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Drifter Capitals

Author
Commander Caesar Koba
Doomheim
#1 - 2015-05-17 20:21:03 UTC
So, with all of the insane hype swirling around the recent news of massive numbers of Drifter Battleships amassing in distant wormholes, seemingly gearing up for a full scale invasion of New Eden, I've began to wonder what they could be hiding, waiting to reveal in a blaze of death, destruction, and lasers.

We are all well aware of how utterly and indomitably powerful the Drifter Battleships are; between their speed and maneuverability, their tank, their main weapons, and, of course, their devastating super weapons. But by now we've had enough contact, or conflict, with them to have begun establishing effective and efficient methods for destroying them. That's not to say they aren't still a considerable threat, especially in such vast numbers, but at least we have a good handle on what we are dealing with. And that is what scares me the most. What are they hiding? What haven't we seen yet? With such incredible technology, I can't believe that they would limit themselves to battleship hulls.

My concern is that, once they begin their invasion of New Eden, we could see new, larger, more powerful ships coming through the void, and obliterating any defensive strategies or battle plans we have come up with. My biggest fear is coming into contact with something like a Dreadnought/Carrier hybrid, a ship with incredible firepower and HP, astounding speed and maneuverability for it's size, the ability to launch whole wings of advanced Fighters or Drones, and a super weapon capable of destroying whole groups of ships at once. If ships like this were to invade High Sec, I see little hope for the capsuleers in those systems. Even with a fleet of unprecedented size, I don't see High Sec as being defensible. We may wind up seeing whole regions of High Sec, overwhelmed by invading Drifters, being abandoned by capsuleers in favor of refuge in Low and Null Sec systems where Capitals and Super Capitals can be effectively mobilized for defense.

Think about that, a dramatic shift, where the Highest Security space, the "safest" space in Eve, becomes the most dangerous to capsuleers, and Low/Null, perhaps even wormholes, become the one and only refuge for fleeing pilots. Of course, this leaves us another problem, how would we retake High Sec systems from the Drifters, when our only hope (Caps and Supers) are confined to Low/Null?

Of course, this is merely speculation, we have no way of predicting what we may encounter once the Drifters mobilize and invade. One thing is for certain, New Eden will be razed to it's very foundation. I believe Trade Hubs like Jita, Dodixie, and Amarr are at the most risk, and their assumed level of Safety will be the death of MANY capsuleers. We may see a "Burn Jita" style event, on a scale the likes of which we could have never imagined, perpetrated by a force far more terrifying and powerful than any one Null Sec Coalition. We must begin preparing immediately, galvanize New Eden and fortify our most valuable systems, or the Drifters will catch us unorganized, disoriented, and completely vulnerable. Now is not the time for idle talks, now is the time for action!

PREPARE! FORTIFY! SURVIVE! This is our only hope!




*This is one part Fan Fiction, one part true speculation. In any case, it is my first time doing any sort of Fan Fiction.
Atomeon
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2015-05-17 21:22:56 UTC
People cant kill a Drifter Battleship and you want Capital Drifters? right

-1
Commander Caesar Koba
Doomheim
#3 - 2015-05-17 21:35:54 UTC
Atomeon wrote:
People cant kill a Drifter Battleship and you want Capital Drifters? right

-1


Dude, its a fictitious article that I wrote up. Calm down.
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#4 - 2015-05-18 01:05:50 UTC
Belongs in an in-character forum, not in F&ID, and does not contain a clear idea or feature.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp

Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#5 - 2015-05-18 01:39:16 UTC
Atomeon wrote:
People cant kill a Drifter Battleship and you want Capital Drifters? right

-1

Other than all the ways in which people do kill drifter battleships If you are going to bash an idea, at least get the facts right to start with.

However -1 to the stealth 'remove highsec and force everyone to play in null under the null lords' idea. High sec is a very important part of the game and anything wrecking it to the extent you are discussing will wreck EVE as well. Areas of space in EVE are different, there is no single 'End game' area like most MMO's.
Commander Caesar Koba
Doomheim
#6 - 2015-05-18 02:26:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Commander Caesar Koba
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Atomeon wrote:
People cant kill a Drifter Battleship and you want Capital Drifters? right

-1

Other than all the ways in which people do kill drifter battleships If you are going to bash an idea, at least get the facts right to start with.

However -1 to the stealth 'remove highsec and force everyone to play in null under the null lords' idea. High sec is a very important part of the game and anything wrecking it to the extent you are discussing will wreck EVE as well. Areas of space in EVE are different, there is no single 'End game' area like most MMO's.


No no no no, you misunderstand, I'm not talking about eliminating High Sec, that's a terrible idea. I'm just talking about the idea of High Sec, generally considered "safe," becoming very dangerous for Capsuleers, for however short a duration. Making players fight to take back systems, specifically Trade Hubs like Jita. Something like that. Last thing I want to do is take away any aspect of the game, or force anyone to do anything.

