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Desires of the New Order

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Kalissa Ropol
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2015-04-06 19:15:29 UTC
So there I was minding my own business happily strip mining an asteroid in High Sec when all of a sudden a member of CODE attempts to gank my ship. He failed, I scooped his loot and continued on my merry way mining – not totally unphased.

I knew of CODE from some of the threads James315 has started and from seeing them mentioned in the past; however, I never had the honor of being attacked before. With my new found attention I read up what I could find on CODE mostly from the Minningbumping site and through the links provided there. Besides being out of date I am curious about something.

I cannot admit to having read 100% of what is out there or retaining 100% of what I read, but I don’t recall seeing anywhere in the manifestos from James315 what he wants Highsec to be like. Sure there is a healthy ability to talk a lot, and hate on miners but what is it that CODE desires Highsec to be like?

High Sec is pretty much the carebears arena and besides setting the world on fire I have never read anything which proves how they want it to function at all – other than no one should PvE there.
Jenshae Chiroptera
#2 - 2015-04-06 19:23:05 UTC
It is a cult with some popular ideas that they can repeat in chants.
You will have them in here soon talking like those pests, that knock on your door on a Sunday morning, soon.
The Order is their divine text full of logical holes but pushed on everyone that gives them the time of day.

There is no logic to a cult.
Relax and ignore them like most everyone else does.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2015-04-06 19:28:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Rowells
Eve Solecist
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
#4 - 2015-04-06 19:31:42 UTC
FINALLY A CODE THREAD AGAIN !!
  • All incoming connection attempts are being blocked. If you want to speak to me you will find me either in Hek local, you can create a contract or make a thread about it in General Discussions. I will call you back. -
Eve Solecist
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
#5 - 2015-04-06 19:33:52 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
It is a cult with some popular ideas that they can repeat in chants.
You will have them in here soon talking like those pests, that knock on your door on a Sunday morning, soon.
The Order is their divine text full of logical holes but pushed on everyone that gives them the time of day.

There is no logic to a cult.
Relax and ignore them like most everyone else does.

You are talking about yourself... which is quite funny.
You do that often, actually.

You see things in others, which can be attributed to yourself.
I admit I failed to make a list, mostly because it's not worth it.

In any way... it's called Projection (psychology).

You might want to look it up,
but better walk over Dunning and Krueger who will do their best to stop you.
  • All incoming connection attempts are being blocked. If you want to speak to me you will find me either in Hek local, you can create a contract or make a thread about it in General Discussions. I will call you back. -
Ned Thomas
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2015-04-06 19:35:44 UTC
Eve Solecist wrote:
FINALLY A CODE THREAD AGAIN !!


I was starting to get worried.
Kalissa Ropol
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2015-04-06 19:36:20 UTC
I don’t necessarily have anything negative to say about them ganking what looks like a valid bot. It is when you carry that attitude to all people in high sec are helping bots by allowing bots to hide in plain sight I think they have lost their way.

Why not just admit that they are a high sec suicide squad there to cause mayhem, because that is what they currently do according to their killboard. Based on what I have read on the site my alt wasn’t even offered an opportunity to pay the 10 mill a year. So low I presume it’s a joke and a scam for those stupid enough to pay it.
Eve Solecist
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
#8 - 2015-04-06 19:43:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Eve Solecist
Kalissa Ropol wrote:
I don’t necessarily have anything negative to say about them ganking what looks like a valid bot. It is when you carry that attitude to all people in high sec are helping bots by allowing bots to hide in plain sight I think they have lost their way.

Why not just admit that they are a high sec suicide squad there to cause mayhem, because that is what they currently do according to their killboard. Based on what I have read on the site my alt wasn’t even offered an opportunity to pay the 10 mill a year. So low I presume it’s a joke and a scam for those stupid enough to pay it.

It's a game.
Do you understand that?
If yes, do you understand that in a game there is kind of a point to play
followers of a cult, when the game allows you to do so for fun?

Just checking if you are one of those wackos who can't seperate game from RL ......


And the fee exists because GMs demanded it.
There is a thread about bumping in C&P.

It boils down to James back in 2012 petitioning bumping miners
and after long talks it was considered that, as long as the miner has a way
out of it (ie paying money) then it's fine. If not, and if he just keeps getting bumped
without a way of getting away, then it's harassment.

You can read up on it yourself, it's out there somewhere.
  • All incoming connection attempts are being blocked. If you want to speak to me you will find me either in Hek local, you can create a contract or make a thread about it in General Discussions. I will call you back. -
Vic Jefferson
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#9 - 2015-04-06 19:49:41 UTC
Content creators follow the population density.

Vote Vic Jefferson for CSM X.....XI.....XII?
Kalissa Ropol
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2015-04-06 19:51:58 UTC
Eve Solecist wrote:
Kalissa Ropol wrote:
I don’t necessarily have anything negative to say about them ganking what looks like a valid bot. It is when you carry that attitude to all people in high sec are helping bots by allowing bots to hide in plain sight I think they have lost their way.

