and oanyone else who does not hold the station in name is basicly screwed over.

also i'm not asking ccp to fix a fitting service that is offline, thats fine with me, its game mechanics that, i'm only asking ccp to make the ship fitting screen that also dubbles as a ship overview tab useable again, if they withhold the actually abbility to fit stuff fine by me, thats what it is ment to do, but now i cant even see what is on my ship.

also fitting service means fitting modules, the screen you cant open right now is used for more then jus fitting.

Still sounds like it's working as intended.


Even without a chain block to remove/install an engine in a garage, I'm pretty sure I can still at least check if there is an engine under the hood and which type. This is all this idea is asking for.

Let's continue your theme of a garage. A disabled fitting service is like a garage with all the windows covered, the doors closed, and the lights turned off. Sure, there's enough light seeping into the garage to see where the cars are, but you can't tell whether the Charger you're getting into is the blue one with the V-6 or the black one with the V-8.
Tina Twinkletwhat
Blitzkrieg Collection
#12 - 2015-07-03 20:36:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Tina Twinkletwhat
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Let's continue your theme of a garage.


Lets not, that analogy is trash from both sides.
What is a much better question you should be asking yourselves is, "why if the fitting service is necessary to view the fitting window, can you view the fitting window when you are undocked?"

Surely if the fitting service is critical to the operation of the fitting window, it should not be able to be opened when undocked. The only thing that should be available when undocked or fitting services are offline is the skin selection window. Under your logic, opening the fitting window on a ship thats undocked implies it has its OWN fitting service, rendering station fitting services moot once again
Thelonious Blake
Miles Research and Development
#13 - 2015-07-03 23:41:05 UTC
The suggestion is reasonable and it has +1 from me.

@Tina don't feed the trolls. If you read more in this subsection you'd know.
Elenahina
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2015-07-03 23:47:28 UTC
Right Click, View Contents.

Eve is like an addiction; you can't quit it until it quits you. Also, iderno
Nyalnara
Marauder Initiative
#15 - 2015-07-03 23:51:32 UTC
Tina Twinkletwhat wrote:
This is like undocking and opening the fitting window. I dont need a fitting service to view the fitting window when I am undocked so why do i need a fitting service to view the fitting window when I am docked?


Supported, because that.

French half-noob.

Non, je ne suis pas gentil.
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2015-07-04 00:15:45 UTC
Elenahina wrote:
Right Click, View Contents.


Tells you nothing about the status or stats of said modules.
Iain Cariaba
#17 - 2015-07-04 15:05:29 UTC
Tina Twinkletwhat wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Let's continue your theme of a garage.


Lets not, that analogy is trash from both sides.
What is a much better question you should be asking yourselves is, "why if the fitting service is necessary to view the fitting window, can you view the fitting window when you are undocked?"

Surely if the fitting service is critical to the operation of the fitting window, it should not be able to be opened when undocked. The only thing that should be available when undocked or fitting services are offline is the skin selection window. Under your logic, opening the fitting window on a ship thats undocked implies it has its OWN fitting service, rendering station fitting services moot once again

Actually, the garage analogy works very well in this case.

With operational fitting service, the lights are on, windows open, everything's easy to see.
With no operational fitting service, it's as I described earlier, and when you undock, you pull the car out onto the driveway where you can open the hood, check the oil (ammo), and that fun stuff.
Mobile Depot is dragging the tool box out of the garage and into the driveway to work on the car.

So, your not being able to even view your fitting without an operational fitting service does, indeed, make sense.
Brutus Le'montac
#18 - 2015-07-04 18:19:16 UTC
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Tina Twinkletwhat wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Let's continue your theme of a garage.


Lets not, that analogy is trash from both sides.
What is a much better question you should be asking yourselves is, "why if the fitting service is necessary to view the fitting window, can you view the fitting window when you are undocked?"

Surely if the fitting service is critical to the operation of the fitting window, it should not be able to be opened when undocked. The only thing that should be available when undocked or fitting services are offline is the skin selection window. Under your logic, opening the fitting window on a ship thats undocked implies it has its OWN fitting service, rendering station fitting services moot once again

Actually, the garage analogy works very well in this case.

With operational fitting service, the lights are on, windows open, everything's easy to see.
With no operational fitting service, it's as I described earlier, and when you undock, you pull the car out onto the driveway where you can open the hood, check the oil (ammo), and that fun stuff.
Mobile Depot is dragging the tool box out of the garage and into the driveway to work on the car.

So, your not being able to even view your fitting without an operational fitting service does, indeed, make sense.



incorrect, light and everything off means the garage ( station) is not accessable at all, which it is. so this analogy doesnt work

Thought is dangerous; lack of thought, deadly!
Brutus Le'montac
#19 - 2015-07-04 18:22:01 UTC
And i think i did find a temporal work around for it:

Undock 1 ship.
Open up the fitting window
Dock back up

now the fitting window stays open, and you can look at whats fitted and offline or online modules again, this also works when swapping ships

however when you try to unslot or slot a module it wont allow it.
It seems that the game does not do a forced fitting service check when docking, and only looks for a fitting service once you 'call"upon the service, by trying to slot or unslot a module.

Hope this helps some of the others here.

Thought is dangerous; lack of thought, deadly!
Iain Cariaba
#20 - 2015-07-04 19:42:05 UTC
Brutus Le'montac wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Tina Twinkletwhat wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Let's continue your theme of a garage.


Lets not, that analogy is trash from both sides.
What is a much better question you should be asking yourselves is, "why if the fitting service is necessary to view the fitting window, can you view the fitting window when you are undocked?"

Surely if the fitting service is critical to the operation of the fitting window, it should not be able to be opened when undocked. The only thing that should be available when undocked or fitting services are offline is the skin selection window. Under your logic, opening the fitting window on a ship thats undocked implies it has its OWN fitting service, rendering station fitting services moot once again

Actually, the garage analogy works very well in this case.

With operational fitting service, the lights are on, windows open, everything's easy to see.
With no operational fitting service, it's as I described earlier, and when you undock, you pull the car out onto the driveway where you can open the hood, check the oil (ammo), and that fun stuff.
Mobile Depot is dragging the tool box out of the garage and into the driveway to work on the car.

So, your not being able to even view your fitting without an operational fitting service does, indeed, make sense.



incorrect, light and everything off means the garage ( station) is not accessable at all, which it is. so this analogy doesnt work

The analogy works quite well, actually. Without fitting services, you can still access the garage (hangar) but you can't work on (refit) anything within it.
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