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Any news of a Faction Warfare change?
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M0IST FISH
Release the KRAKEN.
#1 - 2015-05-16 10:48:08 UTC
Subject really says it, has their been anything to indicate that Faction Warfare will see a pass in terms of changing capture mechanics?

I ask as i avoid it really, due to the reliance on farming alts which contribute mostly to the capturing mechanics.

For say, if they changed it to rely on the value ship kills or something, with a LP return 90% of the killed ships isk worth for those invovled, with 30% of it going into a pool (similar to ESS), which is released upon capture of the system for offensive fighting, defensive you get all 90%. Once a total pool of destroyed isk has been reached, it would allow the system to be flipped.

I think that mechanic would serve a lot better than orbiting a mark in space.
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
#2 - 2015-05-16 15:00:16 UTC
no news. Ccp is doing nulksec now

how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2015-05-16 16:47:52 UTC
I think at fanfest 2015 there was some talk of eliminating 'teams' (Gal+Min and Cal+Amarr) and possibly reviewing missions, but nothing big.


IMHO, FW is in a pretty good spot at the moment, in terms of capture mechanics.

Farming alts are:
. Very effective for defending systems nobody really wants
. Not very effective for contesting systems, because you really can't o-plex semi-AFK with the new, frequent, NPC respawns
. Pretty much useless for attacking/defending a system that one or both militias care about

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
PlantythePottedPlant
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#4 - 2015-05-16 17:35:51 UTC
If you made the change in the OP, all one would have to do is not lose any ships in the system and it would never be flipped. Why defend if you need to be in the system to lose it?

Either way someone would be better off not being in the system if it's based on the value of ship kills. If it's made to degrade over time, the offenders wouldn't enter the system, if it's just flat ship kill value, the defenders would never enter the system. It would just be a dead system both ways.

At least how it is now, there has to be a ship in the system to o/dplex it, even if half the time it's stabbed. There's still risk and there's still a reason to be there.
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#5 - 2015-05-17 19:46:29 UTC
The mechanics of conquering a system, as stated above, are fine. The inherent value and reward of FW being embodied in those mechanics alone, are not. FW space isn't null but you really should be able to do SOMETHING with the systems you own. Maybe create some one time use LP items that can stir the pot. I.E. - Item X, when cashed in at a station, prevents ANYONE with a negative standing toward your militia to be unable to dock there....
MiningAlt
Caldari Stable
#6 - 2015-05-21 18:06:27 UTC
Wait here, are we playing same game?

Alts are perfect for defensive and offensive afk plexing, everyone does it. You just take drone ship, warp to plex and go afk. Your drones will kill every npc spawn. This tactic is used to plex back end systems a lot.

I say that current FW mechanics promotes AFK playing.

Only solution is complete overhaul of FW plex mechanics and I had some ideas:
1.
LP rewards from plexing would be only in "active" constellations.
Active constellation would have systems belonging to both militias and those that are connected to enemy militia system. Players can plex even in non active constellations, but with no LP gain.

This would solve "farming" problem, because LPs gain would be just in systems with enemy presence so afk farming would be nearly impossible. Plexing in back end systems would be still possible for capturing system, but not for easy LP farming.

2.
Second idea would use same principle of "Active" constellation, but this time plexing could be only in active area and we would have 2 different bars for capturing.

First one: Constellation Contested level - increased by capturing plexes in whole constellation. When the contested level reaches 100% then systems that are connected to enemy militia systems will be open for siege plexing.

Second bar: Siege Progress - same style as we have now, capturing sites in same system will increase its siege progress, and when siege progress hits 100% then militia can shoot ihub and capture system.

When siege progress hits 50% then enemy militia can dock it that system and effect will last as long system is +1% siege progress.

The Constellation Contested level cannot be reduced as long some friendly system has Siege status. Reducing would be done by capturing friendly sites and by passing time as well, so if no enemy militia plexes constellation, then it will "cool down"

I hope some devs will read this and apply some idea .
Moglarr
Operation Meatshield
#7 - 2015-05-21 19:13:53 UTC
MiningAlt wrote:
Wait here, are we playing same game?

Alts are perfect for defensive and offensive afk plexing, everyone does it. You just take drone ship, warp to plex and go afk. Your drones will kill every npc spawn. This tactic is used to plex back end systems a lot.

I say that current FW mechanics promotes AFK playing.

Only solution is complete overhaul of FW plex mechanics and I had some ideas:
1.
LP rewards from plexing would be only in "active" constellations.
Active constellation would have systems belonging to both militias and those that are connected to enemy militia system. Players can plex even in non active constellations, but with no LP gain.

