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Kiting is not cancer...

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wilgotna
Perkone
Caldari State
#61 - 2015-04-26 04:19:49 UTC  |  Edited by: wilgotna
crosi talking to you always feels like talking to a child

heres the difference between my post and your post

me:
crosi is a nerd (hilarious comment completely unrelated to the bulk of my post meant solely for my own amusement)

criticism of garmur which is related to the thread (this is the main point of my post)

crosi:
wow you are mad lol so hostile (this is you completely missing the point of my post while simultaneously trying to sound like an intellectual but in reality you just come off as stupid)

as for my rifter example, once again you completely miss the point

i made a hypothetical situation to analogize the creation of the garmur/t3 dessies to the HYPOTHETICAL creation of a super-rifter

this has NOTHING to do with how the rifter was eventually "balanced"


edit: however if you'd like we can compare and contrast the ways in which these two situations were handled

rifter is overpowered: buff all the other ships in its class (ok sounds good)

kiting ship supremacy: lets create even stronger kiting ships (funny because its so ********)
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#62 - 2015-04-26 04:46:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Crosi Wesdo
wilgotna wrote:
crosi talking to you always feels like talking to a child

heres the difference between my post and your post

me:
crosi is a nerd (hilarious comment completely unrelated to the bulk of my post meant solely for my own amusement)

criticism of garmur which is related to the thread (this is the main point of my post)

crosi:
wow you are mad lol so hostile (this is you completely missing the point of my post while simultaneously trying to sound like an intellectual but in reality you just come off as stupid)

as for my rifter example, once again you completely miss the point

i made a hypothetical situation to analogize the creation of the garmur/t3 dessies to the HYPOTHETICAL creation of a super-rifter

this has NOTHING to do with how the rifter was eventually "balanced"


edit: however if you'd like we can compare and contrast the ways in which these two situations were handled

rifter is overpowered: buff all the other ships in its class (ok sounds good)

kiting ship supremacy: lets create even stronger kiting ships (funny because its so ********)



Its more like;

You 'haha, you mastubate and i dont. And eve is really upsetting me becase some ships are better at some things than others'

Me 'you seem to be very focussed on my mastubatorial habits, i wonder why? And some ships are supposed to be better at some things than others.

Rifter is a much better brawler than my garmur for example, should we nerf the rifter of buff my garmur? I personally think that players should use skill to get into the stuations that their ship is suited for.

As for kiting being supreme, ask any decent dram pilot what they think of that notion.
wilgotna
Perkone
Caldari State
#63 - 2015-04-26 04:59:19 UTC
i swear to god crosi i cant tell if you really are this dumb or youre trolling the pants off of my head

"As for kiting being supreme, ask any decent dram pilot what they think of that notion."

okay so one ship can counter the condor/hookbill
that was maybe decent back before the garmur existed. but still rather stupid that people had to bring out an expensive pirate frigate in order to counter a 10 mil fit condor...

now that the garmur is in play a dram cant do ****. defensive scram completely shuts down a dram

lets look at the other supposed mongoloid counters you spat out

Sentinel, reduces margin for error to minimal levels.
lol wtf is a sentinel gonna do to a garmur?

Cruor, reduces margin for error.
once again wtf is a cruor gonna do?

Hyena, reduces margin for error.
....are you being serious?

Dramiel, faster, tankier and more dps.
nope defensive scram

Multiple sniper corms or area denial coercers.
so the solution is to blob?

Element of surprise with an OH dual overdrive derptron gets a lot of people garmur kills.
nope defensive scram
Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#64 - 2015-04-26 05:02:56 UTC
Plato Forko wrote:
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
Because the Worm and Garmur go from really good without links to god mode with them. I don't think we need god mode rewards for bittervets. A ship that punches out 130 DPS with light missiles at 70k with a point at the same range and can hold orbit at 8k m/s is too much. Likewise a linked snaked worm can probably top 6k cold with 200 DPS drones each having the EHP of an interceptor. Having spent a huge amount of time playing this game should not entitle you to a win button. The cumulative advantage in SP, assets, and experience is enough.


eh, Worm's not really that unreasonable, I've seen solo kills by dessies and plenty of 2-3 man gangs can take them down. I think hot drone DPS is a recipe for overconfidence and the hull ranks under the Hawk in terms of tank potential so those factors naturally increase risk.

Garmur is a whole new ship though, maybe threads like this will emphasize the need to tweak it. It would be nice if it got a speed nerf to bring it in line with Caldari combat frigs. Hardly seems fair to give a ship all the best aspects of both a combat frig and also an attack frig. With the slot layout it already has, a speed buff would still keep it at better stats than the Hookbill, that should be enough to balance it with the rest of the pirate frigs.


I assume you're talking about brawl worms. I didn't realize those existed.

Kite worm is too fast, I have one I use with galmil frigate fleets sometimes that with links does 4600 m/s cold. That is with only 5-10% in speed implants. It's not nearly as bad as the garmur though. 70k point on a frigate that can send 130 dps out to the edge of that envelope seems excessive.

I'm sure if I had played longer and had invested in a booster alt and a super shiny pod I would also enjoy having a godmode ship, but meh.
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#65 - 2015-04-26 05:14:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Crosi Wesdo
atron can easily counter kite condor, same with the comet and kite hb. Both atron and comet are faster than their counterparts.

My hyena webs out to garmur point range, ive killed quite a few garmurs with initial point from an atron. Sentinel can be fit to be quite fast and a slight error on the garmurs part leaves it with quite a problem. And fthough it may take multip[le targets to kill a garmur in some of these cases, eve is a multiplayer game after al.

