Assembly Hall

The first two have no guarantee they will have what you need. Industrial corps will happily provide you with ships... in highsec next door to low (admitedly, last time I tried this, black frog didn't exist). Friends is just someone else's alts. Try it sometime, you'll see how it goes.




Maybe it's faster, but I'm not so sure. Finding BS rats is very hit or miss, not like 0.0. And obviously, isk does come into the equation: you can try ratting in up in lowsec, take 10 hours and make 100 mil. Or do it semi afk in highsec, take 20 hours but make 600 mil.

If they go back to highsec when they run out of isk, that's fine by me. It's no different than a -10 logging off his main and grinding missions on an alt for a bit. It's being "sent" back to highsec for being successful that's silly.

As a side note: Sentries not having tracking is rather unfair to frig/cruiser pilots...

and nullsec PvP is problematic at best for casual types (getting bubbled and podded repeatedly, and/or getting crap dropped on your head by ex-sovholders who seem to have a penchant for fleeing to NPC null, never mind the kind of hornets you can stir up in other folks' sovspace).

Well since friends cant count because it is someone elses alt:

then Black Frog can't count because they use alts. And buying anything from highsec hubs cant count because the traders are alts that got goods from other alts. And those goods were made by mission runners/mining alts and industrial alts.

OH NOES!!! I GET IT NAO!!!

Everyone who is not you is an alt.



OR maybe you should get out more.




Actually I have been profiting off it for about 2 years now. Thanks

Ah, I get it. The proposal would affect your bottom line. I can understand that.

This is great, have my bump.

EDIT: read through the thread, here are a couple points I think need to be answered (quotes are paraphrased but accurate)


Who cares? This isn't about changing where PvP happens. This is about making low-sec not ****. If consequentially more people PvP in low-sec, so be it.


False. Club Bear is a good counterexample. Plus, you're basing your experience on what you see in low-sec, which is a bit myopic seeing as the people this would apply to AVOID low-sec in its current state due to being limited to flashies.


Where x is some form of grinding. Alts, hauling, scouring the stocks of the low-sec market, ratting sec from time to time. It's all some form of grinding. We're aware that it's possible to do that, we just don't like it, hence the OP. Just stating what the game is like ATM and going "deal with it" isn't constructive.



The crux of the issue.
You're misconstruing Eve's harshness into a stone-wall "Want to make Eve quote unquote easier, more accessible? Baby, go play Hello kitty online / wow / cowadooty".
OP wants to change the way in which low-sec is harsh, not remove the harshness. Instead of stupid mechanics and grinding, lack of sentries and player-caused danger. If you think this is against Eve's philosophy, then you think Eve is about grinding, and you're the one who should be playing Wow. Not arena though, just leveling blacksmithing all day.

BTW, even for all the die-hard grindfest fans, at least acknowledge the stupidity of sec status making low-sec further removed from high-sec than 0.0 is.

Oh and Jack, don't think I don't know whom you're talking about when you say "people complaining about not having ship fittings even when we had corp hulls".

Lowsec also pretty much alienates frigates, assault frigates, destroyers, interdictors and t1 cruisers from effectively engaging on gates.

This added to the fact that newbies often want to go play in a rifter compounds EVE's elitist playstyle. Essentially, solo lowsec pvp under BC hulls is INCREDIBLY hard to find, unless you want to be roundly spanked by Alex Medvedov in a 2/10 plex, get jumped by six drams in Amamake I belt I or be ganked by an instalock lachesis tackle for a battlecruiser gang.

When I was a 2m sp nubbing back in 2008 or whenever it was I would have LOVED to jump in a rifter and tour lowsec trying my hand at nabbing a cruiser or destroyer at a gate, or even grabbing an industrial. It would have pushed me into true piracy a lot quicker.

This suggestion is still one of the best Ive seen for a while, even if it was a corpmate who suggested it.

/me tips his hat to Mr. Dant

These two quotes are important.

People do not like being limited to shooting flashies in lowsec.
Being non-flashies confers an advantage in fights.
Alts (SP grinding), Not having trade hubs within a jump or two (movement grinding), Hauling (alt + movement grind), and ratting (sec grind) are stupid. PEOPLE DO NOT WANT TO GRIND! They want to undock, pewpew for an hour and log the f*** off.

Since being non-flashy gives you an advantage, people will do what they have to do in order to keep that advantage. This means gridning....which blows donkey nuts. That means that people who hate being limited to shooting flashies will be just as irritated because they still can't shoot non-flashies.

The logical solution to end grinding and make lowsec not ****?

Get rid of all sentries and security loss in lowsec.

This is not rocket science.


TOOO TEH TOPZ!

Possibly one of the best suggestions I have heard when it comes to getting more warm bodies out to lowsec and lowering the stigma for the casual pvp-er to kill others in lowsec.

+1

An excellent idea, I'd like to see this implemented.

Reducing GCC to 5 minutes instead of 15 would also be a big help, as most people just cloak or dock up and have to stop playing for 15 minutes, which is another factor reducing the fun.

Doo eet!