Intergalactic Summit

Trying to use logic with the Statists is rather impossible, unfortunately....

So Okkamon is _JUST NOW_ being declared a warzone.

I... I...

Actually, nevermind.

'The thread is not taking full consideration the various reasons a document like this might be released', was really my only point.

I'm a paramilitary officer at best, and have virtually no training with arms at all, for example (except the minimum required during Capsuleer training and such, which for me was hilariously little from what I understand of some systems), but we both have some experience with operations, so though it seems this sort of thing is obvious, it can't be assumed it's obvious to everyone I suppose. I'm still surprised to see such a confused reaction to this - and perhaps that's simply not fair.

Still, a publicly published Operation should be viewed with a grain of salt and some inquiry as to why it was published. This wasn't a "leak" and that in itself is something to be concerned about for all parties. It's a little disappointing the discussion got so frazzled so quickly when we are all policy makers to some degree here as Capsuleers. This wasn't, however, aimed at anyone in particular.

I had some concern for the thread itself, and I addressed it in hopes that its contents would be taken in several new ways by the more generous among us. You may direct your anger at my fellows that are somewhat more willing to shout about 'freedom' and liberation for Caldari - or whoever else - but I for one, will step aside of that. There are more reasons to be out here than simple hatred or dogma.


For the record, it doesn't affect me one way or the other if you mock Gen. Soter for what he has or has not done. It is as much your job to elaborate discreditations of his character as it is his job to make operations sound particularly important. (But I might as well put forward that I have not so far seen him do this cloaking tactic myself for what little that is worth, so it doesn't appear to be a standard procedure. --Though it is amusing to imagine that perhaps he was being primaried so quickly off the field that this has been used. I'm somewhat curious as to when this was for archival reasons.).

His work will speak for itself, or it won't - Just as it is with the rest of us. We are all equals in a certain sense. You might find my disinterest at odds with my position, but I think it's the long and short of it. Ultimately, I'm not a soldier, so I feel no particular compunction to defend my superiors' characters beyond what I personally understand to be true, just out of decency. Contention, however, is valuable information.


That said, it was not in our plans at any time to attempt to win the race started by a suspicious Tukoss message. We were more interested in developing doctrines around what came out, and very few of us care what the administration wants us to do. It's very likely that Federals that did collect those items for him gave them to that fifth party that I hear rumour about. But I don't think our 'failure' has to do with a lack of national conviction or the State is in a worse position than I assume - We should both simply applaud ourselves for not getting caught up in a race that was entirely a status symbol and ultimately surely serves some nefarious future incident I have no imagination for. Between us, we have an eye for what is a gaudy show. All our governments' R&D have really done is given us flavours of T3 toys to continue all this with. People will just use which ever one they like best regardless of the order. The Amarr didn't have an ahead for even a day with markets the way they are. It's a little bit ridiculous to think about.

One more fact remains, I was clearly short-tempered the other day and snipped in my post. Given the short patience understandable around here, I should have held my tongue better and I apologize - it was a needless addendum to the discussion, and the sort of thing that frequently derails perfectly good subjects.

...

Ookaay?

Say your plans go through. Say that the State militia fails to hold the system from your barbarous assault. What effect do you believe that would have on the release of the Jackdaw to the general Capsuleer population? Do you believe that driving people out of their homes will cause anything besides more ire and higher enlistment rates in the Protectorate? This is not some world in the middle of the warzone, this is a border world that has a large population of working people, families. Forcing them from their livelihoods when they've just recently returned is cruel.

I wouldn't expect much besides this from the bloodthirsty Federate militia.

Black Rise was owned by the Caldari first. Back during the closing days of YC 110, the Federation lost all of the support it may have once had in the colonies and on the homeworlds of the people in the Rise when it enacted it's scorched earth policy after being forced from the area by the Caldari Navy.

Don't expect a warm welcome, neither by the Protectorate, nor the civilians.

Ikiryo, you missed the profound announcements with trumpets and drums for Group A, and that Group B is insulting Group A for the trumpets and drums.

Oh, certainly not, Vero. Soter is far better than most of us at grand pronouncements.

I appreciate your response, as so far it is one of the few that addresses long term impact of continued hostilities. The question of what we mean to accomplish with this campaign is part of the larger question of why we continue to fight this war at all. Your description of the precarious economic stability of the Okkamon system, and Vikarion's earlier points that the State's economy has recovered over the years of war from its previous malaise, illustrate the danger of the current status quo.

The State is content to see this war drag on, when they should be urgently negotiating its settlement.

Caldari capsuleers set up lucrative resource extraction operations on these "border worlds" and think themselves safe. The "Pendulum War" becomes another datapoint in their profit and loss calculus.

The State itself profits by the illusion that life goes on as normal for its civillian "working people," and "families." They do as all State Citizens do, and devote themselves single mindedly to the greater corporate good, and forget the cost of war.

Well, it is time they remembered. "Bloodthirsty," as you say we are, we aren't waging a Total War against Caldari baseline populations. Nor are we violating the restrictions CONCORD has placed on Capsuleer Militias. Our alliance has long conducted successful commerce interdiction and orbital asset seizure operations throughout the warzone. Now we intend to give the CEP a taste of the focused economic damage that can be inflicted while they refuse to consider an honorable peace.

State scientists will finish their development of the Jackdaw, but that will not shield Okkamon from our retaliation.



Thanks, but no thanks, Pieter. Between your "suggestion" and Evi's "benefit of the doubt," lets drop the pretense that ya'll are pushing anything but your own spin.

I've done the textbook thing. Hell, my operation to retake Ladistier was as by the book as they get. Squid Spin, yours included, on that one was similarly along the lines of "Grr, GalMil. Pendulum! Something something pants." So don't be coy. You're bad at it.

In other words, you heard news as someone did something in system X, so you decided to go pirating in system Y.
I got your "reasoning", Vero. The more I understand you gallenteans, the more I despise beings like you.