The way you post, its ike no garmur has ever died lol. And lots of garmurs dont even opt for the defensive scram.

Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
It's not nearly as bad as the garmur though. 70k point on a frigate that can send 130 dps out to the edge of that envelope seems excessive.

I'm sure if I had played longer and had invested in a booster alt and a super shiny pod I would also enjoy having a godmode ship, but meh.


Lets not forget, that republic fleet point likely costs twice as much as your entire worm.
wilgotna
Perkone
Caldari State
#66 - 2015-04-26 05:25:19 UTC
ive killed countless garmurs by being the initial point/scram with a ceptor, which then was followed with a blob

doesnt mean the ship is balanced

if you even bothered to read any of the posts you respond to you would see that my contention is not that garmurs are invincible;
my contention is that garmurs (and orthrus and t3 dessies for that matter) are conceptually flawed. anti-fun. blob-encouraging. damaging to the solo/smallgang meta.

they shouldnt exist. they take a problem (the kiting supremacy) and exacerbate it.
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#67 - 2015-04-26 05:29:15 UTC
wilgotna wrote:
ive killed countless garmurs by being the initial point/scram with a ceptor, which then was followed with a blob

doesnt mean the ship is balanced

if you even bothered to read any of the posts you respond to you would see that my contention is not that garmurs are invincible;
my contention is that garmurs (and orthrus and t3 dessies for that matter) are conceptually flawed. anti-fun. blob-encouraging. damaging to the solo/smallgang meta.

they shouldnt exist. they take a problem (the kiting supremacy) and exacerbate it.


I have read your posts. As i have said, they boil down to 'haha. You mastubate. I dont. And eve is not fair because there is more than one type of ship'.

More shiny ships in space is a good thing.
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#68 - 2015-04-26 05:46:24 UTC
Confirming I mastubate.
Corail Amber
Losing All Hope Was Freedom
#69 - 2015-04-26 06:21:47 UTC
Links are the problem, not kiting.

And because links emphasizes so much with Garmur bonuses (cumulative point/scramble bonuses, no need to worry about ******* up your own tracking by going too fast, already high base speed going through the roof) a linked Garmur is literally nothing else but an incentive to blob. In that way I agree with wilgotna.

However you take away the links with a Garmur and suddenly marging of error becomes thin, because even with a defensive scram it is very possible to get caught.
Dreaded Vengance
The Congregation
RAPID HEAVY ROPERS
#70 - 2015-04-26 09:11:44 UTC
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Confirming I mastubate.


Eyes closed, thinking about Garmurs?
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#71 - 2015-04-26 13:52:18 UTC
Dreaded Vengance wrote:
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Confirming I mastubate.


Eyes closed, thinking about Garmurs?


Thinking about Crosi in Garmurs. Shocked
Yuri Antollare
Moira.
#72 - 2015-04-27 05:20:58 UTC
Garmur without links, balanced.

Garmur with links, broken.

All else being equal, nothing, bar cruisers and up, will solo a linked garmur.
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#73 - 2015-04-27 09:28:42 UTC
Yuri Antollare wrote:

All else being equal, nothing, bar cruisers and up, will solo a linked garmur.


lolno
Yuri Antollare
Moira.
#74 - 2015-04-27 17:10:55 UTC
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Yuri Antollare wrote:

All else being equal, nothing, bar cruisers and up, will solo a linked garmur.


lolno


This is a little stifled with no example.
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#75 - 2015-04-27 18:59:31 UTC
Yuri Antollare wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Yuri Antollare wrote:

All else being equal, nothing, bar cruisers and up, will solo a linked garmur.


lolno


This is a little stifled with no example.


Which is better than just being wrong.
Dread Operative
Lowlife.
Snuffed Out
#76 - 2015-04-28 00:41:20 UTC
"Your lame way of playing is lamer then my lame way of playing." - Dread Operative for CSM
Plato Forko
123 Fake Street
#77 - 2015-04-28 00:52:18 UTC
Yuri Antollare wrote:
Garmur without links, balanced.

Garmur with links and 200m in faction mods and 500m+ in implants, broken.

All else being equal, nothing, bar cruisers and up, will solo a linked garmur.


FTFY, because why stop at links and still run the slight risk that your 100m frigate might get blapped when you can go APESHIT and GUARANTEE no risk!
wilgotna
Perkone
Caldari State
#78 - 2015-04-28 00:59:17 UTC
crosi trolls so hard i dunno why hes not permabanned from this forum

he just blurts out his worthless opinion, then trolls anyone who disagrees with him by acting condescending and/or constantly straw manning their arguments

linked/snaked garmur's only real counter is ANOTHER linked/snaked garmur (and then its whichever one has the better fit for 1v1 smashing eachother) OR a linked/snaked ceptor with a blob for backup

to crosi: when you lose garmurs to atrons and other stupid **** it's not because the garmur has counters. its because youre a bad pilot who only flies the most risk-averse ships with a 3bil+ pod and a loki boosting you at all times
Dread Operative
Lowlife.
Snuffed Out
#79 - 2015-04-28 02:28:00 UTC
wilgotna wrote:
a loki boosting you at all times


He doesn't use a Loki all the time, sometimes it's a Proteus. Jeez get your facts straight.
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#80 - 2015-04-28 07:28:53 UTC
Dread Operative wrote:
wilgotna wrote:
a loki boosting you at all times


He doesn't use a Loki all the time, sometimes it's a Proteus. Jeez get your facts straight.


I actually never use a loki.

And well done wil, you managed to get super angry at someones opinion WITHOUT commenting on their masturbatorial habits. I think we have turned a corner!