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EVE Online and EYE strain...

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Azami Nevinyrall
172.0.0.1
#1 - 2015-05-01 00:41:22 UTC
A little background here.

Been playing EVE for years with no problems. (Health wise.)

A few months ago after a 3 day EVE "marathon" I suffered a serious headache that could've been easily mistaken for something very serious! Several doctors and plenty of pokey, stabby, tests later, turns out to be EYE strain. (as headache in question happened almost immediately after logging off EVE.)

Spend a good 2 hours with my new optometrist getting every test under the sun. Turns out I need glasses and staring at my monitor gave me the gift of far siteiness. So I basically took several months off video-games and in particular EVE. Slowly started coming back to games and back into EVE. Recently the headaches have come back aswell, so I make the necessary changes to my office. To help reduce strain. Proper lighting, seating, new monitor, removed any stimulants from my diet. (giving up caffeine cold turkey is painful!) but still, it creeps up on me.

I mainly have issues with EVE......mainly the UI.

So, my question is this, has anyone had similar issues dealing with this?

If so, how did you solve it?



Yes I have filed a petition, I obviously cannot post what was said. This thread should give an idea how that went.

I only have this problem with EVE.

Before anyone asks, it's nothing serious, I was thoroughly................probed

...
Commissar Kate
Kesukka
#2 - 2015-05-01 00:51:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Commissar Kate
I have had problems with eye strain on certain monitors, just not on eve but everything. I had to return a pair of monitors 6 months ago due to it.

I found out that certain LED backlit monitors are the offender here. In order to dim them they actually flicker on and off very fast and that can cause eyestrain and was exactly what happened to me. I'm back on my old flicker free CCFL backlit monitors and have had no problems since. I'm still kinda hesitant get a new pair even though I'm desperate for something with more resolution than what I have now.

I have also learned that some monitor companies have taken notice of this such as BenQ and are manufacturing monitors specifically to reduce eye strain with flicker free and low blue light.

This is a good place to start for flicker free monitors http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/flicker_free_database.htm

-k8

My Fanclub
Azami Nevinyrall
172.0.0.1
#3 - 2015-05-01 01:12:24 UTC
Thanks!

I'll look into that!

It looks like both my monitors aren't on that magical list. Which is a shame....

...
Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#4 - 2015-05-01 07:46:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Bagrat Skalski
Quote:
far siteiness

With time the hyperopia can be a problem. When its small, younger people don't suffer as much from it.
Quote:
my monitor gave me the gift of far siteiness

Rather your parents.

Custom ship skins, character creator style "repaint". Bring it!
Hani Tian
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2015-05-01 09:15:43 UTC
Uhm.. Maybe for a start, i would never play for 3 days straight..
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#6 - 2015-05-01 11:32:48 UTC
If you want to strain your eyes even less you can try f.lux as well.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#7 - 2015-05-03 10:13:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
My eyes get dry or watery if I have uneven lighting from opposite sides of me. Not sure what exactly it is, but with so many monitors in my face, I can't have something bright (like a full-white windows explorer) off to one side while I'm staring at something dark.

I use autohotkey and a script that is bound to increasing transparency of the selected window a small percentage per key press. It works on most programs, including EVE. It lets me do this. http://i.imgur.com/KbsMWik.jpg The percentage is 16 or something like that, and it's a one-way cycle to increased transparency back to full brightness. Some windows need to be brought down more than others, so I have the transparency incremented. You can set it by editing the script.

Even the same window can need different amounts of dimming, based on the context of the other things around it. I'm constantly adjusting the brightness of everything on my desktop. It also works on desktop itself, and brings down the brightness of all the icons.

Light sources in general, and not just what's on your computer, can affect your eyes. If you have light flooding into the room from one side, like from a window, that's a big one and happens a lot. The shot of CCP customer service in this dev blog is a great example of uneven lighting http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/a-call-to-art-decorating-the-ccp-office/ In environments like that, you want to balance the light by facing toward it or away from it. Uneven from front to back is OK, uneven from left to right is bad.

It also sucks to stare at a relatively dim screen against a bright background, again like a window. Or computer screen glare, with a glossy screen and a light source behind you. There's a lot to think about when it comes to lighting. (glossy screens are better for image quality, but the downside is reflection. tradeoffs.)

The default Sansha forum background that my browser keeps reverting to, also sucks for being unevenly lit on either side http://i.imgur.com/3u725vl.jpg

Something to think about is your experience as a computer user. Chances are there is an improvement to make by personalizing it for your comfort. Out of the box, you get things designed for no one in particular.

this is a tangent now, but always reconsider "conventional." That computer systems come with just one monitor is a big one. That's done a lot to hurt people's productivity. That's how computers come, so people think that's how it should be... for me, working on one monitor is like working through a keyhole. anyway

I'm not sure about the belief that staring at computers causes far/nearsightedness. your body wears over time, and it's possible your eyes were going to get weaker anyway. When an opthalmologist looks at your maculae, they can tell you if there are signs of issues in the future. I've had a lot of flight medicine attention for my eyes, having been an air traffic controller and a flight student (both in the military)... my vision is 20/10 or 20/13 depending on the testing method, but I already know I'll have issues in my right eye later on in life.

