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Warfare & Tactics

 
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A thought about Boosters:
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Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#41 - 2015-06-28 18:21:38 UTC
Mizhir wrote:
It's funny how people asume that it is perfectly fine game mechanics that everyone have to train an alt for boosting just to be competetive in the current meta.


It's more the fact of having to pay for a second account every month and multibox just to be competitive at "solo."

Though once you start identifying link users and link plagued systems and avoiding them the problem lessens a bit.
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#42 - 2015-06-28 18:26:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Crosi Wesdo
Mizhir wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Mizhir wrote:
It's funny how people asume that it is perfectly fine game mechanics that everyone have to train an alt for boosting just to be competetive in the current meta.


Everyone has to train for everything else. Its called game progression.


Because it makes sense that you have to buy 2 accounts to progress?


Should 2 accounts not be better than one?

As for 'solo' mentioned above. This fixation on a niche aspect of this mmo game, as i have mentioned before, is silly.

Boosters are working great on a fleet level for various purposes and balancing boosters for solo by bringing them on field will, in their current form, destroy their use in many doctrines and make quite a few tactics redundant while strongly favoring larger groups further widening the gap between larger and smaller groups.

All so these soloers who make an arbitrary decision to 'take the hard path' of solo, only to cry about hard the path is.
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#43 - 2015-06-29 15:34:14 UTC
True solo fights in EVE is a rarity. Thinking that there is such a thing as "solo" and a "fair fight" in EVE, is a delusion.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#44 - 2015-06-29 20:19:01 UTC
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Mizhir wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Mizhir wrote:
It's funny how people asume that it is perfectly fine game mechanics that everyone have to train an alt for boosting just to be competetive in the current meta.


Everyone has to train for everything else. Its called game progression.


Because it makes sense that you have to buy 2 accounts to progress?


Should 2 accounts not be better than one?


If a character from the other account is in the battle it should make a difference.

But when your characters from the other account is are not even in the battle, it shouldn't matter how many accounts you have.







Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#45 - 2015-06-29 20:42:10 UTC
Which brings us to the catch 22 where only the larger fleets can have boosts for any amount of time in a fight.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#46 - 2015-06-29 21:10:15 UTC
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Which brings us to the catch 22 where only the larger fleets can have boosts for any amount of time in a fight.



Bring more ships into a fight and it should make a difference. I don't see that as a catch 22.


I still don't think paying for an extra account that doesn't even appear in the battle should effect the outcome.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Jordon Wallace
Doomheim
#47 - 2015-06-29 21:30:38 UTC
I am new but I grasp the concept and the beef people, not all but a large portion it seems of the community has with this. What I would propose is making links only work when on grid or meeting people half way and having the links have to be within say 2 AU or the appropriate figure for the links to apply there effects, this would counter the un-probable issue or almost un-probable and make for a richer experience.
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#48 - 2015-06-29 22:01:15 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Which brings us to the catch 22 where only the larger fleets can have boosts for any amount of time in a fight.



Bring more ships into a fight and it should make a difference. I don't see that as a catch 22.


I still don't think paying for an extra account that doesn't even appear in the battle should effect the outcome.


You do realize we are talking about command boosters/links here?
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#49 - 2015-06-30 13:51:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Cearain
Estella Osoka wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Which brings us to the catch 22 where only the larger fleets can have boosts for any amount of time in a fight.



Bring more ships into a fight and it should make a difference. I don't see that as a catch 22.


I still don't think paying for an extra account that doesn't even appear in the battle should effect the outcome.


You do realize we are talking about command boosters/links here?


Yes so do the devs who say they want to require them on grid as soon as they can work out the technicalities.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
#50 - 2015-06-30 15:45:07 UTC
If there's a naga 130k above the gate, a rupture and a stiletto at 0m on it and a blackbird 80km to the side...
And you land on that naga, kills it quickly then get tackled by ceptor and disposing of said one, BB misses all jams due to increasing range to 150 and beyond and finally the rupture runs off - is that outnumbered solo-pvp or actually jsut two quick ganks targeted at a scrubby gatecamp? Cause I'd tend to call it the second.
Joey Bags
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#51 - 2015-07-04 08:15:39 UTC
Marlin Spikes wrote:
Too much credit is given to boosting alts. Although they add an edge to the fight, either side can use them. My opinion is that good pilots generally have boosting alts and bad pilots don't. If you want to level the playing field, get another account and train up a boosting alt. Problem fixed.

