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Frigate Logistics Needed

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Hustomte
Veritex Industrial Inc.
#1 - 2011-12-07 11:25:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Hustomte
Problem: New players can't get their feet wet into logistics until they get to Cruiser level ships. All aspects of Eve gameplay are offered at Frigate level (combat, mining, e-war, exploration) except for logistics. Sad

Proposed solution: Give a tech1 version of the mining frigates into an entry logistics role (Navitas, Tormenter, Bantam, Burst) something simple like a range-bonus to small reps would work.

Drawbacks: It would take some time to change those frig stats, and time is valuable at CCP with so many player demands.

Any other relevant information: Reaching out to the player base that likes to play "healers" would be nice to get into logistics at an early age. Running level 1's as a support ship was something I wish I could do with corp-mates but couldn't. I couldn't afford to get into a Cruiser at such a young age and therefor was deprived of the experience until later. Meanwhile miners, explorers, and combat pilots had their fun.


Feedback and suggestions welcome for this idea.

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Hustomte
Veritex Industrial Inc.
#2 - 2011-12-07 12:58:00 UTC
Made this image of what a logi Navitas would look like for fun Big smile

http://www.metafocus.net/~goney/images/Navitas-Logi.jpg

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Ya Huei
Imperial Collective
#3 - 2011-12-07 13:04:02 UTC
If u do missions with multiple people you're doing it wrong.
Hustomte
Veritex Industrial Inc.
#4 - 2011-12-07 13:07:36 UTC
Ya Huei wrote:
If u do missions with multiple people you're doing it wrong.


I'll make sure to let all the Incursion kids know that Blink

Besides, as a noob, you need to be with others. The Eve learning curve is as hard as it is already. And running missions with corp-mates is actually kinda fun. You should try it sometime instead of going the lone-wolf route.

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HaxTis
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2011-12-07 13:09:22 UTC
Yeah Ya Huei is right you should run missions alone and have no friends to make this awful game bearable :eyeroll:

I see a couple of cons to this - small, speed-tanking logis could be incredibly OP. Try thinking of a few ways this could be abused and try to solve those problems.
Ya Huei
Imperial Collective
#6 - 2011-12-07 13:11:15 UTC
Missions <> incursions.

The isk u make in missions < L4 is already horrible, combined with the fact that they're really easy to do makes teaming up for them kind of useless.

Also for the logistics thing. The time it takes to train up logistics related skills will allow u to earn enough isk to buy 30 T1 logistics cruisers so I don't really see why u would need a logistics frigate.

Other than the fact that you want to do logistics in a frigate in a mission for some reason.
Ya Huei
Imperial Collective
#7 - 2011-12-07 13:16:06 UTC
HaxTis wrote:
Yeah Ya Huei is right you should run missions alone and have no friends to make this awful game bearable :eyeroll:

I see a couple of cons to this - small, speed-tanking logis could be incredibly OP. Try thinking of a few ways this could be abused and try to solve those problems.


Ye because the ONLY place to socialize and have any sort of "fleet related" activity is in missions right ?
HaxTis
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2011-12-07 13:16:09 UTC
My point wasn't that running missions as a team is pointless, which it undoubtedly is, but that maybe he was playing with friends so he could, you know, play with friends?
Hustomte
Veritex Industrial Inc.
#9 - 2011-12-07 13:16:42 UTC
HaxTis wrote:
Yeah Ya Huei is right you should run missions alone and have no friends to make this awful game bearable :eyeroll:

I see a couple of cons to this - small, speed-tanking logis could be incredibly OP. Try thinking of a few ways this could be abused and try to solve those problems.


I don't think it's OP ... mostly because you can do that in a Vengeance AF already (I know FailFit but proof of concept)

[Vengeance, Logi]

Small Remote Armor Repair System II
Small Remote Armor Repair System II
Small Remote Armor Repair System II
Small Energy Transfer Array II

1MN Afterburner II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

Small Armor Repairer II
Capacitor Power Relay II
Capacitor Power Relay II
Damage Control II

Small Remote Repair Augmentor I
Small Anti-Thermic Pump I


Would just a T1 bonus frig be better than a T2 for cost reasons/reduced resists?

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HaxTis
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2011-12-07 13:21:45 UTC
I do like this idea as a concept because it gives newer players faster access to a broader spectrum of the game, something this game sorely needs.
Ya Huei
Imperial Collective
#11 - 2011-12-07 13:41:01 UTC
sure concept is nice, but there is no content that encourages you to actually use those skills.