It wouldn't make sense for me to live 30, 40, 50 years of my life doing all kinds of things and then blame changes in my eyesight on computer screens or the viewing distance. You can hurt your body (including your eyes) with a bad diet, too. I'm not saying this is what you do, but living on doritos and mountain dew is probably a bad way to maintain your health.

lastly, "looking at the computer screen will hurt your eyes" sounds like my parents... congratulations.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#8 - 2015-05-04 00:01:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
There was so much to cover, I forgot something.

The lens of the eye is an automatic lens that works to bring images into focus. The iris is an aperture that responds to light levels. You say it's only EVE that causes strain, and I think it's worth exploring the reason more. EVE is pretty dark, and while you're in a light environment, your iris is small in response to a lot of light, while you're focused on a dark client. I think this conflict is a possible cause too, even if light sources are balanced between both eyes.

Other than that is the viewing distance, and that's not just because of EVE. Any time you spend at that computer contributes to that issue. If that's going to be a problem, it's unavoidable. How much time do you spend focused on things that are at arms reach or closer, I'm guessing a lot, when it's anything you're doing with your hands.

I think it's far more important to shield your eyes from UV while you're out. I hardly allow myself to drive around / walk around outside without Oakley shades with polarized lenses. Even when the sky is overcast. I don't think computer time is anything to worry about, and I think protecting your eyes from sunlight is much more important. That type of thing definitely adds up, and it can be helped.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#9 - 2015-05-04 12:07:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
Images in your browser can be difficult to look at due to the white background. There are browser plugins that can help with increasing readability.

in Google Chrome, one option is the plugin High Contrast

When an image like this one is unreadable due to the white background, you can adjust it like this

Another plugin is BackgroundSkin

You can adjust the white background using a color picker and opacity slider. adjustment 1 adjustment 2

I have both plugins because the logic they use to change colors is different. High Contrast makes more sweeping adjustments than Backgroundskin, but BackgroundSkin has some simpler features that High Contrast lacks. The color that needs to be adjusted is different for virtually every website.

They also keep track of settings for websites. Leaving BackgroundSkin set to black for i.imgur is kind of nice.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Eurydia Vespasian
Storm Hunters
#10 - 2015-05-04 13:24:29 UTC
Eve would give anybody a headache. I get one just looking at the icon on the desktop
Commissar Kate
Kesukka
#11 - 2015-05-04 15:03:29 UTC
Well then just delete the icon.

-k8

My Fanclub
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#12 - 2015-05-04 16:28:15 UTC
I'm not a doctor, but I was a medic. And a mechanic. And now an artist. This topic was a pretty good blend of the things I've done out of personal interest.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#13 - 2015-05-05 16:31:06 UTC
11 year eve vet, i suffer form tention headaches as well as eye strain.

Tention headachs i fix with deep tissue massage, but thats a different thread.

My eye strain.. i have issues where if i go to a theader and watch a movie thats longer then 2 hours i'd devlope a mild headach. If i happen to theader hop, or even paid to see another movies or did a marathon. i would have a server headache due to eye strain. If i played eve or anything on my pc longer then 5 hours in a day i would have a combination tention headach and eye strain headache, both very annoying.

My fix was stupid simple. I suffer from light sensitivity, like really bad. So bad that having an eye exame is pretty much tortcher. So i heard about a pair of gaming glasses. And decided to try them. I found an eye doc that sold them (i need RX) and bought a pair. they cost me ~250 after insurence, and took about 2 weeks to get used to. but with them, i no longe rhave eye strain. no headaches, no nothing. I can sit through three movies at the drive in and be fine, where as about 1/2 way through #2 i'd need a break.

Check out Gunner Optiks they did wonder for me, you can buy a non rx pair for like $80 and try them out. They are my day to day glasses, and i swear by them

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#14 - 2015-05-06 15:06:28 UTC
Commissar Kate wrote:
I have had problems with eye strain on certain monitors, just not on eve but everything. I had to return a pair of monitors 6 months ago due to it.

I found out that certain LED backlit monitors are the offender here. In order to dim them they actually flicker on and off very fast and that can cause eyestrain and was exactly what happened to me. I'm back on my old flicker free CCFL backlit monitors and have had no problems since. I'm still kinda hesitant get a new pair even though I'm desperate for something with more resolution than what I have now.

I have also learned that some monitor companies have taken notice of this such as BenQ and are manufacturing monitors specifically to reduce eye strain with flicker free and low blue light.

