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Bye Bye AFK Cloaking

First post
Author
Nina Lowel
Echelon Research
Goonswarm Federation
#301 - 2015-04-01 17:13:14 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Yet here you are pushing for a 100% foolproof intel system that would mean pve players could avoid any attempt at pvp on them.
People already can avoid any attempt at PvP on them, often unsuccessfully. Even if AFK cloakers didn't exist, that would be no different. Again, what I'm pushing for is actively playing players, that's all. It's not a new concept.


You're pushing for actively playing players... by advocating for something that removes the one barrier to completely free afk ratting in nullsec.

Lol. You're advocating for naked, selfish self interest, exactly like in the ISBotter thread, be honest for once.



Hundreds and hundreds of people lose ships ratting/mining every day to people just roaming through with a ceptor scout. Stop with the bull, seriously.
Kenneth Endashi
Kor-Azor Slave Holdings
#302 - 2015-04-01 17:20:30 UTC
I was docked in a station
Where I thought I was safe,
Where oft I felt no hesitation.
What a magnificent place.

Meanwhile, outside, a tempest stirred.
Plus one in local, what could it be?
D-scan, nay, a pilot obscured.
That she was cloaked, I could plainly see.

Before this spectre occurred,
The system was pure.
Before distinctions were blurred,
Of that I was sure!

Now I sit in contempt and full fraught,
Hating that what I may never know.
Perhaps this game is worse than I thought.
Perhaps it is better AFK cloaking be not.
Dictateur Imperator
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#303 - 2015-04-01 17:20:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Dictateur Imperator
Why remove not aft cloacking, but cloacking immunity from the game.

A) "Afk cloacking" :

-Make moral harassment : just illegal in my country in real life, if i want i can go in justice against CCP if they don't kick a perma clocker who i can proof he make this to make moral harassment (read forum easy to have proof).
-No counter mesure
-Get pvp without tae any risk for pvp player, you can be aft or not attack when you want. You are risk free. ( and active pve player is NEVER risk free for exemple).

B) Normal cloacking:

-More strategical battle if your bomber wing must move and don't just wait 2 H in a point for an enemy fleet coming. More dynamic battle you know ?

C) More content:

- Kill clocker who don't move provide content. Don't play in a system because one people can't be kill and can kill you is just... destroying content.


D)Local issue:

- Local or not : You can't be decloack so people can know you ar here and can't kill you. You are just free risk. Let's do end this remove perma clocking, let people kill you. Risk VS reward : You want good kill mail ? Ok take more risk , for the moment you are risk free.
- AFK cloacking is counter mesure to perfect intel/risk free for pve/other argument like this : In 0.0 the people who attack have all advantage ; you have free intel by a lot of website about mining in system, farming in system so you know where it's active before go in this system. You have free intel about number of target when you enter on the system by local (so local is not only help for people who far, but for rammer to). In fact the true counter of perfect intel of the local is ... you have intel without be in the system you to with farming/mining information.



Conclusion: Nerf cloacking will create more content in the game. Remove perma clocking, and you create more strategical battle, more interesting things,ect...
Nina Lowel
Echelon Research
Goonswarm Federation
#304 - 2015-04-01 17:20:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Nina Lowel
baltec1 wrote:
Nina Lowel wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Yet here you are pushing for a 100% foolproof intel system that would mean pve players could avoid any attempt at pvp on them.
People already can avoid any attempt at PvP on them, often unsuccessfully. Even if AFK cloakers didn't exist, that would be no different. Again, what I'm pushing for is actively playing players, that's all. It's not a new concept.


You get the result you want by removing local.



So you want WH space? Then go to WH space.


If you want risk free pve go to highsec



You're so adorable! I'm not asking for "risk free pve" I'm asking for a way to hunt those who's only goal is to grief those while cloaked and AFK. If they are ACTIVE then the can avoid being found. That is what is being asked for. You on the other hand have some really weird concept of what people are asking for.

Hundreds and hundreds of ratters/miners die every day in null to things other than those who camp systems in cloakers and are AFK most of the time and come out once in a while. It's not fair to those who are in the wrong time zones for their alliance especially who can't expect help because so few are on to deal with AFK cloaking.