This would solve "farming" problem, because LPs gain would be just in systems with enemy presence so afk farming would be nearly impossible. Plexing in back end systems would be still possible for capturing system, but not for easy LP farming.

2.
Second idea would use same principle of "Active" constellation, but this time plexing could be only in active area and we would have 2 different bars for capturing.

First one: Constellation Contested level - increased by capturing plexes in whole constellation. When the contested level reaches 100% then systems that are connected to enemy militia systems will be open for siege plexing.

Second bar: Siege Progress - same style as we have now, capturing sites in same system will increase its siege progress, and when siege progress hits 100% then militia can shoot ihub and capture system.

When siege progress hits 50% then enemy militia can dock it that system and effect will last as long system is +1% siege progress.

The Constellation Contested level cannot be reduced as long some friendly system has Siege status. Reducing would be done by capturing friendly sites and by passing time as well, so if no enemy militia plexes constellation, then it will "cool down"

I hope some devs will read this and apply some idea .


In all fairness I only skimmed this before going "wat" and replying in broad strokes.

First of all, AFK plexing is hard if you enemy is active within the WZ. Because your alt will die. A lot. Which is cool, because the alt is a tool to achieve an objective.

Now, if your gripe is with AFK alts farming systems no one cares enough to defend, I would point out that no one cares enough to defend those systems so move along.

Something I believe a lot of pilots overlook is that the value of FW space is determined 100% by who lives in it. Yes, some systems can offer more tactical advantages such as ease of supplying, agents for income or ease of power projection. However, if no one lives in that system, or near it, then it isn't a particularly valuable system to actively try to defend or capture which is why it becomes the home of AFK alts and farmers. If you truly desire to change that, then take your corp and plant yourself in that system and claim it as yours! Then crush anyone to tries to refute that claim, or get beaten and move somewhere new. Either way you get get a lot of fights and learn some cool stuff about FW while doing it.

Operation Meatshield! GETUP and fight!
MiningAlt
Caldari Stable
#8 - 2015-05-21 19:18:56 UTC
Moglarr wrote:
MiningAlt wrote:
Wait here, are we playing same game?

Alts are perfect for defensive and offensive afk plexing, everyone does it. You just take drone ship, warp to plex and go afk. Your drones will kill every npc spawn. This tactic is used to plex back end systems a lot.

I say that current FW mechanics promotes AFK playing.

Only solution is complete overhaul of FW plex mechanics and I had some ideas:
1.
LP rewards from plexing would be only in "active" constellations.
Active constellation would have systems belonging to both militias and those that are connected to enemy militia system. Players can plex even in non active constellations, but with no LP gain.

This would solve "farming" problem, because LPs gain would be just in systems with enemy presence so afk farming would be nearly impossible. Plexing in back end systems would be still possible for capturing system, but not for easy LP farming.

2.
Second idea would use same principle of "Active" constellation, but this time plexing could be only in active area and we would have 2 different bars for capturing.

First one: Constellation Contested level - increased by capturing plexes in whole constellation. When the contested level reaches 100% then systems that are connected to enemy militia systems will be open for siege plexing.

Second bar: Siege Progress - same style as we have now, capturing sites in same system will increase its siege progress, and when siege progress hits 100% then militia can shoot ihub and capture system.

When siege progress hits 50% then enemy militia can dock it that system and effect will last as long system is +1% siege progress.

The Constellation Contested level cannot be reduced as long some friendly system has Siege status. Reducing would be done by capturing friendly sites and by passing time as well, so if no enemy militia plexes constellation, then it will "cool down"

I hope some devs will read this and apply some idea .


In all fairness I only skimmed this before going "wat" and replying in broad strokes.

First of all, AFK plexing is hard if you enemy is active within the WZ. Because your alt will die. A lot. Which is cool, because the alt is a tool to achieve an objective.

Now, if your gripe is with AFK alts farming systems no one cares enough to defend, I would point out that no one cares enough to defend those systems so move along.

Something I believe a lot of pilots overlook is that the value of FW space is determined 100% by who lives in it. Yes, some systems can offer more tactical advantages such as ease of supplying, agents for income or ease of power projection. However, if no one lives in that system, or near it, then it isn't a particularly valuable system to actively try to defend or capture which is why it becomes the home of AFK alts and farmers. If you truly desire to change that, then take your corp and plant yourself in that system and claim it as yours! Then crush anyone to tries to refute that claim, or get beaten and move somewhere new. Either way you get get a lot of fights and learn some cool stuff about FW while doing it.