This is a good place to start for flicker free monitors http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/flicker_free_database.htm


this.

im a designer and gamer so i spend about 15+ hours at a screen each day, i use dell monitors which are made for designers etc which are alot easier on my eyes, these monitors tend to have matt not glossy screens (dell u2410 monitors can be bought for very cheap these days)

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#15 - 2015-05-07 01:59:02 UTC
DaReaper wrote:
11 year eve vet, i suffer form tention headaches as well as eye strain.

Tention headachs i fix with deep tissue massage, but thats a different thread.

My eye strain.. i have issues where if i go to a theader and watch a movie thats longer then 2 hours i'd devlope a mild headach. If i happen to theader hop, or even paid to see another movies or did a marathon. i would have a server headache due to eye strain. If i played eve or anything on my pc longer then 5 hours in a day i would have a combination tention headach and eye strain headache, both very annoying.

My fix was stupid simple. I suffer from light sensitivity, like really bad. So bad that having an eye exame is pretty much tortcher. So i heard about a pair of gaming glasses. And decided to try them. I found an eye doc that sold them (i need RX) and bought a pair. they cost me ~250 after insurence, and took about 2 weeks to get used to. but with them, i no longe rhave eye strain. no headaches, no nothing. I can sit through three movies at the drive in and be fine, where as about 1/2 way through #2 i'd need a break.

Check out Gunner Optiks they did wonder for me, you can buy a non rx pair for like $80 and try them out. They are my day to day glasses, and i swear by them

Are those for real? I always pass them at Frys and wonder what the world is coming to. Are you saying they're legit?

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Jenshae Chiroptera
#16 - 2015-05-07 11:02:36 UTC
Strain with muscles / repeated movements
(There is a lot of drag and drop that is unnessary in EVE)

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#17 - 2015-05-08 03:56:15 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
DaReaper wrote:
11 year eve vet, i suffer form tention headaches as well as eye strain.

Tention headachs i fix with deep tissue massage, but thats a different thread.

My eye strain.. i have issues where if i go to a theader and watch a movie thats longer then 2 hours i'd devlope a mild headach. If i happen to theader hop, or even paid to see another movies or did a marathon. i would have a server headache due to eye strain. If i played eve or anything on my pc longer then 5 hours in a day i would have a combination tention headach and eye strain headache, both very annoying.

My fix was stupid simple. I suffer from light sensitivity, like really bad. So bad that having an eye exame is pretty much tortcher. So i heard about a pair of gaming glasses. And decided to try them. I found an eye doc that sold them (i need RX) and bought a pair. they cost me ~250 after insurence, and took about 2 weeks to get used to. but with them, i no longe rhave eye strain. no headaches, no nothing. I can sit through three movies at the drive in and be fine, where as about 1/2 way through #2 i'd need a break.

Check out Gunner Optiks they did wonder for me, you can buy a non rx pair for like $80 and try them out. They are my day to day glasses, and i swear by them

Are those for real? I always pass them at Frys and wonder what the world is coming to. Are you saying they're legit?



yes very legit

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#18 - 2015-05-16 11:30:50 UTC
This is the transparency script for Autohotkey


    #T::
    DetectHiddenWindows, on
    WinGet, curtrans, Transparent, A
    if ! curtrans
        curtrans = 255
    newtrans := curtrans - 28
    if newtrans > 0
    {
        WinSet, Transparent, %newtrans%, A

    }
    else
    {
        WinSet, Transparent, 255, A
        WinSet, Transparent, OFF, A
    }
    return

    #w::
    DetectHiddenWindows, on
    WinSet, TransColor, Black 128, A
    return

    #o::
    WinSet, Transparent, 255, A
    WinSet, Transparent, OFF, A
    return

    #g::  ; Press Win+G to show the current settings of the window under the mouse.
    MouseGetPos,,, MouseWin
    WinGet, Transparent, Transparent, ahk_id %MouseWin%
    WinGet, TransColor, TransColor, ahk_id %MouseWin%
    ToolTip Translucency:`t%Transparent%`nTransColor:`t%TransColor%
    return



The number you want to edit is 

    newtrans := curtrans - 28


Full brightness is 255. Each press of the hotkey subtracts 28 from 255 with that setting. 28 is the increment.

"#" denotes the windows key, and the letter following it is the key for the combination. You can change that too.

#T = Windows Key + T, and something like #Y = Windows Key + Y, etc.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Commissar Kate
Kesukka
#19 - 2015-05-16 16:46:47 UTC
I have also found that super high DPI screens are also easier much easier on the eyes. Small 1440p and 4k (ideally) screens are amazingly easy on the eyes.

-k8

My Fanclub
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
#20 - 2015-05-16 17:26:46 UTC
I had eye strain as a kid, that caused severe headaches. Back then it was from school work and reading books. I loved books. (and still do) I grew out of that, and had amazing eyesight for most of my life, but as I get older, the headaches are starting to return.
I have been aware of my 'time limit at the computer' for about 3 years now.
Eyestrain + corporate or in game tension is real.

+1 for the thread in general
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