Why not just admit that they are a high sec suicide squad there to cause mayhem, because that is what they currently do according to their killboard. Based on what I have read on the site my alt wasn’t even offered an opportunity to pay the 10 mill a year. So low I presume it’s a joke and a scam for those stupid enough to pay it.

It's a game.
Do you understand that?
If yes, do you understand that in a game there is kind of a point to play
followers of a cult, when the game allows you to do so for fun?

Just checking if you are one of those wackos who can't seperate game from RL ......


And the fee exists because GMs demanded it.
There is a thread about bumping in C&P.


Not sure why you are quoting me here as I am not opposed to CODEs originally stated goal - I think it is a very valiant position to take. I do take issue with how the mandate has grown such that the original vision of CODE no longer applies. But as the Code says it is a living document and subject to change.

I believe we all know that EVE is a game and everyone is able to play how they want in the sandbox. I never said that CODE should not do what pleases it. You have to have fun. The argument these threads normally get to is that their fun is wrecking my fun - which is a valid statement.

How is real life applicable to anything in EVE? Why bring this up?

So if someone pays 10 mil to CODE, is there some database you enter the name in and you cant be ganked anymore? Is that even a realistic thing that would be recognized by the GM? Is there some link to prove this statement?

I'm not complaining about bumping or being ganked. I am simply asking to what end does the CODE serve other than to justify to their selves ganking people.
Jade Blackwind
#11 - 2015-04-06 19:55:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Jade Blackwind
Kalissa Ropol wrote:
what is it that CODE desires Highsec to be like?
I think they want it removed.
Eve Solecist
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
#12 - 2015-04-06 19:59:05 UTC
Well ... many who complain, so far nothing you have done,
seem to be incapable of seperating the game from RL.

I'm not sure I understand the reason for our questions.

Having a mining permit does not prevent you from getting ganked.
CODE aren't the only gankers out there.

They also do not need justification.
It is NOT justification. See, that's why I asked...... it's a game.

A game about blowing up spaceships.
People who blow up your spaceship for no reason are perfectly fine to do so.

The CODE simply is a thing that basically started from shooting afk people,
combined with shooting miners who are afk most of the time in untanked ships.

Which is stupid, because that get's you killed. Rightfully so.


Long story.......... in detail, it's actually a really good one though.
  • All incoming connection attempts are being blocked. If you want to speak to me you will find me either in Hek local, you can create a contract or make a thread about it in General Discussions. I will call you back. -
Paranoid Loyd
#13 - 2015-04-06 20:00:14 UTC
If you truly understand it is just a game, then questioning their stated goals would quite obviously be idiotic. Methinks you don't understand it's just a game.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Eve Solecist
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
#14 - 2015-04-06 20:02:35 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
If you truly understand it is just a game, then questioning their stated goals would quite obviously be idiotic. Methinks you don't understand it's just a game.


I agree ... and there is an undertone ...
... but why can't we at least try ...............
  • All incoming connection attempts are being blocked. If you want to speak to me you will find me either in Hek local, you can create a contract or make a thread about it in General Discussions. I will call you back. -
Jenshae Chiroptera
#15 - 2015-04-06 20:03:40 UTC
Eve Solecist wrote:
In any way... it's called Projection (psychology).
You might want to look it up,
but better walk over Dunning and Krueger who will do their best to stop you.
... and it is here that you see a troll in their natural habitat, spouting off pseudo psychology that they have learned from Wikipedia and other trolls.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Salah ad-Din al-Jawahiri
Dreamweb Industries
Novus Ordo.
#16 - 2015-04-06 20:04:04 UTC
Hi, Kalissa.

I won't vouch for the rest of the team, but, personally, I chose this organization to work with because it gives me a very convenient schedule with no CTAs and other obligations so common in nullsec alliances and a unique kind of gameplay that cannot be found in any other region in EVE.

I've written about it in the past, so I will make a reference to a post in a different thread, but, to sum it up, the well-known barriers against aggression in highsec create the environment optimal for piracy in its traditional meaning, involving expectation of safety on behalf of the victim and the readiness of the criminal to exploit it while using the loopholes in the security system.

As for miner ganking, I've come to seeing it as a nice little metagame, just like Providence freeports or Gevlon's anti-Goon crusade. It creates conflict, and conflict is good for business.

The purpose of the New Order as a whole is to provide a counterbalance against the demands of die-hard carebears to turn highsec into a safezone, the likes of which are common in other MMOs. If EVE is ever to have a safezone, it must have no asteroids to mine, no missions to do, and no stations to trade in, since the risk/reward ratio is what keeps the system running.

Agent of the New Order

Live by the Code - die by the Code.

The Voice of Highsec
Kalissa Ropol
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2015-04-06 20:06:00 UTC
Eve Solecist wrote:
Well ... many who complain, so far nothing you have done,
seem to be incapable of seperating the game from RL.

I'm not sure I understand the reason for our questions.

Having a mining permit does not prevent you from getting ganked.
CODE aren't the only gankers out there.

