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[April] Ore, Mineral and Nullsec Mining Anomaly Revamp

First post First post First post
Author
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#701 - 2015-04-26 06:38:54 UTC
Zemfadel wrote:
This still doesn't fix the reason no one mines...

theoretical max isk/hour mining would be MAYBE 60M with these changes, so actual would be something closer to 30M and you would need minimum of 6 people mining at once (4 miners, hauler, booster).

You can pretty easily make 60M/hour ratting (iirc, it's been a while since i ratted) solo with generally the same risk and slightly less boringness.

If you want people to mine in null you can't have an alternative that has similar risk, is more entertaining, and nets you double the profit... You have to either increase the profit or decrease the risk relative to ratting

No matter what changes you make, mining will always be subject to market forces and driven down to whatever level it settles at.

And plenty of people mine. It's exactly the reason mining has its lower income rates.
marly cortez
Mercurialis Inc.
The Bastion
#702 - 2015-04-26 08:54:24 UTC
Gave up on mining in December, un-subbed ten accounts and trashed the equipment due to CCP's ham fisted nerf's.

Nothing here entices me to consider mining as a profession again, Tinkering with Ore contents which were never the real issues with mining in the first place will not solve the problems as pointed out by Our Anzac member.

'FozzieSov' and his 'Tosser' units will in my view seal the fate of Null Sec mining anyway as there will be so few players in Null Sec doing anything interesting except 'Griefing' each other his plans to turn EVE into one gigantic Jita 4-4 undock scenario will result in only one end, Players will own nothing, build nothing and plan nothing in Null Sec so not much point in mining out there.

Happy now to just run two toons ratting, make double plus the ISK and not have the bother of running a mining fleet at all while I watch these fools trash the game for hundreds of players.

Way to Go Fozzie, LoSec born and bred. Roll

Humanity is the thin veneer that remains after you remove the baffled chimp.

Mario Putzo
#703 - 2015-04-26 13:02:33 UTC
Zemfadel wrote:
This still doesn't fix the reason no one mines...

theoretical max isk/hour mining would be MAYBE 60M with these changes, so actual would be something closer to 30M and you would need minimum of 6 people mining at once (4 miners, hauler, booster).

You can pretty easily make 60M/hour ratting (iirc, it's been a while since i ratted) solo with generally the same risk and slightly less boringness.

If you want people to mine in null you can't have an alternative that has similar risk, is more entertaining, and nets you double the profit... You have to either increase the profit or decrease the risk relative to ratting


The fun thing about mining for profit is the more people that do it, the less profitable it becomes. Yay markets!
GankYou
9B30FF Labs
#704 - 2015-04-26 13:16:23 UTC  |  Edited by: GankYou
marly cortez wrote:
Gave up on mining in December, un-subbed ten accounts and trashed the equipment due to CCP's ham fisted nerf's.


You mean, ISBoxer ban, darling?

Don't be hurt. Sad

See what happens when bots run wild on the Eve server Serenity - https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4990317

Only the bots and people who sell their PLEX, or RMT to do PvP are left in the game, no human is seen doing any PvE, and everything is 3-10x times more expensive.

Incidentally, that thread was posted on Sept of 2014, and let run to 6 pages. Smile
Alavaria Fera
Imperial Shipment
#705 - 2015-04-26 13:17:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Alavaria Fera
marly cortez wrote:
Gave up on mining in December, un-subbed ten accounts and trashed the equipment due to CCP's ham fisted nerf's.

Nothing here entices me to consider mining as a profession again, Tinkering with Ore contents which were never the real issues with mining in the first place will not solve the problems as pointed out by Our Anzac member.

'FozzieSov' and his 'Tosser' units will in my view seal the fate of Null Sec mining anyway as there will be so few players in Null Sec doing anything interesting except 'Griefing' each other his plans to turn EVE into one gigantic Jita 4-4 undock scenario will result in only one end, Players will own nothing, build nothing and plan nothing in Null Sec so not much point in mining out there.

Happy now to just run two toons ratting, make double plus the ISK and not have the bother of running a mining fleet at all while I watch these fools trash the game for hundreds of players.

Way to Go Fozzie, LoSec born and bred. Roll

Don't worry.

Once the ihubs get trashed your ratting income will fall off a cliff

Or perhaps another anom nerf, thanks to all the people bragging about their ratting

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#706 - 2015-04-26 17:54:20 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
marly cortez wrote:
Gave up on mining in December, un-subbed ten accounts and trashed the equipment due to CCP's ham fisted nerf's.

Nothing here entices me to consider mining as a profession again, Tinkering with Ore contents which were never the real issues with mining in the first place will not solve the problems as pointed out by Our Anzac member.

