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From past conversations on the topic, it seems the majority of wormholers are against jump style clones in wormholes but in favor of implant switching at structures.

As for the timers, the challenge for wormholers is that targets are those of opportunity most times. We see this with POCOs quite frequently. Attack one in your home system when you are taking up residence and you will likely be attacked by whoever is in your chain the day the timer expires because they happened to notice the timer going off. The first, second, or third reinforcement timer would have a similar effect on a Citadel. The person who attacked you the first time may not be the person attacking you the second or the timer may draw additional people to the fight possibly making it even harder to win/counter.

Thanks



@Fredric Wolf: Yes but this was because it wasn't relevant to my question. It would solve it, but I'm not sure the WH boys would like it having been resistant to that in the past, but it may be the lesser demon.

I really don't understand the thought process of removing POS towers, you just wasted more time re-animating the forcefields just to remove them from the game. that seems like wasted labor.

One of the best comments in this whole thread was the remark in regards how this all affects those of us who live in wormhole space. "you're not even supposed to be there..."

It is, in fact, part of the reason many of us actually do it. It was never intended, but we do it anyway. So when I see how these fine new structures and functions are going to have to be "shoe-horned" into W-space, I cringe. All of them showing up automaticly on overview and warpable? Did a Dev actually say that?

Clearly, applying these changes in wormhole space wasn't seriously considered as a design parameter.

Having said that, I see a lot of hard work and creativity applied productively to our game, and I applaud that. Dealing with these changes in the coming months will be quite exciting and should be a lot of fun. Thank you CCP! I just hope I can continue to enjoy them from Wormhole space. I am now going to look for some cheese to go with my whine. :)

Uh... hate to burst yer bubble man but due of the Wonder of No Damned Sov Crap plus Wormhole Spawning Mechanics... one hell of a LOT of the corps in low to mid range holes are really small to middlin sized corps... and yes, some are even OMCs with an army of alts...and in those if the Account owner aint logged on, aint NO ONE logged on...

This "I ass-u-me" of yours will live up to it's name and screw really small gangs in low class holes... Hell I'm in a middling sized corp (wayyyy moar alts then living players) and half the time I'm logged on alone... with no back up and none to jabber in... add to this that our small number of players are spread from New Zealand all the long way round to the west coast of the US... well, life aint easy in holes... and from the sound of the above, ya'll are about to make it quite a bit tougher for small groups in Anoikis...

You really need to look long and hard at how this is all gonna affect SMALL gang/corp gameplay and life in Anoikis if you don't wanna accidentally screw us hard... if you really do want to live up to the promise made here... Let’s Talk About Emergence.

Hmmmm.... lessee...

(1) [best] old saved BM from any completed exploration site/old wormhole/etc. will normally put you randomly approx 4 to 8 AU off a planet and often well above or below the ecliptic...

(2) [2nd best] ever heard of creating a Static Safe Spot? Pick the 3 warpables farthest apart in any system, drop a BM approx halfway between 2 of them, then drop a BM approx halfway between that BM and the third warpable... you are not on ANY std. warp lane.

Done.

No, not directly warpable... as a matter of fact that, directly warpable, breaks W-space a little bit... but structures absolutely MUST be on Dscan. Other wise you force a scout to have no choice but to pop combat probes to "see" if there are POSes in a system and doing so 100% alerts the residents to the scouts presence... this would be a form of 'local' in that you would always see if a cloaky was scouting your hole or they would see you if you were scouting someone elses and this breaks how cloaky scouting works in Anoikis.

What we do now is use Dsscan to narrow a POS down to 5% and then we know which Planet and Moon it is at and can scout if we want to risk a decloak trap. But at least the cloaky scout can serve his purpose, gather intel while cloaked. This is gameplay as old as holes and should not be fukked with.

Still 2-D with no sense of freedom.



The point is not landing on them without Combats, but that most of these structures deposited in this way will be within very small margin from all of the warp lanes and on the same plane.

Relative to the distances we have in most systems and the ship warp speeds, it is very close - breaks immersion.

Even in systems that have warpables, such as gates, 50 AU away perpendicular to plane of the solar system - that is only one object to work with, and even then if there is no second one located in a similar manner, you will end up with location that is on the warp path.

Option 1) is not on the warp lanes, but still very close and is on the same plane.
Option 2) is not on the same plane, but most likely on a significant warp path in such systems.

TL;DR Temporary exploration sites.

But this isn't a sov mechanic; or at least not specifically. It's the structure capture mechanic. The same mechanic will be used in unclaimable NPC space, as well as sov null. Wormhole space works the same as everywhere else when it comes to capturing structures today - why should it work differently going forward?

Now, if you want to address the problems with the mechanics as a whole, keeping in mind that the structure capture mechanics will be universally the same going forward, just as they are today, that's fine. But don't expect your use case to be the special snowflake because it's inconvenient. Guess what - lowsec guys will have the same issues you do, just with more local so the trollceptor knows when no one is around with 100% accuracy.

FWIW, I agree that structures should have a limited capability to defend themselves just as POSes do today. A skilled lone pilot, or a determined fleet of them will still be able to entosis you by staying ahead of the weapons, but your casuals are probably going to look for easy pickings, just like today.

However, giving them self defense adds in some new considerations - how close can we put them to gates or stations? Lining one up on the undock of an NPC station and then letting it take potshots at people until they can bring it down is an even larger trolling issue than the one you're describing. You have to look at the whole mechanic, not just your slice of it.