You may not be exposed to such issues because you're in a 30k pilot alliance and are blind to it so I forgive you for your complete and utter ignorance. It's natural for ignorant people to tell themselves "doesn't effect me so it doesn't need to change".
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#305 - 2015-04-01 17:42:49 UTC
Nina Lowel wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Yet here you are pushing for a 100% foolproof intel system that would mean pve players could avoid any attempt at pvp on them.
People already can avoid any attempt at PvP on them, often unsuccessfully. Even if AFK cloakers didn't exist, that would be no different. Again, what I'm pushing for is actively playing players, that's all. It's not a new concept.


You're pushing for actively playing players... by advocating for something that removes the one barrier to completely free afk ratting in nullsec.

Lol. You're advocating for naked, selfish self interest, exactly like in the ISBotter thread, be honest for once.



Hundreds and hundreds of people lose ships ratting/mining every day to people just roaming through with a ceptor scout. Stop with the bull, seriously.


Stupidity of afk ratters is not a valid argument.

you will never catch an aleart ratter thanks to the fact that you show up in local the second you enter the system.
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#306 - 2015-04-01 17:50:25 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Nina Lowel wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Yet here you are pushing for a 100% foolproof intel system that would mean pve players could avoid any attempt at pvp on them.
People already can avoid any attempt at PvP on them, often unsuccessfully. Even if AFK cloakers didn't exist, that would be no different. Again, what I'm pushing for is actively playing players, that's all. It's not a new concept.


You're pushing for actively playing players... by advocating for something that removes the one barrier to completely free afk ratting in nullsec.

Lol. You're advocating for naked, selfish self interest, exactly like in the ISBotter thread, be honest for once.



Hundreds and hundreds of people lose ships ratting/mining every day to people just roaming through with a ceptor scout. Stop with the bull, seriously.


Stupidity of afk ratters is not a valid argument.

you will never catch an aleart ratter thanks to the fact that you show up in local the second you enter the system.


Not true active ratters lose ships all the tine to hotdroppers that have been in system for long periods of time, pizza have very good success with it

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#307 - 2015-04-01 17:52:27 UTC
"removing a source of risk in nullsec without compensation is fine, because the afk people will still occasionally die to interceptors!"

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Nina Lowel
Echelon Research
Goonswarm Federation
#308 - 2015-04-01 17:52:47 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Nina Lowel wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Yet here you are pushing for a 100% foolproof intel system that would mean pve players could avoid any attempt at pvp on them.
People already can avoid any attempt at PvP on them, often unsuccessfully. Even if AFK cloakers didn't exist, that would be no different. Again, what I'm pushing for is actively playing players, that's all. It's not a new concept.


You're pushing for actively playing players... by advocating for something that removes the one barrier to completely free afk ratting in nullsec.

Lol. You're advocating for naked, selfish self interest, exactly like in the ISBotter thread, be honest for once.



Hundreds and hundreds of people lose ships ratting/mining every day to people just roaming through with a ceptor scout. Stop with the bull, seriously.


Stupidity of afk ratters is not a valid argument.

you will never catch an aleart ratter thanks to the fact that you show up in local the second you enter the system.



Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(
Nina Lowel
Echelon Research
Goonswarm Federation
#309 - 2015-04-01 17:55:23 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
"removing a source of risk in nullsec without compensation is fine, because the afk people will still occasionally die to interceptors!"



Hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of times a day = "occasionally" now.

You're so cute :)
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#310 - 2015-04-01 18:00:15 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:

Not true active ratters lose ships all the tine to hotdroppers that have been in system for long periods of time, pizza have very good success with it


Which would end when you remove the tool they use.
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#311 - 2015-04-01 18:02:04 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
"removing a source of risk in nullsec without compensation is fine, because the afk people will still occasionally die to interceptors!"


Your adding risk not removing it

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#312 - 2015-04-01 18:04:38 UTC
Nina Lowel wrote:



Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(


They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down.
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#313 - 2015-04-01 18:07:09 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Nina Lowel wrote:



Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(


They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down.


Shotgun ceptor fleets will land on grid before a capital manages to warp, and it happens all the time to mining barges

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Nina Lowel
Echelon Research
Goonswarm Federation
#314 - 2015-04-01 18:11:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Nina Lowel
baltec1 wrote:
Nina Lowel wrote:



Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(


They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down.



