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So, what do you guys think about watch lists?

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Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#21 - 2015-03-31 19:53:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
Self destruct timer starts on your ship every time someone logs in/out on your watchlist without mutual confirmation...

(Actually a more serious suggestion under there).

(Watchlists are fine anyhow).

(Improved gameplay wise some kind of tactical option to login incognito (with the right balancing/potential counter mechanism) if you suspect someone is watching you - but something you wouldn't normally do if you didn't).
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#22 - 2015-03-31 20:16:25 UTC
As a corp cEO and former alliance head the watch list is invaluable if i am trying to get in touch withone to discuss politics or i need a director to do something or another alliance member and have no idea if they are on at the time.

The tool is important in managing of things. Should not be removed. I'm kinda ok with the ability to opt out, but honestly the tool doesn't give you much of an advantage.

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
Phoenix Jones
Small-Arms Fire
#23 - 2015-03-31 21:05:50 UTC
I put my thoughts in the thread linked below here.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5227161#post5227161

To summarize... Put a price on watch listing people for longer than a short term (no free three year watch list setups). You can do it, but it will cost you isk not to notify them.

Yaay!!!!
Proclus Diadochu
Mar Sarrim
Red Coat Conspiracy
#24 - 2015-03-31 21:07:40 UTC
B0T0 wrote:
Watch list is free intel, so should be removed

Local is free intel, so should be removed.

Leave watchlists be... They are fine. Bigger fish to fry, Chance.

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umnikar
Fishbone Industries
#25 - 2015-03-31 21:09:51 UTC
I used it myself as Intel and was not thinking about it any further, but tbh it's the same abuse as local chat for intel. Roll
It should be fixed.
Evan Roc
Awakened Ones
#26 - 2015-03-31 21:16:49 UTC
Watch lists are fine the way they are. They show both the hunted and hunter when the other in online, that's it. Many other factors involved before you consider them free intel. Now how about getting your head around the new structures and how they will be used in W space? That would be worthy of your time Chance.
scorchlikeshiswhiskey
Totally Abstract
O X I D E
#27 - 2015-03-31 21:22:28 UTC
Proclus Diadochu wrote:
B0T0 wrote:
Watch list is free intel, so should be removed

Local is free intel, so should be removed.

Leave watchlists be... They are fine. Bigger fish to fry, Chance.

Actually, local is even worse than watchlisting since local gives you a location as well as online/offline status whereas watchlists only give you the online/offline status and if you want a location, and happen to be in K-space, you have to use a locator or intel channel for location info.
Peter Moonlight
Suddenly Carebears
#28 - 2015-03-31 22:08:02 UTC
They are balanced and ok.
BayneNothos
United Electro-Magnetic Federation
Business Alliance of Manufacturers and Miners
#29 - 2015-03-31 23:11:23 UTC
Watchlists are fine, you still have to see the guy or start running intel checks to get that watchlist contact. It's part of the hunt. I would love being able to set a time on the contact, after which it deletes itself though.

What I'm more worried about is the CREST API stuff surrounding it. For those of you who poked around with

https://spreadsheetsin.space/year-in-review/

will have seen that it shows how many times OTHERS have added you as a contact. If this is available through the API for all, then things change. Being able to write a tool that'll notify you if someone else watchlists you will be a big change that I'm not sure would be in the best interest of all.

Good to see you throwing questions around though, keep it up.
Neckbeard Nolyfe
Zero Fun Allowed
xqtywiznalamywmodxfhhopawzpqyjdwrpeptuaenabjawdzku
#30 - 2015-03-31 23:14:58 UTC
Phoenix Jones wrote:
I put my thoughts in the thread linked below here.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5227161#post5227161

To summarize... Put a price on watch listing people for longer than a short term (no free three year watch list setups). You can do it, but it will cost you isk not to notify them.


¨Hi, I'm a random npc alt, and you have just got a notification that I have watchlisted you.¨

See where I'm going with this?

~lvl 60 paladin~
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
#31 - 2015-03-31 23:35:34 UTC
Watchlists are as charismatic as local channel in my view, I'd like to either see it gone or an option to not appear as online included.

Else I'm certain our watch lists are all sufficiently filled to make the notification sound a better topic for discussion. It's a bit to loud in my opinion, and the sound could be a bit softer.
Alundil
Rolled Out
#32 - 2015-04-01 00:00:10 UTC
BayneNothos wrote:
Watchlists are fine, you still have to see the guy or start running intel checks to get that watchlist contact. It's part of the hunt. I would love being able to set a time on the contact, after which it deletes itself though.

What I'm more worried about is the CREST API stuff surrounding it. For those of you who poked around with

https://spreadsheetsin.space/year-in-review/

will have seen that it shows how many times OTHERS have added you as a contact. If this is available through the API for all, then things change. Being able to write a tool that'll notify you if someone else watchlists you will be a big change that I'm not sure would be in the best interest of all.

