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[June] [Updated] Module Tiericide - Afterburners & Microwarpdrives

First post First post
Author
Iroquoiss Pliskin
9B30FF Labs
#241 - 2015-05-05 18:57:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Iroquoiss Pliskin
In an OGB world, it would be reasonable now to reduce all MWD speed values across the board by 50, or other similar figure - the choice du jour is either an MWD, or an over-sized AB, rarely do appropriately-sized Afterburners get into that equation, because they are not competitive enough.

http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/need-for-speed/

Quote:
2007-02-15 15:01 By CCP Tuxford

Why don't we like people going really really fast
One of the biggest reasons is the "feel" of the game. Combat in EVE was always supposed to be more about tactics and strategy rather than twitch movement. I know a lot of the community enjoy that style of gameplay but it just isn't EVE.


Where's CCP TomB when you need him. vOv

Smile
Zappity
Kurved Trading
#242 - 2015-05-05 19:17:02 UTC
Why not just nerf speed links now if they are admitted to be a key problem?

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.

Iroquoiss Pliskin
9B30FF Labs
#243 - 2015-05-05 19:30:22 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Why not just nerf speed links now if they are admitted to be a key problem?


Then the whole concept will need to be reviewed with respect to other bonuses. Smile

Here's a point-by-point disambiguation article by Suitonia on the matter - https://suitonia.wordpress.com/2015/04/19/6/
Arla Sarain
#244 - 2015-05-05 19:31:14 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Why not just nerf speed links now if they are admitted to be a key problem?

Kinda wish they just dunked speed all together.

+70% for ABs and 140% for MWDs (and lower sig bloom). But that would require reducing range of a lot of things.
Zappity
Kurved Trading
#245 - 2015-05-05 19:37:27 UTC
Iroquoiss Pliskin wrote:
Zappity wrote:
Why not just nerf speed links now if they are admitted to be a key problem?


Then the whole concept will need to be reviewed with respect to other bonuses. Smile

Here's a point-by-point disambiguation article by Suitonia on the matter - https://suitonia.wordpress.com/2015/04/19/6/

I love the picture in the article - ships hugging the station. Please give links a weapons timer to stop gate and station hugging.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.

Iroquoiss Pliskin
9B30FF Labs
#246 - 2015-05-05 19:40:09 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Iroquoiss Pliskin wrote:
Zappity wrote:
Why not just nerf speed links now if they are admitted to be a key problem?


Then the whole concept will need to be reviewed with respect to other bonuses. Smile

Here's a point-by-point disambiguation article by Suitonia on the matter - https://suitonia.wordpress.com/2015/04/19/6/

I love the picture in the article - ships hugging the station.


Probably hostile to each other too. P
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#247 - 2015-05-05 19:46:19 UTC
Iroquoiss Pliskin wrote:
In an OGB world, it would be reasonable now to reduce all MWD values across the board by 50, or other similar figure - the choice du jour is either an MWD, or an over-sized AB, rarely do appropriately-sized Afterburners get into that equation, because they are not competitive enough.

http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/need-for-speed/

Quote:
2007-02-15 15:01 By CCP Tuxford

Why don't we like people going really really fast
One of the biggest reasons is the "feel" of the game. Combat in EVE was always supposed to be more about tactics and strategy rather than twitch movement. I know a lot of the community enjoy that style of gameplay but it just isn't EVE.


Where's CCP TomB when you need him. vOv

Smile


8 years on .. none of those things were implemented .. poor amarr...

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using

Soleil Fournier
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#248 - 2015-05-05 20:43:42 UTC
The last thing MWDs need is a speed boost. MWDs are all ready a requirement for most ships in most situations, which doesn't give us a choice when fitting. It's either use a MWD or suffer the concequences.

MWDs need a nerf, ABs need a small buff.
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#249 - 2015-05-05 20:50:23 UTC
we shouldn't have too fly sansha ships too get decent use out of AB's

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using

Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#250 - 2015-05-05 20:50:32 UTC
The meat and potatos value changes i'll take a wait and see attitude but the 500 word long names are **** right out of the box. Keep the names that mean something like 'enduring', 'compact' and 'restrained' and dump the rest of the title changes.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.

Oktura Ostus
THE CORP WITH NO NAME
#251 - 2015-05-05 21:02:20 UTC
Soleil Fournier wrote:
MWDs need a nerf, ABs need a small buff.


I don't understand. One day they say 10mn AB svipul is overpowered, please nerf it. In another day they say AB need small buff. If CCP buff it, then we will ask to nerf svipuls again?