They also do not need justification.
It is NOT justification. See, that's why I asked...... it's a game.

A game about blowing up spaceships.
People who blow up your spaceship for no reason are perfectly fine to do so.

The CODE simply is a thing that basically started from shooting afk people,
combined with shooting miners who are afk most of the time in untanked ships.

Which is stupid, because that get's you killed. Rightfully so.


Long story.......... in detail, it's actually a really good one though.


So the quick answer is, Code is all fake anyway and has no affect on how CODE actually behaves. So why even have it? Is it for RP reasons then, and if so why did a GM require the 10 mil payment.

I am just asking questions based on your comments. I take no position which matters and you are free to carry on doing as you are doing. I am just interested in how it all works.
Eve Solecist
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
#18 - 2015-04-06 20:10:38 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Eve Solecist wrote:
In any way... it's called Projection (psychology).
You might want to look it up,
but better walk over Dunning and Krueger who will do their best to stop you.
... and it is here that you see a troll in their natural habitat, spouting off pseudo psychology that they have learned from Wikipedia and other trolls.

And here is a person incapable of doing anything else,
while completely ignoring all the batshit disconnected crap she is spreading herself.

Like... ignoring that she knows nothing about a topic,
while at the same time trying to make it look like she does.
And then it's the other person who doesn't.

Funny.

Anyhow... away from the troll and hater, back on topic.

  • All incoming connection attempts are being blocked. If you want to speak to me you will find me either in Hek local, you can create a contract or make a thread about it in General Discussions. I will call you back. -
Kalissa Ropol
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2015-04-06 20:12:42 UTC
Salah ad-Din al-Jawahiri wrote:
Hi, Kalissa.

I won't vouch for the rest of the team, but, personally, I chose this organization to work with because it gives me a very convenient schedule with no CTAs and other obligations so common in nullsec alliances and a unique kind of gameplay that cannot be found in any other region in EVE.

I've written about it in the past, so I will make a reference to a post in a different thread, but, to sum it up, the well-known barriers against aggression in highsec create the environment optimal for piracy in its traditional meaning, involving expectation of safety on behalf of the victim and the readiness of the criminal to exploit it while using the loopholes in the security system.

As for miner ganking, I've come to seeing it as a nice little metagame, just like Providence freeports or Gevlon's anti-Goon crusade. It creates conflict, and conflict is good for business.

The purpose of the New Order as a whole is to provide a counterbalance against the demands of die-hard carebears to turn highsec into a safezone, the likes of which are common in other MMOs. If EVE is ever to have a safezone, it must have no asteroids to mine, no missions to do, and no stations to trade in, since the risk/reward ratio is what keeps the system running.


Very excellent response and good post in the "Sad Sate of Empire Space". I don't agree with your stance personally, but that is me and for CCP to address if they choose to. My purpose here to just to learn more and maybe get educated on the Code. For your honest answer I appreciate it.

I wouldn't hazard a guess as to how someone would go about 'fixing' Highsec as that inst my question or my desire to learn. Im more curious on the Code - which you addressed a little at the end. To make Highsec less safe. I suppose the counter would be no mission runner PvE person is going to expose their bling knowing their ship could die - but I dont know why people run missions anyway.
Eve Solecist
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
#20 - 2015-04-06 20:16:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Eve Solecist
Kalissa Ropol wrote:
Eve Solecist wrote:
Well ... many who complain, so far nothing you have done,
seem to be incapable of seperating the game from RL.

I'm not sure I understand the reason for our questions.

Having a mining permit does not prevent you from getting ganked.
CODE aren't the only gankers out there.

They also do not need justification.
It is NOT justification. See, that's why I asked...... it's a game.

A game about blowing up spaceships.
People who blow up your spaceship for no reason are perfectly fine to do so.

The CODE simply is a thing that basically started from shooting afk people,
combined with shooting miners who are afk most of the time in untanked ships.

Which is stupid, because that get's you killed. Rightfully so.


Long story.......... in detail, it's actually a really good one though.


So the quick answer is, Code is all fake anyway and has no affect on how CODE actually behaves. So why even have it? Is it for RP reasons then, and if so why did a GM require the 10 mil payment.

I am just asking questions based on your comments. I take no position which matters and you are free to carry on doing as you are doing. I am just interested in how it all works.

There is no "fake".
It's a game!

The actual reason for the saviour thing was that it
helped recruiting back then, before the New Order got ... turned ... into CODE.

It's fun for many people to follow a leader. People like that. And it makes perfect sense
in a game like this. CODE has rather ... hmm .... disconnected RP, but it works.


In any sense it seems that "It's a game" a swers most of your questions.

The bigger one though seems to be: Why do you ask?
"Just curious" isn't an answer.


Also it's funny how you state "You are free doing what you are doing" ...
... it's not like you could stop anyone anyway. *snickers xD*
  • All incoming connection attempts are being blocked. If you want to speak to me you will find me either in Hek local, you can create a contract or make a thread about it in General Discussions. I will call you back. -
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