Good to see you throwing questions around though, keep it up.

I don't recall that site displaying when someone added you to a watch list. Only that they have added you as a contact to set standings.

There are many many many pilots who I have listed as a contact for standings purposes who are not and would likely never be added to a watch list because I don't care when they are online. Only that I see standings indicators in the overview and local if I see them in kspace.

I'm right behind you
Alundil
Rolled Out
#33 - 2015-04-01 00:01:03 UTC
Neckbeard Nolyfe wrote:
Phoenix Jones wrote:
I put my thoughts in the thread linked below here.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5227161#post5227161

To summarize... Put a price on watch listing people for longer than a short term (no free three year watch list setups). You can do it, but it will cost you isk not to notify them.


¨Hi, I'm a random npc alt, and you have just got a notification that I have watchlisted you.¨

See where I'm going with this?

Which means exactly what in wspace?

I'm right behind you
Kynric
Sky Fighters
Rote Kapelle
#34 - 2015-04-01 00:11:28 UTC
I would like ship names and not pilot names to show on overview while we are ridding ourselves of free intel. (How is that for stirring the pot. )
Mike Azariah
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#35 - 2015-04-01 01:05:42 UTC
From over there to over here

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5605678#post5605678

Quote:
As it stands, nonconsensual watch listing provides way too much intelligence about enemy forces in a way that is extremely easy to read from the client's memory and output into an irc channel. Short of removing nonconsensual watchlisting, having a mechanism to blunt its effectiveness would be marvelous
.

If you are in game and someone comes on, you get the little notification. Fine (ish)

But if your watchers are out of game and can be pinged? One watcher automation calling all of an ambush fleet? Yeah, that is beginning to blur lines of ok and not ok

But then that thread is discussing watchlist jamming strictures, so you could 'opt out' if you had the correct infrastructure in place and were on your home turf

hmmmmm

m

Mike Azariah  ┬──┬ ¯|(ツ)/¯
Chance Ravinne
WiNGSPAN Delivery Services
WiNGSPAN Delivery Network
#36 - 2015-04-01 01:19:22 UTC
Also quick note it's just something my corpmates and I had talkd about before and i was curious about. Please don't take this as a "Chance thread means it's his evil secret agenda!"

You've just read another awesome post by Chance Ravinne, CEO of EVE's #1 torpedo delivery service. Watch our misadventures on my YouTube channel: WINGSPANTT
Paul Vashar
CTHS
#37 - 2015-04-01 01:26:56 UTC
Chance Ravinne wrote:
Also quick note it's just something my corpmates and I had talkd about before and i was curious about. Please don't take this as a "Chance thread means it's his evil secret agenda!"

Your portrait hints at a Tarp
scorchlikeshiswhiskey
Totally Abstract
O X I D E
#38 - 2015-04-01 01:38:58 UTC
Chance Ravinne wrote:
Also quick note it's just something my corpmates and I had talkd about before and i was curious about. Please don't take this as a "Chance thread means it's his evil secret agenda!"

That's just what you would say if it really were your evil secret agenda!!!
Saisin
Chao3's Rogue Operatives Corp
#39 - 2015-04-01 02:52:48 UTC
Chance Ravinne wrote:
I love watch lists as much as the next guy, but sometimes it feels overpowered as an intelligence source. Especially in w space where the lack of local adds to the mystery and shroud, but watch lists kind of undermine that. Any thoughts?


Watch list is a good tool amongst friends.

I am glad the CSM is looking into it, as I strongly believe every player should have an opt-out option, possibly set according to standings in-game.

The way it is I believe it can be seen as a breach of RL privacy: why would other players I do not know be able to know when I am logging in and logging out of the game? The new notification system makes it even easier to establish patterns. I am no lawyer but I feel CCP is exposing themselves to some legal actions, if someone with time and money decides to go that route....

Provide an option to opt-out of watch list or set it only for specific standings, and this is not an issue anymore.

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Witchway
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#40 - 2015-04-01 04:14:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Witchway
The amount of retardation in here is astounding.

Most of your points in here surround the fact that because player A and B can both watch list each other the mechanic is balanced. That's the equivalent of player A and B both being able to see each other in local, thus it is balanced. The problem there in lies with the fact that everyone of you hates that the defender can get such a massive advantage with the local mechanics but yet when you have a massive advantage such as being able to see your prey before he can see you from anywhere in New Eden, oh well that ****'s just good natured hard work and skill.

I guess we all just have to start adding all characters from all wormholes corps to our watch list and just pray none of them know how to use ooc alts. Roll

we all know it's not balanced. if you disagree with that point you're whacked out of your noodle.

Official Shit Talking Captain, Bastard of Hard Knocks Inc.