'FozzieSov' and his 'Tosser' units will in my view seal the fate of Null Sec mining anyway as there will be so few players in Null Sec doing anything interesting except 'Griefing' each other his plans to turn EVE into one gigantic Jita 4-4 undock scenario will result in only one end, Players will own nothing, build nothing and plan nothing in Null Sec so not much point in mining out there.

Happy now to just run two toons ratting, make double plus the ISK and not have the bother of running a mining fleet at all while I watch these fools trash the game for hundreds of players.

Way to Go Fozzie, LoSec born and bred. Roll

Don't worry.

Once the ihubs get trashed your ratting income will fall off a cliff

Or perhaps another anom nerf, thanks to all the people bragging about their ratting


Don't forget that the IHubs also have the industrial upgrades too, and most null systems don't spawn the ABCM ores in the normal belts.

Yay, Fozziesov! Pirate

"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka 

Teckos Pech
Patriotic Tendencies
Goonswarm Federation
#707 - 2015-04-27 04:48:51 UTC
Rowells wrote:
Zemfadel wrote:
This still doesn't fix the reason no one mines...

theoretical max isk/hour mining would be MAYBE 60M with these changes, so actual would be something closer to 30M and you would need minimum of 6 people mining at once (4 miners, hauler, booster).

You can pretty easily make 60M/hour ratting (iirc, it's been a while since i ratted) solo with generally the same risk and slightly less boringness.

If you want people to mine in null you can't have an alternative that has similar risk, is more entertaining, and nets you double the profit... You have to either increase the profit or decrease the risk relative to ratting

No matter what changes you make, mining will always be subject to market forces and driven down to whatever level it settles at.

And plenty of people mine. It's exactly the reason mining has its lower income rates.


I was going to respond...but this is more than sufficient.

Okay, I will add that if JFs get nerfed and null corps, alliances and coalitions become more concentrated then there will need to be more income generation that simply ratting. If all the sanctums and havens and such are full...maybe go get out your mining ships instead and kill a few mining anoms.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

Teckos Pech
Patriotic Tendencies
Goonswarm Federation
#708 - 2015-04-27 04:50:22 UTC
GankYou wrote:
marly cortez wrote:
Gave up on mining in December, un-subbed ten accounts and trashed the equipment due to CCP's ham fisted nerf's.


You mean, ISBoxer ban, darling?

Don't be hurt. Sad

See what happens when bots run wild on the Eve server Serenity - https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4990317

Only the bots and people who sell their PLEX, or RMT to do PvP are left in the game, no human is seen doing any PvE, and everything is 3-10x times more expensive.

Incidentally, that thread was posted on Sept of 2014, and let run to 6 pages. Smile


Yes, the ISBoxer ban (well the limited ban that is).

Don't try using logic with the overly emotional it rarely works.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

GankYou
9B30FF Labs
#709 - 2015-04-27 11:52:56 UTC  |  Edited by: GankYou
Teckos Pech wrote:
GankYou wrote:
marly cortez wrote:
Gave up on mining in December, un-subbed ten accounts and trashed the equipment due to CCP's ham fisted nerf's.


You mean, ISBoxer ban, darling?

Don't be hurt. Sad

See what happens when bots run wild on the Eve server Serenity - https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4990317

Only the bots and people who sell their PLEX, or RMT to do PvP are left in the game, no human is seen doing any PvE, and everything is 3-10x times more expensive.

Incidentally, that thread was posted on Sept of 2014, and let run to 6 pages. Smile


Yes, the ISBoxer ban (well the limited ban that is).

Don't try using logic with the overly emotional it rarely works.


Bots can not deny the most Holy Logic algorithms, it is against their nature - they just shut down. Blink

On-topic: Lowend prices have turned lower on fundamental news of nullsecks ore changes, after the expected ramp shortly after the ISBoxer ban in November - https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5698547#post5698547

That didn't last long. P

Some butthurt denizens were prophesying 300 mil Tech 1 cruisers and 3bn ISK Tengu after the November policy shift.

Oh well vOv
Mario Putzo
#710 - 2015-04-28 04:25:38 UTC
Good luck in market PVP tomorrow and the weeks to come everyone!
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Singularity Expedition Services
Singularity Syndicate
#711 - 2015-04-28 04:48:10 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:
Good luck in market PVP tomorrow and the weeks to come everyone!


It may well be a WTF??? moment when I get back from holiday and hit the market for the first time!
Alavaria Fera
Imperial Shipment
#712 - 2015-04-28 05:46:59 UTC
Falin Whalen wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
marly cortez wrote:
Gave up on mining in December, un-subbed ten accounts and trashed the equipment due to CCP's ham fisted nerf's.