Then why do things other than captials also get tackled hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of times a day? Because they are "stupid"? Should that matter?

Yes, AFK people who are ratting die all the time, why shouldn't AFK cloakers also die all the time? You really enjoy shooting yourself in the foot don't you?
Dictateur Imperator
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#315 - 2015-04-01 18:12:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Dictateur Imperator
Just for information: Local remove rumor come from fuzzy interview , in the same interview he saids "no new structure, and never nerf cloaking".

So maybe local will stay.


To be continue about nerf of colloquy ship : No counter to cloac actually, after you have a counter. Just a normal change in a game.
Nina Lowel
Echelon Research
Goonswarm Federation
#316 - 2015-04-01 18:19:27 UTC
Dictateur Imperator wrote:
Just for information: Local remove rumor come from fuzzy interview , in the same interview he saids "no new structure, and never nerf cloaking".

So maybe local will stay.


To be continue about nerf of colloquy ship : No counter to cloac actually, after you have a counter. Just a normal change in a game.



He said cloaking will never be nerfed, not AFK'ing.
Dictateur Imperator
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#317 - 2015-04-01 18:21:29 UTC
Nina Lowel wrote:
Dictateur Imperator wrote:
Just for information: Local remove rumor come from fuzzy interview , in the same interview he saids "no new structure, and never nerf cloaking".

So maybe local will stay.


To be continue about nerf of colloquy ship : No counter to cloac actually, after you have a counter. Just a normal change in a game.



He said cloaking will never be nerfed, not AFK'ing.

He said no new structure to. In fact : all this interveiw is Fozie point of view, not CCP point of view. So maybe local never be removed in null (or maybe we have local with observatory).
In all case people can trap ship without aft clocking. They just must use brain.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#318 - 2015-04-01 19:14:05 UTC
Nina Lowel wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Nina Lowel wrote:



Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(


They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down.



Then why do things other than captials also get tackled hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of times a day? Because they are "stupid"? Should that matter?

Yes, AFK people who are ratting die all the time, why shouldn't AFK cloakers also die all the time? You really enjoy shooting yourself in the foot don't you?


Im fine with afk cloaking being nerfed, but to get that you have to deal with the imbalance it would cause. If you want afk cloaking gone you have to deal with losing your local intel tool. This is the exact same kind of argument we had with the people who wanted fittings on freighters. They also thought they would get nothing but a buff with their demand.
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#319 - 2015-04-01 19:27:52 UTC
baltec1 wrote:

Im fine with afk cloaking being nerfed, but to get that you have to deal with the imbalance it would cause. If you want afk cloaking gone you have to deal with losing your local intel tool.


No, you really don't have to lose local at all (though I'm fine with it, to be honest). That's just your drama queen mantra du jour.

Losing local is just one of many ways it could be balanced.

When all your posts are of the crying wolf variety, people just roll there eyes and ignore you. Except to post just to rile you up. Because lets face it, you're pretty funny when you go off the deep end like this.

Mr Epeen Cool
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#320 - 2015-04-01 19:46:33 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Nina Lowel wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Nina Lowel wrote:



Why, because you say it's not? LOL. A ceptor can tackle someone in just a few seconds upon entering a system, not everything can align and warp in those few seconds. It happens EVERY DAY, HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of times. I feel sorry for you IRL :(


They tacle afk ratters every day. You have more than enough time to get a capital out of the anom before they can finish d-scanning it down.



Then why do things other than captials also get tackled hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of times a day? Because they are "stupid"? Should that matter?

Yes, AFK people who are ratting die all the time, why shouldn't AFK cloakers also die all the time? You really enjoy shooting yourself in the foot don't you?


Im fine with afk cloaking being nerfed, but to get that you have to deal with the imbalance it would cause. If you want afk cloaking gone you have to deal with losing your local intel tool. This is the exact same kind of argument we had with the people who wanted fittings on freighters. They also thought they would get nothing but a buff with their demand.


Lose local and it causes a balance issue with cynos and recons being able to drop fleets, recons will make people 100% invisible without local and still have the power to drop massive dps fleets without anyone even knowing, you make null a stupid place to live unless you are selfsufficient with highsec alts for carebearing

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*