Can I get reply from someone who inst living in 3 system area?
We all know hard is to keep huge areas of systems stable and under control when there are moving groups of stabbed afk farming alts.
My ideas would bring more activity to FW in more enjoyable way.
Nameira Vanis-Tor
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2015-05-21 19:53:52 UTC
Unless the group occupying a system can convincingly cover two out of three timezones then the farmer hordes can evict occupied systems - even if you spend your one active timezone solidly d-plexing you will still lose.

This is why we make an effort to have members and FCs/Officers in all time zones.
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#10 - 2015-05-22 08:58:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Crosi Wesdo
MiningAlt wrote:

Can I get reply from someone who inst living in 3 system area?
We all know hard is to keep huge areas of systems stable and under control when there are moving groups of stabbed afk farming alts.
My ideas would bring more activity to FW in more enjoyable way.


I agree ylien, afk alts are lame. I assume you agree that non afk alts are ok though?

Any response to your 'multiple petitions' against me multiboxing? lol
MiningAlt
Caldari Stable
#11 - 2015-05-22 11:04:09 UTC
And some people actually wonders why is no one posting good ideas about FW changes, when we get trolled all the time.

Agree Crosi, AFK alts are bad, but you need to adjust to current meta if you want to keep systems. No response so far on multiboxing and account sharing :D
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#12 - 2015-05-22 11:47:41 UTC
MiningAlt wrote:
And some people actually wonders why is no one posting good ideas about FW changes, when we get trolled all the time.

Agree Crosi, AFK alts are bad, but you need to adjust to current meta if you want to keep systems. No response so far on multiboxing and account sharing :D


Multiboxing is allowed (almost compulsory) and ive never given any of my account information to another living soul. Please keep telling me about these petitions though, its funny :)

Even funnier since you are posting with an alt of yours Ylien, that you multibox... haha

And far better suggestions have been made in the past to improve quality of life in FW. These are small changes but will be overlooked until CCP come back around to iterate on FW.
Andre Vauban
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2015-05-22 14:35:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Andre Vauban
MiningAlt wrote:

Can I get reply from someone who inst living in 3 system area?
We all know hard is to keep huge areas of systems stable and under control when there are moving groups of stabbed afk farming alts.
My ideas would bring more activity to FW in more enjoyable way.



That is the whole point. If people actually live there, it is a royal PITA to evict them. If nobody lives there, it's easy to take the system. There is no difference between AFK plexing and active plexing a system nobody gives a crap about enough for them to even attempt to try and force you out of the plex.

The system, as is, is actually pretty darn good right now. The only change I think could help a little is the "rollback timer to neutral value" idea where once I force my opponent out of the plex the timer will continue to roll back to a neutral state even if I leave the plex.

Your idea is not good. It is forcing mechanics into a situation that don't need to be there. Your ideas can easily lead to situations where one militia gets the upper hand and the game mechanics make it nigh on impossible for the other militia to stage a come back. Farmers are needed to force the pendulum to swing.

.
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#14 - 2015-05-22 14:59:12 UTC
They kinda half baked the cloak fix. But if they just make it so that the timer ignores ships with cloaks and/or stabs fitted you have everything you need to fix afk farming as a player. Without having to refit for cheesy anti farmer fits.
Thanatos Marathon
Moira.
#15 - 2015-05-22 15:24:03 UTC
Under the current system I'm not even sure we need/want timer rollbacks anymore.

JUSTK is recruiting
Squatdog
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#16 - 2015-05-28 00:25:59 UTC
NO STABS IN PLEXES.































*drops mic and steps away from thread*
BigDaddy Toothbrush
Rapid Withdrawal
Pen Is Out
#17 - 2015-05-28 20:54:30 UTC
Squatdog wrote:
NO STABS IN PLEXES.


*drops mic and steps away from thread*


How would squids get into plexes?
May Arethusa
Junction Systems
#18 - 2015-05-28 21:43:43 UTC
BigDaddy Toothbrush wrote:
Squatdog wrote:
NO STABS IN PLEXES.


*drops mic and steps away from thread*


How would squids get into plexes?


Ventures.
Moglarr
Operation Meatshield
#19 - 2015-05-28 23:10:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Moglarr
BigDaddy Toothbrush wrote:
Squatdog wrote:
NO STABS IN PLEXES.


*drops mic and steps away from thread*


How would squids get into plexes?


Probably in the derp **** I hand out to throw at you guys.

Speaking of throwing pilots and ships at the Gallente, Operation Meatshield is recruiting.

Operation Meatshield! GETUP and fight!
Squatdog
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#20 - 2015-05-30 01:08:01 UTC
BigDaddy Toothbrush wrote:
Squatdog wrote:
NO STABS IN PLEXES.


*drops mic and steps away from thread*


How would Frogs get into plexes?


I don't know, they'd probably have to quit Eve.
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