Nothing here entices me to consider mining as a profession again, Tinkering with Ore contents which were never the real issues with mining in the first place will not solve the problems as pointed out by Our Anzac member.

'FozzieSov' and his 'Tosser' units will in my view seal the fate of Null Sec mining anyway as there will be so few players in Null Sec doing anything interesting except 'Griefing' each other his plans to turn EVE into one gigantic Jita 4-4 undock scenario will result in only one end, Players will own nothing, build nothing and plan nothing in Null Sec so not much point in mining out there.

Happy now to just run two toons ratting, make double plus the ISK and not have the bother of running a mining fleet at all while I watch these fools trash the game for hundreds of players.

Way to Go Fozzie, LoSec born and bred. Roll

Don't worry.

Once the ihubs get trashed your ratting income will fall off a cliff

Or perhaps another anom nerf, thanks to all the people bragging about their ratting


Don't forget that the IHubs also have the industrial upgrades too, and most null systems don't spawn the ABCM ores in the normal belts.

Yay, Fozziesov! Pirate

A single mining ihub goes a long way. plus it has a bunch of barges in the system

you don't see that with ratters, something something density

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Delt0r Garsk
Shits N Giggles
#713 - 2015-04-28 07:19:37 UTC
If no one is mining where are all the new ships coming from? people are welping ships all the time. Even titans. You can't plex the materials you need to build these things. Someone, somewhere is mining. Mining a *lot*.

Even though i am not yet a bittervet, overall prices for a lot of things have come down a *lot* since i have been here.

Oh and we see mining in nullsec all the time. However the millisecond that a non blue turns up in local they doc up/pos up.

AKA the scientist.

Death and Glory!

Well fun is also good.

Ser Owen
SKUNKWORKZ HEAVY INDUSTRY
The-Company
#714 - 2015-04-28 08:07:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Ser Owen
Not saying I am pleased or displeased at the increased use of zydrine or megacyte. The market will sort that out. It's just, I get to redo my spreadsheets all over again, again... ffs.
Lord Nighthawk
Destructive Influence
Northern Coalition.
#715 - 2015-04-28 08:55:38 UTC
fix the refining soon ???
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Reckless Contingency.
#716 - 2015-04-28 09:56:19 UTC
Lord Nighthawk wrote:
fix the refining soon ???

whats to fix about the refining? its perfectly fine as it is
Anthar Thebess
#717 - 2015-04-28 11:27:03 UTC
Ncc 1709 wrote:
Lord Nighthawk wrote:
fix the refining soon ???

whats to fix about the refining? its perfectly fine as it is

Alchemy reactions.
You get stuff you cannot reprocess on pos array.
Lakotnik
TSOE Po1ice
TSOE Consortium
#718 - 2015-04-28 12:05:12 UTC
Why are the rocks so small and so far apart in belts after the patch?

Aurumfault Shiptoaster
Blood Oath Foundation
#719 - 2015-04-28 12:52:47 UTC
Lakotnik wrote:
Why are the rocks so small and so far apart in belts after the patch?




It's visually disappointing isn't it? Everything that should be there is there, but it's so empty. If you're on an overview tab without asteroids you can't even tell you've arrived.

All the high unit count rocks are gone (because most of those were high sec ores).

Rock size ought to scale with the total volume of their ores, instead of the number of units. That way a 1000 unit mercoxit rock would be 400 times the size of a 1000 unit veldspar rock, instead of the current identical size.

They should also scale their diameter to cube root (a rock with 8 times the volume should have only 2 times the diameter) rather than the current (apparently) linear scaling.
Lakotnik
TSOE Po1ice
TSOE Consortium
#720 - 2015-04-28 13:38:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Lakotnik
Aurumfault Shiptoaster wrote:
Lakotnik wrote:
Why are the rocks so small and so far apart in belts after the patch?




It's visually disappointing isn't it? Everything that should be there is there, but it's so empty. If you're on an overview tab without asteroids you can't even tell you've arrived.

All the high unit count rocks are gone (because most of those were high sec ores).

Rock size ought to scale with the total volume of their ores, instead of the number of units. That way a 1000 unit mercoxit rock would be 400 times the size of a 1000 unit veldspar rock, instead of the current identical size.

They should also scale their diameter to cube root (a rock with 8 times the volume should have only 2 times the diameter) rather than the current (apparently) linear scaling.


QFT.

The sizes of rocks is way too small. It's even smaller than high-sec ores, even though the volume is larger.

And I'd prefer if some rocks were high-unit count, I loved mining Crokite in Enormous for 4 hours straight, without having to re-target or move my Hulks.