And James, you're right, this initially started out as a feature or idea post, but morphed into a Fan Fiction post along the way. Apologies m8.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#7 - 2015-05-18 02:44:35 UTC
Pull the other leg with that one....
You posted outright that high sec should become the most dangerous space and players should have to flee into Null.
Don't try and back track like that, we aren't that dumb.
Commander Caesar Koba
Doomheim
#8 - 2015-05-18 03:11:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Commander Caesar Koba
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Pull the other leg with that one....
You posted outright that high sec should become the most dangerous space and players should have to flee into Null.
Don't try and back track like that, we aren't that dumb.


I'm not backtracking, so don't try that. I'm clarifying and elaborating on what I apparently omitted in my original post. It'd be a dramatic shift, turning High Sec into a form of FW, not against other players, but NPCs. And also different from Sansha Incursions. No I am talking about Drifters actively controlling and patrolling space, occupying systems, responding to threats with reinforcement gangs/fleets of Drifter Battleships. Some sort of a concept where you have to push them back from Stargates, Stations, and other high traffic areas, and finally engage them at a central point in the system (whether it be a structure of their own, or one of their Fortified wormholes). This wouldn't be an easy feat like an Incursion, it'd be something that would require x amount of time spent grinding away, dealing with mounting losses and reinforcements, and a great deal of coordination among players. I imagine this as ACTUALLY being a war, where players actually have to form sizable fleets, to retake systems, from the ground up, from a very intelligent and very powerful NPC enemy.

Again. I Do Not Want To Take High Sec Out Of The Game. Just spice it up by temporarily making folks actually fight for it for once, and push the Drifters back through the Space Butthole from whence they came.
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#9 - 2015-05-18 03:34:12 UTC
Commander Caesar Koba wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Pull the other leg with that one....
You posted outright that high sec should become the most dangerous space and players should have to flee into Null.
Don't try and back track like that, we aren't that dumb.


I'm not backtracking, so don't try that. I'm clarifying and elaborating on what I apparently omitted in my original post. It'd be a dramatic shift, turning High Sec into a form of FW, not against other players, but NPCs. And also different from Sansha Incursions. No I am talking about Drifters actively controlling and patrolling space, occupying systems, responding to threats with reinforcement gangs/fleets of Drifter Battleships. Some sort of a concept where you have to push them back from Stargates, Stations, and other high traffic areas, and finally engage them at a central point in the system (whether it be a structure of their own, or one of their Fortified wormholes). This wouldn't be an easy feat like an Incursion, it'd be something that would require x amount of time spent grinding away, dealing with mounting losses and reinforcements, and a great deal of coordination among players. I imagine this as ACTUALLY being a war, where players actually have to form sizable fleets, to retake systems, from the ground up, from a very intelligent and very powerful NPC enemy.

Again. I Do Not Want To Take High Sec Out Of The Game. Just spice it up by temporarily making folks actually fight for it for once, and push the Drifters back through the Space Butthole from whence they came.


I invite you to take on incursions without the support of a community or the knowledge that was hard won as to how to run the sites. They are only "safe" and "easy" because of the great lengths that went to unraveling what needed to be done to complete the sites safely, and then even more laborious process of optimizing the sites for speed that made them as lucrative as they are now.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp

Commander Caesar Koba
Doomheim
#10 - 2015-05-18 03:38:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Commander Caesar Koba
I invite you to take on incursions without the support of a community or the knowledge that was hard won as to how to run the sites. They are only "safe" and "easy" because of the great lengths that went to unraveling what needed to be done to complete the sites safely, and then even more laborious process of optimizing the sites for speed that made them as lucrative as they are now...

I've done my fair share of Incursions in the past, but they were never much fun. Too stale, not dynamic enough. I'm sure in the beginning they were a different animal entirely, but now it's go here, do this list of things, rinse and repeat. Boring. Spice it up. Throw a wrench it the established inner workings of everything in Eve.
Haatakan Reppola
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#11 - 2015-05-18 03:53:52 UTC
Incursion is only safe as long as you pay attention and do exactly what you are expected to do, AND everyone else does what they are expected to do.

Flying a 2-5b ship that rely 100% on others to stay alive, slow broadcast and you can have rest of your fleet in logi's and its still to late
Commander Caesar Koba
Doomheim
#12 - 2015-05-18 04:01:10 UTC
Incursions are still too scripted for me, they aren't as organic and intelligent as what I am talking about.
Haatakan Reppola
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#13 - 2015-05-18 04:04:41 UTC
Commander Caesar Koba wrote:
Incursions are still too scripted for me, they aren't as organic and intelligent as what I am talking about.


Its pretty fluid, but having deadspace tank + logistic ships kinda helps with that.

I suggest you fly T1 ships with t2 modules and t1 rigs, suddenly you have to expect a few deaths for a site
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#14 - 2015-05-18 04:26:37 UTC
Commander Caesar Koba wrote:
Incursions are still too scripted for me, they aren't as organic and intelligent as what I am talking about.



they're about as good as you can get without invoking really nasty spaghetti logic and making the computer an absolutely cheating bastard on the intelligence front. ECM ships have strong affinity for ships with RR going, DPS ships tend to switch onto anything that their frigates report as having bad tank, they focus fire unless something dies and then they spread damage across between 3 and 9 targets, they intelligently kill drones, they have their own logistics (Both maras and intakis rep, but only maras are smart about it), they intelligently use their small active tank, etc. I've seen player groups that can't get it together that well. Oh, and they have modules and stats that players would kill for, like the jams that hit every cycle and the 3k per cycle neuts.