I disagree. The "Let's war-dec every new corp for easy kills" crowd use this to very great effect and its very difficult for young players to counter. My solution is if you join a fleet that's at war you are effectively at war with other corps with a 24 hour timer. The same would apply to FW, mining boost fleets, etc. If you boost for a high sec gank you should share the criminal flag and kill rights, just as you would for repping or sensor hosting. It would be fair, balanced and make sense too. If a hostile pilot is in your system and is in a fleet of twelve in the same system that are otherwise neutral, you should see twelve hostiles in local before you undock.
Just my two ISK.

You can pick your friends and you can pick your nose but you can't pick your friends nose. Unless you podded them...and collected their corpse.
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#52 - 2015-07-04 16:58:28 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Estella Osoka wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Which brings us to the catch 22 where only the larger fleets can have boosts for any amount of time in a fight.



Bring more ships into a fight and it should make a difference. I don't see that as a catch 22.


I still don't think paying for an extra account that doesn't even appear in the battle should effect the outcome.


You do realize we are talking about command boosters/links here?


Yes so do the devs who say they want to require them on grid as soon as it they can work out the technicalities.


And you don't think OGBs contribute to a fight?
Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#53 - 2015-07-05 12:30:04 UTC
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Rovain Sess wrote:
So I not going to rant about a legal game mechanic - use off grid boosters all one wants. All I would like to see is that they (off Grid boosts) incur the same characteristics as the use of logistics on a friend in a fight. They should receive a suspect timer. It's a little crazy when you have identified a booster alt sitting on station or gate and it's giving ones foe a nice competitive advantage, and if you shoot it - you take station guns.

Whilst not an exploit and they are obviously working as the current mechanic allow - I think the subject of receiving suspect status needs to be seriously considered for future inclusion into the game especially since the - "they will have to be on the actual combat grid" idea seems to have died.

Just a thought,

Rovie


Suspect timer + add entry on killmail.

Add logi to killmail also.

Pretty much this. If they were involved why are they not recorded?

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#54 - 2015-07-06 16:22:47 UTC
Moonlit Raid wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Rovain Sess wrote:
So I not going to rant about a legal game mechanic - use off grid boosters all one wants. All I would like to see is that they (off Grid boosts) incur the same characteristics as the use of logistics on a friend in a fight. They should receive a suspect timer. It's a little crazy when you have identified a booster alt sitting on station or gate and it's giving ones foe a nice competitive advantage, and if you shoot it - you take station guns.

Whilst not an exploit and they are obviously working as the current mechanic allow - I think the subject of receiving suspect status needs to be seriously considered for future inclusion into the game especially since the - "they will have to be on the actual combat grid" idea seems to have died.

Just a thought,

Rovie


Suspect timer + add entry on killmail.

Add logi to killmail also.

Pretty much this. If they were involved why are they not recorded?


I think you are required to aggess the victim to be on the killmail.

Plus lots of players in eve like the fact that their killboard misrepresents the actual fight. They like it to look like they fought 3 navy frigates in a t1 frigate when really the fight was 3 navy frigates versus a strategic cruiser and a t1 frigate.


Estella Osoka:
Yes ogb contribute that is why they should be on grid. They are basically God mode. I am not sure what your point is.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Legatus1982
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#55 - 2015-07-07 23:39:07 UTC
Marlin Spikes wrote:
Too much credit is given to boosting alts. Although they add an edge to the fight, either side can use them. My opinion is that good pilots generally have boosting alts and bad pilots don't. If you want to level the playing field, get another account and train up a boosting alt. Problem fixed.


While I don't particularly mind people having alts and using them as they see fit, and even I'd go so far as to say I don't necessarily mind people having MULTIPLE ACCOUNTS with alts to use as they see fit, it should not be ENCOURAGED via things like warfare links and fleet bonuses. While there is nothing that can be done about logi realistically, warfare links and I would argue even regular fleet bonuses should not exist in this game as they directly allow you to buff your main account simply by having a second-account alt undocked in the same system as your main.