Everything has own role now:
MWD - null sec PvP.
AB - low sec FW PvP, PvE
oversized AB: for pew-pew-how-to-turn-this-brick PvP

Why do you think it should be fixed? Imho, having huge signature, hence more incoming dps, and at the same time having risk to be scrambled and stopped is a fair price for speed bost from mwd.
Iroquoiss Pliskin
9B30FF Labs
#252 - 2015-05-05 21:54:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Iroquoiss Pliskin
Harvey James wrote:
Iroquoiss Pliskin wrote:
In an OGB world, it would be reasonable now to reduce all MWD values across the board by 50, or other similar figure - the choice du jour is either an MWD, or an over-sized AB, rarely do appropriately-sized Afterburners get into that equation, because they are not competitive enough.

http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/need-for-speed/

Quote:
2007-02-15 15:01 By CCP Tuxford

Why don't we like people going really really fast
One of the biggest reasons is the "feel" of the game. Combat in EVE was always supposed to be more about tactics and strategy rather than twitch movement. I know a lot of the community enjoy that style of gameplay but it just isn't EVE.


Where's CCP TomB when you need him. vOv

Smile


8 years on .. none of those things were implemented .. poor amarr...


"It seems blatantly obvious that they should get bonus to capacitor warfare." --- Happened.\0/

Armour EM resistances actually were reduced from 60% to 50% since those stagnant times. Smile Khanid MK2 also implemented I think, but overall yes, lack of brawling engagements is disappointing today.

Mass-reducing modules were done away with, along with new stacking penalties introduced for speed mods.

RIP Nanuphoon Cry
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#253 - 2015-05-05 21:58:11 UTC
Am i get it right, would new Meta levels added?

-1 if it so.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP

Liam Inkuras
Furnace
Thermodynamics
#254 - 2015-05-05 22:47:46 UTC
Looks great, but death to speed creep, seriously please do not buff MWD speed boost percentages. Nerf them if anything

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone

Suitonia
V0LTA
WE FORM V0LTA
#255 - 2015-05-05 23:41:11 UTC
What about Nerfing Rapid Deployment ganglink by 10%? This will more or less cancel out the MWD speed increase on the highest tier. I know this is no-where close to what links need, but would be a good start anyway.

Rapid Deployment II from 7% to 6.3%

Contributer to Eve is Easy:  https://www.youtube.com/user/eveiseasy/videos

Solo PvP is possible with a 20 day old character! :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvOB4KXYk-o

Skir Skor
Stay Frosty.
A Band Apart.
#256 - 2015-05-05 23:50:55 UTC
Links do not neeed a light touch here and there but a major revamp.

I'm all in favour of Rapid Deployment II dropping from 7% to 6.3% but I'd rather CCP did the job in one big update rather than "fixing" it piece by piece due to a few complaints in a forum thread.
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#257 - 2015-05-06 00:18:35 UTC
Skir Skor wrote:
Links do not neeed a light touch here and there but a major revamp.

I'm all in favour of Rapid Deployment II dropping from 7% to 6.3% but I'd rather CCP did the job in one big update rather than "fixing" it piece by piece due to a few complaints in a forum thread.


part of the problem with links are the big bonuses given by skills and implants rather than by ships or mods.

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using

Stitch Kaneland
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#258 - 2015-05-06 01:14:48 UTC
Oktura Ostus wrote:
Soleil Fournier wrote:
MWDs need a nerf, ABs need a small buff.


I don't understand. One day they say 10mn AB svipul is overpowered, please nerf it. In another day they say AB need small buff. If CCP buff it, then we will ask to nerf svipuls again?

Everything has own role now:
MWD - null sec PvP.
AB - low sec FW PvP, PvE
oversized AB: for pew-pew-how-to-turn-this-brick PvP

Why do you think it should be fixed? Imho, having huge signature, hence more incoming dps, and at the same time having risk to be scrambled and stopped is a fair price for speed bost from mwd.


The answer you are looking for, is in the second sentence you typed.

Quote:
One day they say 10mn AB svipul is overpowered, please nerf it. In another day they say AB need small buff.


10mn. A prop mod class higher than its intended class range. A 1mn Svipul is vastly inferior to a 10mn svipul. 10mn give you close to 1mn MWD speed, without the sig bloom, and make you immune to scrams. And sometimes, is more cap efficient than the MWD equivalent. Yea, you get the big agility nerf, but it normally can be countered pretty easily in the fit, or with implants/links.

Your view on how prop mods work is very limited. An AB in nullsec can make you extremely hard to kill (if flown right), but is best paired with a MWD. MWD for speed, AB for range control once scrammed.

MWD in LS when setup for kiting, can make for a lot of easy kills against a/b fit frigs/cruisers. Yea, its risky if you do get scrammed, but, that's why you have neuts or web.
Mario Putzo
#259 - 2015-05-06 02:26:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Mario Putzo
That 500mn MWD Proph tho.
Iyacia Cyric'ai
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#260 - 2015-05-06 05:28:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Iyacia Cyric'ai
I really, strongly dislike the MWD changes. This creates tiers if anything. Also indirectly giving frigates and cruisers more speed is just... really? Why not just delete battlecruisers and battleships from the game?

All the MWD line really needs is:

Tech 1: Cheap
Meta A: Easy to fit
Meta B: Lower sig bloom penalty
Tech 2: Lower cap penalty (much lower than currently as right now the higher activation cost negates the lower cap penalty benefit, hence why no one really uses T2)