Something more intelligent beats out the intellect of much of the playerbase, and with higher stats on their ships, they're a suicide mission, not content. It would be a scourge of dead ships by the dozens before people just stopped logging in or ran away from such a thing.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp

Commander Caesar Koba
Doomheim
#15 - 2015-05-18 04:27:49 UTC
Still not what I'm talking about. With Incursions you already know what to expect, and what you have to do to win a given site. What I'm talking about is something that changes and adapts moment to moment, that you can't outright predict or plan for to the degree that you can in an Incursion.
Haatakan Reppola
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#16 - 2015-05-18 04:32:32 UTC
Commander Caesar Koba wrote:
Still not what I'm talking about. With Incursions you already know what to expect, and what you have to do to win a given site. What I'm talking about is something that changes and adapts moment to moment, that you can't outright predict or plan for to the degree that you can in an Incursion.


The moment you have that you have an AI that is learning and adapting, something people have tried to make for a realy long time :P

Whatever "unexpected" an AI is coded with, after a few tries people know it and we are back to where we are now
Commander Caesar Koba
Doomheim
#17 - 2015-05-18 04:32:37 UTC
James Baboli wrote:
Commander Caesar Koba wrote:
Incursions are still too scripted for me, they aren't as organic and intelligent as what I am talking about.



they're about as good as you can get without invoking really nasty spaghetti logic and making the computer an absolutely cheating bastard on the intelligence front. ECM ships have strong affinity for ships with RR going, DPS ships tend to switch onto anything that their frigates report as having bad tank, they focus fire unless something dies and then they spread damage across between 3 and 9 targets, they intelligently kill drones, they have their own logistics (Both maras and intakis rep, but only maras are smart about it), they intelligently use their small active tank, etc. I've seen player groups that can't get it together that well. Oh, and they have modules and stats that players would kill for, like the jams that hit every cycle and the 3k per cycle neuts.

Something more intelligent beats out the intellect of much of the playerbase, and with higher stats on their ships, they're a suicide mission, not content. It would be a scourge of dead ships by the dozens before people just stopped logging in or ran away from such a thing.


Call me insane, but THAT is fun to me. Nothing has ever given me more joy in gaming, than FINALLY beating a level or character that I have been stuck on for x amount of time. Drifters are like nothing Eve has seen before, and I have no problem with their AI beating much of the player base, just makes those who rise to the Challenge, and win, that much more incredible.
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#18 - 2015-05-18 04:34:41 UTC
Commander Caesar Koba wrote:
Still not what I'm talking about. With Incursions you already know what to expect, and what you have to do to win a given site. What I'm talking about is something that changes and adapts moment to moment, that you can't outright predict or plan for to the degree that you can in an Incursion.

So, do you make the computer a cheating bastard, or is the content isn't taken from even something as "fixed" as an RNG with a range small enough to eventually find out?

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp

James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#19 - 2015-05-18 04:37:21 UTC
Commander Caesar Koba wrote:


Call me insane, but THAT is fun to me. Nothing has ever given me more joy in gaming, than FINALLY beating a level or character that I have been stuck on for x amount of time. Drifters are like nothing Eve has seen before, and I have no problem with their AI beating much of the player base, just makes those who rise to the Challenge, and win, that much more incredible.


The drifters already are beating the heck out of most of the playerbase, and doing things that are counter to what was documented even the day before. They already appear to be cheating pretty well, but we're starting to get a handle on how to reliably kill them. Content that stays wild and wooly isn't going to happen in eve unless it is so unprofitable to run that no one bothers to figure it out.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp

Commander Caesar Koba
Doomheim
#20 - 2015-05-18 04:50:48 UTC
James Baboli wrote:
Commander Caesar Koba wrote:


Call me insane, but THAT is fun to me. Nothing has ever given me more joy in gaming, than FINALLY beating a level or character that I have been stuck on for x amount of time. Drifters are like nothing Eve has seen before, and I have no problem with their AI beating much of the player base, just makes those who rise to the Challenge, and win, that much more incredible.


The drifters already are beating the heck out of most of the playerbase, and doing things that are counter to what was documented even the day before. They already appear to be cheating pretty well, but we're starting to get a handle on how to reliably kill them. Content that stays wild and wooly isn't going to happen in eve unless it is so unprofitable to run that no one bothers to figure it out.


It's awesome that they are beating the hell out of players! At the moment, we are reliably killing 1-2 of them at a time, with superior numbers, or an overwhelming advantage like range or ECM. Now throw in a Drifter fleet of dozens of Vessels, including vessels we haven't encountered yet with stats and traits we don't know how to counter. Then throw in tactics like ambushing fleets at a stargate, calling in fresh reinforcements, fortified fallback positions to warp to when they have lost a fight, etc. I want something that freely and actively operates throughout an entire system, not just in isolated pockets. Something grand with a LARGE impact on any given patch of space. A tactic that works in one system may be completely obsolete and useless in the next system.
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