Also part of why eve is a difficult game to start with is that there are about a million choices to make on day 1 regarding skill training. This will just add a whole bunch more to the mix.
Hustomte
Veritex Industrial Inc.
#12 - 2011-12-07 13:49:33 UTC
Ya Huei wrote:
sure concept is nice, but there is no content that encourages you to actually use those skills.

Also part of why eve is a difficult game to start with is that there are about a million choices to make on day 1 regarding skill training. This will just add a whole bunch more to the mix.


True, but I have a see-a-need fill-a-need mindset. There is a hole for logi-pilots to fall into currently. Other than a fear of a small-sig radius fast frig-logi, why would CCP leave out frig logistics when they have every other type of gameplay frigate?
I almost want to say a ship like this could be used in wolfpacks or at least get more action than EAS currently Blink ... hmm, maybe ships like this would make EAS usable?

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Hustomte
Veritex Industrial Inc.
#13 - 2011-12-07 23:16:09 UTC
I re-skinned the Tormentor tonight for fun... it actually looks kinda cool with a new paint job Big smile
http://www.metafocus.net/~goney/images/Tormentor-Logi.jpg

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Fyrkraag
Perkone
Caldari State
#14 - 2011-12-08 00:11:46 UTC

When Tech 3 cruisers were added in apocgrypha, there were supposedly plans to eventually expand the tech 3 family to other ship classes.

It seems to me that tech 3 frigates could appropriately cover this role you are talking about, or geared out to be drams on crack on whatever, depending on the subsystems the tech 3 operator purchases.
Hustomte
Veritex Industrial Inc.
#15 - 2011-12-08 15:15:10 UTC
Burst:
http://www.metafocus.net/~goney/images/Burst-Logi.jpg

Shield Bantam is best Bantam (this one made me LOL) Big smile
http://www.metafocus.net/~goney/images/Bantam-Logi.jpg

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Prometheus Exenthal
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2011-12-08 18:40:17 UTC
No.

Frigates (overall) are pretty well balanced.
There are oddballs, and there are obvious tiering issues, but they are pretty damn good.

Introducing anything logistics based would be extremely stupid, and would be akin to trying to make a role for something that isn't needed. In short, it would be pretty broken if it were good, and pretty useless if they weren't.

https://www.youtube.com/user/promsrage

DO YOUR JOBS, CCP DEVS. FIX THE GAME INSTEAD OF FKING IT
Wolodymyr
Breaking Ambitions
#17 - 2011-12-08 18:44:18 UTC
I'd like to see a logi for T2 frigate roams,

Make a T2 destroyer hull (we need more reasons to train destroyers to 5) that has has an incredible bonus to small remote repper range to rep frigates that are zipping around the battlefield. And it'll need a lock on bonus to scan resolution so that it can get reps on a frigate before they insta pop. A remote rep cycle time bonus would be nice too.

Next you just need to make sure that the actual remote rep HPS amount stays low so that it is only really effective on other frigates.

I honestly think PoCo based sov is a good idea https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1417544
Zircon Dasher
#18 - 2011-12-08 18:47:21 UTC
Prometheus Exenthal wrote:
No.

Frigates (overall) are pretty well balanced.
There are oddballs, and there are obvious tiering issues, but they are pretty damn good.

Introducing anything logistics based would be extremely stupid, and would be akin to trying to make a role for something that isn't needed. In short, it would be pretty broken if it were good, and pretty useless if they weren't.


This.

We dont need more EAF's.

Nerfing High-sec is never the answer. It is the question. The answer is 'YES'.
Zircon Dasher
#19 - 2011-12-08 18:47:49 UTC
Prometheus Exenthal wrote:
No.

Frigates (overall) are pretty well balanced.
There are oddballs, and there are obvious tiering issues, but they are pretty damn good.

Introducing anything logistics based would be extremely stupid, and would be akin to trying to make a role for something that isn't needed. In short, it would be pretty broken if it were good, and pretty useless if they weren't.


Double Posting 4TW

Nerfing High-sec is never the answer. It is the question. The answer is 'YES'.
Hustomte
Veritex Industrial Inc.
#20 - 2011-12-08 19:25:07 UTC
Prometheus Exenthal wrote:
No.

Frigates (overall) are pretty well balanced.
There are oddballs, and there are obvious tiering issues, but they are pretty damn good.

Introducing anything logistics based would be extremely stupid, and would be akin to trying to make a role for something that isn't needed. In short, it would be pretty broken if it were good, and pretty useless if they weren't.


Speaking of things not needed (other than the CSM) ;)
Can CCP remove the small-remote-armor repairer then?

What is the purpose of it with a 4km range and 19 HP/s?

Inquiring minds want to know Big smile

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