The game already favors blob warfare as it is and CCP is already doing what they can to discourage that and put more power into the hands of the individuals, things like warfare links and fleet bonuses are DIRECTLY CONTRARY to the objective they are currently trying to achieve.
Mephiztopheleze
Laphroaig Inc.
#56 - 2015-07-08 00:51:43 UTC
how about a simple fix.....

activating Warfare Link modules gives you both a Weapons Timer AND a 500,000% increase in Signature radius Twisted

Occasional Resident Newbie Correspondent for TMC: http://themittani.com/search/site/mephiztopheleze

This is my Forum Main. My Combat Alt is sambo Inkura
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#57 - 2015-07-08 20:06:30 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Moonlit Raid wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Rovain Sess wrote:
So I not going to rant about a legal game mechanic - use off grid boosters all one wants. All I would like to see is that they (off Grid boosts) incur the same characteristics as the use of logistics on a friend in a fight. They should receive a suspect timer. It's a little crazy when you have identified a booster alt sitting on station or gate and it's giving ones foe a nice competitive advantage, and if you shoot it - you take station guns.

Whilst not an exploit and they are obviously working as the current mechanic allow - I think the subject of receiving suspect status needs to be seriously considered for future inclusion into the game especially since the - "they will have to be on the actual combat grid" idea seems to have died.

Just a thought,

Rovie


Suspect timer + add entry on killmail.

Add logi to killmail also.

Pretty much this. If they were involved why are they not recorded?


I think you are required to aggess the victim to be on the killmail.

Plus lots of players in eve like the fact that their killboard misrepresents the actual fight. They like it to look like they fought 3 navy frigates in a t1 frigate when really the fight was 3 navy frigates versus a strategic cruiser and a t1 frigate.


Estella Osoka:
Yes ogb contribute that is why they should be on grid. They are basically God mode. I am not sure what your point is.


So then, you agree, even if they are not on grid; they should be on the killmail.
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#58 - 2015-07-08 20:22:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Crosi Wesdo
Ya boosts are completely immune on station and everyone who has them is in god mode.

Back to reality and some of the funnest parts of the kehjari deployment last weekend was alphaing boosters off station during fights.

Just because they seem to ruin your irrelevant solo game doesnt mean they dont make great content for everyone else while making the engagements themselves more interesting and sustained and wider doctrines viable.

4/5 commandships down, great fights were had (some people even died dispite having 'godmode' lol), so ya, boosts at fleet levels are so broken and should be fixed so that a handful of millennial soloists dont feel so cheated.
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome
#59 - 2015-07-09 05:52:03 UTC
People who complain about off grid boosts don't realize that if CCP removes them they will be in a much worse off position.


Example:

I'm sitting in a medium plex.

You come to pew pew because 1v1 in an MMO is smart and how it's ment to be played.

I tackle and decloak a falcon because my boost toon is now more useful as an ECM pilot.


That will be the new reality.

Don't think you'll be safe in novice or small plexes either.
99% of frigate fights last long enough for the cloaking lock delay to be well and truly over making a cloaking Griffin very viable. (I have tested this and the tears flowed way more than when I use boosts)


So yeah - keep asking for boosts on grid people. Then you can start complaining about the next thing until all that is left are the things that suit your solo play style in an MMO. Or you could buy Elite Dangerous and get that now. Cool

https://soundcloud.com/ibanezlaney
Rovain Sess
Wu Fanged
#60 - 2015-07-10 03:55:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Rovain Sess
Not sure why being able to aggress a party that is assisting someone that is aggressiing me without me incurring the wrath of station guns, or gate guns, or other players is so hard to stomach.

A booster is assisting my foe, so then why are they immune to my aggression? I gain all kinds of crap for going after said supposedly neutral entity, meanwhile, they help those who are chewing on my fat. This in my opinion is not very balanced.

Even if they get an aggression timer ( I'm not saying they gotta be on grid) - just not sitting in an unbumpable dock position or on a insta jump thru gate, they still have a degree of safety. But to have a stroll in the park as a fleet booster should be made difficult. As it stands, it's one aspect of Eve that lacks a lot of risk versus the reward that is imparted to those who benefit from significant advantages imparted.

My two cents.